Thread: .284 ELD-X Close Range Blow Up

In reality 0-400y max

No I didn't but given its behaviour I could tell nothing vital had been hit.

Originally Posted by Stocky

Your missing the point sorry Micky. Just because a you know the drop off a bullet at XYZ distance thats moot if the bullets not going fast enough (at impact) to expand at that distance. Bc helps make sure its still going fast enough no one has ever talked about drop or clicks except you.

So it's ok to use a 70-80 GRN .224 at 500 yards....but a .277 or .284 of soft construction of twice that out half as far again is somehow lacking because it's slowed down a bit??? That 1800 fps thing that's talked about seems to have superseded the 1000 ft-lb thing that used to be talked about... And if we go back to original question. Were asking about projectiles blowing up by going too quick. So it's really soft,fragile at speed....so it's not so fragile when it slows..... Soft for slow or long distance .....harder for fast or up close PLUS the point of aim thing. Very soft or explody = in crease or neck. Harder,less explody = smash shoulder bones.

Originally Posted by chainsaw

Maybe I didn’t explain myself well enough. Given what I observed with a pill that didn’t connect with any major bones (total jacket/core separation) then I’m very sceptical about what the outcome would be if pill had hit shoulder instead of crease. My guess based on observed terminal performance is that I would have had a blow up on shoulder & badly wounded deer with pill unlikely to penetrate to vitals. Doesn’t fit with my idea of ethical hunting. Others experience may differ.

Yep this is exactly the same way I am looking at it. There is plenty of times where I am putting it through the front shoulder bone, deliberate shot or not. Thinking about trying the 150 accubond or LR accubond as both ballistically will give me plenty of reach but are by all accounts les fragable compared to the ELDX. Interesting I have had really good results shooting 154 SST's out of my 18 inch .284. Dropped a big 'ole bull tahr from 10 meters on the spot with a quartering shot behind the shoulder and deer at a variety of ranges. It shoots sub .3 MOA groups all day long. What are peoples experience with SST's 0-500 yards?

Originally Posted by Yesmate

Just unlucky on that one id say mate,dont freak out after one incident.

Yep one incident doesn't make it a fact but interesting to hear others experiences......

And I used 45/70 a bit tongue in cheek...but a .45 sized hole is still a .45 sized hole and that lets lots of red stuff out or as Chaz used to say,lets lots of daylight in lol.

If an ELDX is too frangible who in their right mind would ever use ELDM on animals.......

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

So it's ok to use a 70-80 GRN .224 at 500 yards....but a .277 or .284 of soft construction of twice that out half as far again is somehow lacking because it's slowed down a bit??? That 1800 fps thing that's talked about seems to have superseded the 1000 ft-lb thing that used to be talked about... And if we go back to original question. Were asking about projectiles blowing up by going too quick. So it's really soft,fragile at speed....so it's not so fragile when it slows..... Soft for slow or long distance .....harder for fast or up close PLUS the point of aim thing. Very soft or explody = in crease or neck. Harder,less explody = smash shoulder bones.

Micky to quote the statement im rebutting since once again your missing the point and bringing random context into the situation no relevant.

You said about BC "If your shooting past 300 which is only time that matters,you are dialing anyway do point is moot"

So no one mentioned 300 yards. Danny mentioned 400yards afterwards. No one even mentioned 500 yards. The original poster mentioned 600.

I didnt say anything was ok. But it doesnt really matter the diameter of a bullet at all. It matters the constriction of the bullet and that it impacts at high enough velocity the bullets expands to kill effectively.

I never said a partition was worse or better. Im just calling out your relatively common absolute nonsense comments. In practical ranges BC is not a massive deal but claiming in benefits are moot because you still need to dial is either completely misunderstanding the topic or being disingenuous.

The 1800fps is a generic number given to most soft bullets. Each bullet is on its own but its to nuanced and should be tested on its own. If you aren't willing to find out where that is the 1800fps is a safe number for soft bullets, 2000 for many traditional options and 2200 for monos. None of those are rules just guidelines not rules. If you find they dont apply then find what does.

As to the original post it was asking about bullet performance. An assumptions been made I asked for clarification.

