.17 ACKELY IMPROVE VERSES .221 REMINGTON FIREBALL

Any boby got any thoughts over which I should buy for small game?? Also any probs with sourcing brass/ammo etc Thanks

Do you mean 17 Fireball?
I would struggle to find reason to own a .221 Fireball unless you have specific desire or need for one, other than using less gun powder than a 223 or 204 Ruger there is no real advantage. The .221FB seems to launch a 40gr projectile at 3000fps, compared to the 4000fps you can get out of a 17 Fireball, or a 204 Ruger using 40gr projectiles, which have a much better BC. The 17FB for similar amounts of powder will be more laser like than the .221FB, much the same as 204 Ruger, but the rubbish BC causes the 204 to be much better in the wind.

204 Ruger would be my choice on a specific small game rifle, it just seems to have the perfect balance of high speed and reasonable BC projectiles, as well as being available in lots of rifles and ammo and brass easy to find. You will have the ability to use it on goats or wallaby's comfortably if you ever felt the desire.

Ones a Kimber and ones a Weirauch, nice as, and im into nice, Between the two I thought the 221 FB would be better in the wind than the 17 Ackley improved and i have a wildcat in that to reload, but the brass is formed from a .22 hornet. Thanks for the Beetroot, Ill delve a bit deeper

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Originally Posted by Maca49

Ones a Kimber and ones a Weirauch, nice as, and im into nice, Between the two I thought the 221 FB would be better in the wind than the 17 Ackley improved and i have a wildcat in that to reload, but the brass is formed from a .22 hornet. Thanks for the Beetroot, Ill delve a bit deeper

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If the 17 is a 17hornet based case, then the .221FB would be a much better performer.
Unless there is specific reason you want that particular rifle, I'd be looking at a 204 Ruger or 17FB, with preference to the Ruger.
CZ offer the 204 in their mini mauser action and they are nice rifles, probably not as nice as a Weirauch though.

Have you not just sold your 17 hornardy hornet??
An Ackley .17 hornet, will give you another 100fps, but comes with fire forming and wild cat hassles.
I like the 221 fireball, in fact I have just ordered one, as Cz usa has them out this year in the American, probably end up as a 20 vartarg at sum stage, as I have a .222
I also have a 17 fireball on a Sako, and its the bomb, for long range varminting, 25v-max at 3750-3800fps , 20gr at 4000fps. Will run as flat as a 22-250, to 350yards, and the v-max 25g, is 230 BC so as good as a 55gr .22 bullet.
I like the small centerfire .17 and .20's, as you can spot your shots, in the scope, with a lightweight walkabout rifle, Not always possible with .204, .223 and 22-250, unless on a heavy rifle platform.
Lapua makes .221 brass now, so a good option for fireball, and 20 vartarg cases.
I would take a 221 fireball, over an Ackley .17 hornet, if for no other reason that its a factory std cartridge, with good brass. not with standing the fact it does pretty good with a 40gr v-max, or a 50gr soft point.

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Originally Posted by southernman

Have you not just sold your 17 hornardy hornet??
An Ackley .17 hornet, will give you another 100fps, but comes with fire forming and wild cat hassles.
I like the 221 fireball, in fact I have just ordered one, as Cz usa has them out this year in the American, probably end up as a 20 vartarg at sum stage, as I have a .222
I also have a 17 fireball on a Sako, and its the bomb, for long range varminting, 25v-max at 3750-3800fps , 20gr at 4000fps. Will run as flat as a 22-250, to 350yards, and the v-max 25g, is 230 BC so as good as a 55gr .22 bullet.
I like the small centerfire .17 and .20's, as you can spot your shots, in the scope, with a lightweight walkabout rifle, Not always possible with .204, .223 and 22-250, unless on a heavy rifle platform.
Lapua makes .221 brass now, so a good option for fireball, and 20 vartarg cases.
I would take a 221 fireball, over an Ackley .17 hornet, if for no other reason that its a factory std cartridge, with good brass. not with standing the fact it does pretty good with a 40gr v-max, or a 50gr soft point.

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The ackley is a Weirauch, a very nice rifle virtually new, has 400 rounds and 270 formed brass with it, i realise the performances are the same but it is very nice kit! Then he produces the 221FB in a Kimber unfired FFS! At a good price with 200 brass, now that threw me a little! Hence the question, thanks SM you answer helps

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Originally Posted by small_caliber

Let's see you have the choice of two rifles, one a Weihrauch in 17 Ackley Hornet and the other a Kimber in 221 Fireball.
So you want opinions based on only these two - not something else you aren't considering.

I am assuming the Kimber is a "made in Oregon Kimber"?

The pluses and minuses,

17 Ackley Hornet
Pluses

Very accurate cartridge
Good balistics for out to 250 - 300
Minimal powder (700 rounds to a pound)
Less recoil - so you can see your hits.

Minuses

Not the strongest brass
Fireforming - no problem after you've fireformed a few
Custom dies
Reload only - although most are easy to load for.

221 Fireball
Pluses

Very accurate cartridge
Can buy factory ammo
Strong case
Easy to reload
Cheap dies available

Minuses

Hmmm can't think of any.

In my opinion buy both :thumbs:

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That's the answers I'm looking for! Helping me spend money, thanks Small cal:D

Of course, I will help you to spent a little bit more as you need to suppress both rifles ;-)

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Originally Posted by Friwi

Of course, I will help you to spent a little bit more as you need to suppress both rifles ;-)

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Friwi would you seriously put a suppressor on a 1986 Kimber 221 fireball in unfired condition! Careful how you answer! And is a DPT up Kimber Oregon standards?:D @Friwi

Let me put it this way:
When you buy a brand new car, from the moment you drive of the dealership, you have already lost 5 to 10 grands.
Same with your rifle, from the moment you are going to use it, it is going to devaluate.
And unless you are suddenly becoming famous like Theodor Roosevelt , Billy the Kidd or Hemingway, I doubt it will go backup in value.
And the threading can always be cut and muzzle recrowned when you want to sell it again. That will leave a minimal trace on the overall appearance of the rifle.
But I also own a few classics, left untouched because they don't need to be suppressed really.And I want to feel a bit like a Hemingway or a Roosevelt when I hunt with them :-)

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Originally Posted by Friwi

Let me put it this way:
When you buy a brand new car, from the moment you drive of the dealership, you have already lost 5 to 10 grands.
Same with your rifle, from the moment you are going to use it, it is going to devaluate.
And unless you are suddenly becoming famous like Theodor Roosevelt , Billy the Kidd or Hemingway, I doubt it will go backup in value.
And the threading can always be cut and muzzle recrowned when you want to sell it again. That will leave a minimal trace on the overall appearance of the rifle.
But I also own a few classics, left untouched because they don't need to be suppressed really.And I want to feel a bit like a Hemingway or a Roosevelt when I hunt with them :-)

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At the end of the day it's a piece of steel and wood? I'll sleep on it! Thanks!:thumbsup:

@small_caliber haven't purchased yet! It is an Oregon manufacture, unfired