Welcome guest, is this your first visit? Create Account now to join.
  • Login:

Welcome to the NZ Hunting and Shooting Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed.

NZGR Black Watch


User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 23
Like Tree24Likes

Thread: Dog training books wanted - help me train my GSP

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    23

    Red face Dog training books wanted - help me train my GSP

    Hi everyone,
    Does anyone have any of the following books or any other books they would recommend that I could buy or borrow off them?
    I have a new GSP puppy i would like to train on deer and pheasants. Needs to be a versatile dog. Ive watched the deer dog blue print and while it is good, Im of the opinion that (as all good things in life) there are many ways to train a dog, and im hoping to get more information.
    I was going to buy these books of amazon but it was getting expensive, so thought id ask here first. Thanks Fam


    How to Help Gun Dogs Train Themselves, Taking Advantage of Early Condtioned Learning
    by Joan Bailey


    How to Have The Best Trained Gun Dog, Taking Advantage of Proven, Unique Training Methods, All Natural - No Expensive Electronics Needed
    by Joan Bailey


    The German Shorthaired Pointer: a Hunter's Guide
    by David Mark Gowde

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Taranaki
    Posts
    726
    I had a really good dog training DVD some years back , but the dog didnt have the attention-span to watch all of it ....

    Good luck with your search
    Cats have nine lives-which makes them ideal for experimentation...

  3. #3
    Animal Rights Activist Bavarian_Hunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    NZ, West Island
    Posts
    1,556
    I was going through all that and looking at videos and such and in the end just did it myself.

    It a not hard to train a dog it just takes time and discipline.

    Work on obedience and when you think you've got that down pat work on it some more. Work on obedience out and about where there's lots of smells and distractions.
    Their instincts tell them to hunt, it's just a matter of teaching them to listen when they don't want to and teaching yourself how to understand your dog.

    It's a journey with ups and downs but I loved it.

    My gsp is now not only a hunting partner that's put me on plenty of animals she's also my best mate.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
    Wirehunt and mikee like this.
    I prefer my meat in its original packaging

    Youtube Channel - http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX_q8lGytlOHspljC7H6_AA

  4. #4
    Member EeeBees's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    past the gum trees on your left
    Posts
    4,832
    The only two bits about dog training that I am certain about, StagDown, is that you form a great connection and if you command the pup to do something, make sure it does ...
    Wirehunt likes this.
    ...amitie, respect mutuel et amour...

    ...le beau et le bon, cela rime avec Breton!...

    C'est plus facile de juger un juge que de juger un chien!!

  5. #5
    Gold member Pointer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    3,778
    I don't rate the Joan Bailey books. They are light on the little details that make a big difference, if that makes sense.

    Try and read the works of people who have trained multiple dogs to a very high standard. For pointing breeds I really rate Derry Argues' stuff, it has a sound base in psychology followed up with good old fashioned stockmanship. Although not aimed at the pointing breeds David Lissetts' DVDs on training are worth a watch, especially in the early stages as it is exactly the same fundamentals put in place before you take a pointing dog to game.

    I also recommend Delmar Smiths stuff - just leave the e-collar out of it and watch the guys management and husbandry - excellent.

    Then, after all that, find the original master text - Hutchinsons' "Dog breaking. The most expeditious, certain, and easy method; whether great excellence or only mediocrity be required" - this little gem was published in the 1860s and shows that nothing is new in dog training. In fact, you could read it and surmise we have in fact lost our way with animals.

    Have fun and good luck
    Wirehunt and Ruff like this.

  6. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    23
    Cheers guys,

    Im really looking forward to the process but also just a bit worried Ill stuff it up.
    The biggest problem atm is she whines when i make her do something she doesnt want to/when im getting her food ready and also barks for about 10mins after i put her in the kennel, but then she settles down, then every hour or two she may start barking for 10mins again. Im not sure if this is something she will grow out of or if i need to shut it down now. This is my first dog so im unsure. Im not keen on shock collars so any other advice would be appreciated. (im pretty strict on kenneling and she has a nice kennel with everything she needs).

    I also dont know if i should be training her to be controlled and only walk a few meters ahead (ie for deer stalking stuff) or if i should start on retrieving and bird stuff first.

    Ill look into those books you mentioned @Pointer. Im reading one at the moment called "how to train your own gun dog" by Charles S.Goodall. its from 1982 so a bit old now, its good but only focus on bird stuff and i swear they must kill about 1000 pigeons to train one dog (its an american book). It doesn't seem realistic here in NZ. Are there any books/material about training a dog on deer other than the blue print?

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    281
    David Lisset's DVD's would be the best for general dog work, I refer to the Spaniel training series alot.

    'The Versatile Gundog' by Guy Wallace is useful, as is 'Gundog Training - Pointing Dogs' by Kenneth Roebuck, for the bird work.
    StagDown likes this.

  8. #8
    Gold member Pointer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    3,778
    If I were to train a pointing breed as a true versatile I would start with bird dog training first. The level of control and the rapport you will develop with your dog will make deer dog training a mere formality. If you take the blueprint approach first, you may knock the drive out of the dog enough to never work away from you, and neglect other areas in training needed to make a complete gundog - retrieve, ground treatment etc. which are much harder to remedy with an older dog.