Guiding moose someone shot one with a 270 it went about 50 yards (with a 150 partition) and died. The comments afterwards were maybe the 270 was too small.

Later that season a moose sucked up 3 lung shots from a 300Wby then died 200 odd yards away in a pond. The comments on that were that "damn they are a tough animal". When we subconsciously worry about something we are quick to conclude the problem even though contently on those 2 samples the 270 worked better he was worried it was too small and confirmation bias snuck in.

So I asked if he necropsied it as going too far forward into the shoulder is a bad shot, cutting it open would mean he knows for sure it wasn't just the vitals were further back. Reacting to a single point of info is like shooting 1 shot groups.

Originally Posted by dannyb

In reality 0-400y max

Then the world's your oyster! Any of the better older style projectiles will do a great job I think. I swore by 130gr corlokts for years, and now am very impressed with Speer boattails. A bit softer but they have worked well up close on big boars and at a distance on reds and chamois (300m) Interlocts, Ballistic tips, you name it. The great thing about the 270 win is most projectiles are designed specifically for it.

I havnt tried them but if after the modern stuff then despite everything else, I have heard only good things about the 145 ELDX

Stocky.MY context re BC was to head off the continual "my .284 is better than your .277 cause we have better BC options"& point I was trying to make was.....if your going to be dialing up for a given range....a slightly less aerodynamic projectiles can be placed just as easily as the very slipperyest of them. If it will expand enough to kill....take note of placement vs hardness....all is good. And speaking of expansion. If .30 expands to create a hole half as big again,is good....then a .45 hole is good.........full stop...lol

Not to start an argument. But if we are talking longer ranges then the lower BC projectiles can't be placed as easily, and it's all due to wind. The high BC projectiles definitely have an advantage in an experienced shooters hands.

Originally Posted by dannyb

What would you say is a better .277 bullet ? I've used them in 270win and wsm with 0 failures from 10 yards to 400+ so if there's a better bullet I'd love to know what it is ? Genuine query as I'll be loading 270win again real soon

I use 140 grain tipped game kings. Excellent penetration and expansion seems to be very uniform. I say “seems” because I’ve never recovered one, but by the exit holes they always seem to open up well. I have a distinct preference for complete penetration as I’ve had issues with poor bullet performance with sst’s, ballistic silver tips? (I think they were called made by nosler) and the eldx. Animals with holes through both shoulders don’t seem to run far. You can get bullets to hard I’ll grant you that. Tried Barnes ttsx and they were a bit much for me, though they possibly weren’t going fast enough.

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

If an ELDX is too frangible who in their right mind would ever use ELDM on animals.......

Vmax or ELD-VT

Originally Posted by whanahuia

Not to start an argument. But if we are talking longer ranges then the lower BC projectiles can't be placed as easily, and it's all due to wind. The high BC projectiles definitely have an advantage in an experienced shooters hands.

Sadly, a lot of the gunwriters (both new and old) must have either skipped or failed physics class. Their influence cascaded down onto the consumer and polluted the market.

Hornady publishes ballistic gel tests for their 'law enforcement' ammo. Nearly all of them use their OTM, ELD-M or AMAX bullets, except for the 'barrier blind' stuff that uses copper bullets.

For animals that can be killed with a knife/spear, I don't see why you need bullets that are closer to AP than they are to a soft target round. Those who could access the 77 grain OTM 5.56 ammo during GWOT were quick to use it vs. M558A1 (standard issue 'green tip' to US forces, designed to defeat Ruskie body armour and not jihadi's)

Originally Posted by AlpineHunter

Yep this is exactly the same way I am looking at it. There is plenty of times where I am putting it through the front shoulder bone, deliberate shot or not. Thinking about trying the 150 accubond or LR accubond as both ballistically will give me plenty of reach but are by all accounts les fragable compared to the ELDX. Interesting I have had really good results shooting 154 SST's out of my 18 inch .284. Dropped a big 'ole bull tahr from 10 meters on the spot with a quartering shot behind the shoulder and deer at a variety of ranges. It shoots sub .3 MOA groups all day long. What are peoples experience with SST's 0-500 yards?

@AlpineHunter iv really being liking the 150lrab worth a try