Thread: Do you need a fancy machine to anneal?

Originally Posted by Woody

I put my resized cases into a 3 jaw lathe chuck turning at about 300rpm. I use a butane torch, same as you and hold until a very slight dull red colour appears on neck- shoulder. I then remove case from chuck holding with pliers and place into a steel container, but no water. Water cooling is not necessary except for production speed.
I have found that MV drops about 30-40 fps in newly annealed case necks. I figure this might be due to the softer brass exerting somewhat less neck tension, but I am not totally sure about this. (Cal 7*61 with MV around 2850+fps using 160 SMK.) Accuracy is maintained compared to non annealed brass. (All NORMA brass)

Interesting. I do not lose any velocity unless I shoot on a cold clean barrel. POI is the same but on a cold fouled barrel I am around 10 fps off my average which is the main goal for me.

I only drop mine in water because quenching brass does not hurt it and I picked a few up to soon after annealing and got a few burnt digits.😆



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I had the same problems as the last 2 posts which so I started crimping using a Lee crimp die....problem solved!

@Kiwi Greg s machine is quick and consistent, I think if you "over anneal" then you will have less inconsistency doing it by hand but this may not be any better and maybe worse for brass life if the is the defining factor for your brass life is split necks, I have only ever binned brass for loose pockets from running too hot and even then only a few testing how long it would last (3 loads is probably not enough) and a few for imminent case head separation in 303 that was an unknown when I got it.
Most of my brass would be very lucky to see 6-7 reloads it is lost in the scrub before then.


I have never had a split neck that may be due to the chambering's I use?

made a couple of measurements today . As I said earlier, I have been resizing before annealing. I measured the inside diameter of some annealed cases and compared to non annealed resized cases. There was a measurable difference of 0.0015 to 0.002 inch in inside diameter so It would appear the annealing expands the case neck a little during the heating, but it does not necessarily shrink back to original size when cooled. Therefore I have now resized my annealed cases again as per R93 method and it would appear that resizing after annealing would give more consistent dimensional consistency.

Look at this for background dinfo. Alternatively use a candle and drop the case when it gets too hot.

The Science Behind Annealing Brass Cases

This graph from TeReis link shows what I was trying to explain earlier with my over annealing by hand comment.



As you can see if you are heating by hand and you are only just getting into the annealing range it is possible and probable you will have a lot of variation in hardness and hence neck tension compared to "over annealing" where a large temperature range will only result in a small difference in hardness.

However this range can produce brass that is to soft to form in some calibers/dies 303 for example will collapse its rounded shoulder FLing if heated into this range and I don't doubt would cause the same issues trying to form some wildcats brass.

Get some 750 Tempilaq or the crayons that are used for welding.
Has to be on the neck and out of the flame to get a True reading
Brass will start to change its grain at about 450 from memory and anneal well at 650 BUT in needs to be held for some time and that heat radiates down the case obviously.
IMO the temp is 650F, and the graph above shows that near enough the point, going to 750 briefly speeds the process without heatsoak.
If the case is dull and not shiny after your are finished - too much.
If you can squash the neck by hand then too much.
The beauty of machine setups is that once you hit the magic setup, it's repeatable.
I've never had much luck by hand and have enough brass that wearing it out isn't really a concern right now.
Moulten lead is apparently the way to go by hand.
Dip the neck in until you can't hold the base in your bare fingers and dunk in water. Fingers have a pretty good and narrow temp range
Others say to not quench the hot brass and let it air cool.. Depends on your brand of snake oil you drink I spose?

Annealing guide? Look at this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiIrLvAUh6o

All good. I think resizing after annealing is wise though; -- or both before and after if excess brass softness in a concern.

This
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z0TlctbLT3w

I decided to have a crack at one of the annealers off youtube. Almost ready for a trial run

Originally Posted by Dead is better

Attachment 34244

I decided to have a crack at one of the annealers off youtube. Almost ready for a trial run

That looks very dairy farmer but lets face it we are not launching a space shuttle to start human civilisation on another planet, looks like it will do the job asked of it and I look forward to seeing it in use.

Haha yep it is made out of junk lol. I paid $4 per electric motor off eBay. You need worm gear ones that do roughly 8rpm. The dude at jaycar sold me a couple of voltage adjusters for about $5. To be honest the only expensive item was the torch which cost $45 at bunnings but that's for the head and blue bottle. The rest is old fire alarm index perspex and fence pailings. Oh yeah and an old paint tin. I call this the hobo model!

I was going to try and make one of these but so far its in the "round tuit" dept

for anyone looking for a cheap shell holder to put into a drill, just use a suitable sized socket.
you can tip the heated brass into a bucket of water to quench with out having to touch.
greg