    As for American training sources, take them largely with a grain of salt. Any dog that needed 1000 pigeons (which are terrible in comparison to live game and not to be over done in training) to get started is a complete dud in my opinion. I know dogs that have won at championship level in gundog trials an early age that have had a mere handful of birds shot for them.
    Ruff and StagDown like this.

  9. #9
    Animal Rights Activist Bavarian_Hunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    NZ, West Island
    Posts
    1,556
    She whines because she's a GSP!

    My brother used a shock collar, all it teaches them is to fear the shock collar, once it's off they do as they please.

    I really don't think you need books. Some advice from people here and your own lessons are enough.

    Distance from you when hunting comes back to obedience. Teach her to heel firstly. It just comes with repetition and practice that eventually they'll stay the distance they need to be. In thick cover Ellie is at my feet, in open country she pushes out further. She knows if I can't see her she's too far in front.

    My belief is that most dogs never end up great because people get sick of the commitment.
    I think also an underrated thing that doesn't get talked about is the dog maturing. At about 2 1/2 Ellie was noticeably more serious and calmer when going about her job and now she's what i consider a well rounded hunter at 3 1/2. I have confidence in her work and I haven't thought about taking a lead or collar into the Bush for 18 months.

    You need to understand that there's no shortcut or secret in books or videos it just takes time and effort.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
    Ruff and EeeBees like this.
    I prefer my meat in its original packaging

    Youtube Channel - http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX_q8lGytlOHspljC7H6_AA

  10. #10
    Member EeeBees's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    past the gum trees on your left
    Posts
    4,832
    So many puppy owners are busting their guts to get a workmanship out of their puppies ... I do not know how many books I have read on the matter ... throw them out the window ... the only book I have ever found to give the slightest nuance of practicability is Ben O Williams' puppy book ...
    ...amitie, respect mutuel et amour...

    ...le beau et le bon, cela rime avec Breton!...

    C'est plus facile de juger un juge que de juger un chien!!

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    222
    Ive just been given a gsp/lab/spaniel about 3 years old. Previous owner had got deer over her. Will go into a forest block tomorrow to see if she still remembers what she should do. Very friendly and full of beans.Just wants to please

  12. #12
    Member Kaimaicockher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    BOP.. on a hill in the kaimais
    Posts
    108
    I'm unsure if versatile dogs are really versatile. Well they are but I have never seen one that is exceptional in all aspects of hunting
    Still yet to see a gwp or gsp stalking in on deer... off the lead pointing bush stalking styles

    What ever your main hunting interest is what I would be training first

    I quite like what pointer says but he is at the extreame end of gundog enthusiast ( guessing by reading his knowledge) .
    So if you want a deer dog first don't let this dog get away on you. You will need a separate stalking command for having it in close in tight bush


    David Lisset's DVD's are good
    Ruff likes this.

  13. #13
    Gold member Pointer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    3,778
    I've been called many things on the Internet, extreme is a new one though!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaimaicockher View Post
    I'm unsure if versatile dogs are really versatile. Well they are but I have never seen one that is exceptional in all aspects of hunting
    Still yet to see a gwp or gsp stalking in on deer... off the lead pointing bush stalking styles
    Careful speaking such truths around here versatility is a sliding scale. On one end of the spectrum we have the NZ hunter who thinks he has a pretty handy dog if it does deer and ducks. The other end of the scale would be the Germans and their expectations of a true versatile dog.
    I can think of two dogs I have seen first hand that would match that criteria, and both were in that hands of people prepared to put far above usual levels of training and time into a dog to prove such versatility.
    Ruff and rossi.45 like this.

  14. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    338
    just fork out and follow the blueprint.
    I am using it and my dog is almost ready to hunt properly @ 15 months old(aim to be fully hunting in spring).
    Mates 14 month old heading dog bitch was trained by the blueprint & his own way. She would have 15+ deer, pigs and a shit load of goats under her belt already.
    Got to put the time and effort in and restrain yourself from taking them before they are ready otherwise may as well give that dog away or keep it as a pet.

  15. #15
    Member Ruff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Waihi Beach
    Posts
    1,211
    The blueprint, while some will like it, is about the lowest common denominator in New Zealand dog training. Far more effective and productive methods are available if you seek the right help.
    It is difficult to win an argument with an intelligent person! It is near impossible with a stupid person!
    Rebelwood Gundog Training

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Various Books
    By jim160 in forum Buy, Sell or Swap
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 22-01-2015, 08:55 PM
  2. Books wanted please...
    By BruceY in forum Buy, Sell or Swap
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 31-12-2014, 09:37 AM
  3. Steam Train Departs Dannevirke
    By Dundee in forum Outdoor Transport
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 24-02-2014, 06:46 PM
  4. Books on dog training dogs for deer???
    By Twoshotkill in forum Hunting Dogs
    Replies: 51
    Last Post: 01-05-2013, 07:58 PM
  5. Books f/s
    By Barefoot in forum Buy, Sell or Swap
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 18-03-2012, 09:34 PM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Welcome to NZ Hunting and Shooting Forums! We see you're new here, or arn't logged in. Create an account, and Login for full access including our FREE BUY and SELL section Register NOW!!