Hi all, any comments re these two pills in say 30Cal and their respective performance or lack of on animals?
I’ve never used on game, I know they shoot well that’s all.
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Hi all, any comments re these two pills in say 30Cal and their respective performance or lack of on animals?
I’ve never used on game, I know they shoot well that’s all.
I’ve used the 6.5 135gn classic hunters & they are vicious of deer.
Yeah. Vicious. They are inclined to splatter a fair bit of copper and lead fragments through the meat. I've only used them at moderate ranges though. I expect that they hold together better at longer ranges.
ive used both hunter and target flavours from bergers all with good results so far touch wood
Exit on opposite shoulder of bull tahr shot at 600 (270wsm) can see bits of copper jacket in the wound channel, they work bloody good
Attachment 85902
This Hunter or Hunter Classic?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst
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I use the 185 vld hunting for my 300wsm. Everything dies real quick. I’ve found them easy to load for in for that and a 300 win mag. Both loads are about 1/4 moa from a decent rest. Never needed a follow up shot
Thanks for feedback guys. Going to load some tomorrow and shoot some shit...
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Attachment 85903
This was a 7mm 162 vld hunting out of a 7mm rem mag on a fallow buck by one of my hunting clients at 200 ish. Pretty devistating. About 2850 muzzle vel.
The Americans love the 215 vld in their 300 win mags.
The only deer I’ve shot with a vld. It was a specific test comparison. I usually use the 150 sst that explodes heads. This was with the 270 150 vld hunting. Shot a fallow in the head. 160m. It was a little low of the brain and missed the spine. It pencilled straight through and it took off like I had missed. Managed a second shot later on when I found it and used my usual sst in the neck so I could see what the vld did. I have never tried a chest shot with one so maybe better but when selling the meat I can’t sell chest shot deer.
VLD HunterQuote:
Originally Posted by Danny
Either VLD Hunting (as opposed to VLD Target), Classic Hunter, or Elite Hunter. Those are the three designs sold by Berger for hunting, so presumably all with the thinner (original-thickness) jackets.
Reliability of expansion may be on a model number by number basis. I've had both ends of the sprectrum, none in 30cal sorry, ranging so far from 100% reliable expansion from 25cal 115gr VLD Hunting at a range of impact speeds, through to a couple of 7mm 180gr VLD pinholing when between the ribs at 2800ft/sec - not slow for a terminal velocity.
Whether the somewhat more stubby profile of the Classic Hunter better promotes expansion at lower velocities than the VLD design seems to be a popular topic for online debate. Berger naturally enough say they are equally as effective. I would scour the various forums on the particular calibre, weight, and designs you are interested in, see if you can make any sense of the endless anecdotal reports! There is much less info on the performance of the Elite Hunters, being a more recent release.
Have dropped quite a few chamois with them too from 100yds to way out there, doing 3170 at the muzzle, always a complete pass through and vitals turned to soup, never had one pencil and chamois are about as light bodied as they come for a game animal
For what it’s worth I use 7mm 168 VLDs and and lost count of animals shot now, but no problems from 30-630yds so far. Usually bang flop and a good exit hole if animal did run a good blood trail to follow.
Thanks for feedback as it’s not lost on me.
The caliber is the 30-06 so I don’t want a pure target (soft) pill and for use on deer, mainly under 200m.
I have 208 Amax, 168, 155 Amax and soon some 168 VLD. So I’ll see what tickles the bullseye fancy before I buy a couple a hundy...
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I am however for no other reason than my own curiosity right this moment sitting down to have a play with some of these things again, used them heaps in my 270win, will see how they like a bit more speed...
Attachment 85907
87gr vld hunting great on goats and fallow deer. Ok on red hinds and yearlings and have taken a medium bull tahr but did not exit. Found the base under the skin.
105gr vld hunting too much bullet on goats. Last one broke both front legs and mashed everything in between at 150mtr. Normally I get massive exit wounds but they are half way through a goat before they start to grenade.
Rifles are 243 lever and bolt actions.
Zq
Ryan, just starting on the 145 eldx with the 270win. They seem to hold more accurate than the 150sst which was good but accuracy fell of past 500m. So far the 145 seems to stay accurate out longer. So does the Barnes 130 lrx but expansion suffers out further because of my 20” barrel and has a muzzle velocity of 2950. They open up nice at 300. But only open about 1/4 of the bullet at 420m. A wsm with 24” barrel might be ok out to 7-800 but would depend on where it hits.
I used 150 LRAB exclusively in my 20" barreled 270win with good results, again mostly on chamois, but a few tahr and a red taken with them also, shot a few out past 500 and closest was under 100yds, dumbass buck decided to stand on a rock and check us out while we were soaking up some sun outside a hut so he copped one from an offhand shot, still performed very well at that range, leaving barrel at 2850.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowboy06
My wsm (85 finnlight) has still got it's full 24" barrel and can run the 150s at 3170 which is fair steaming along, I'm a bit wary about using anything smaller/faster in the wsm unless it was a very light load as past experience even in the 270win doesn't give me much confidence in the 130 class projectiles and their ability to stay together, possibly a barnes or similar would be ok but I mostly hunt alpine tops type country with long shots and wind to deal with and the 150+ class projectiles bring the 270 alive in that environment
Yep that’s fair, the Barnes though are the shape and length and act of 150s but weigh 130 because no lead. I managed at a match a few years ago to get the 270 with the 150 vld only doing 2650 but accurate as all hell to hit an ipsc target 2 out of 5 at 1200m. Was only going about 900fps at the target. I think they were probably hitting it sideways yawing in the wind.
How did those 168s go @Danny?
Hi mate, in all honesty they shot the best, I only loaded and fired 6 though and have a few more to load up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
Looking to team up with a mate and chrony them and my 180’s which are also looking promising.
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At 200m @ 168 VLD.
I have used both and still use both. They work on animals up close and at distance. Either will work. The VLD don't like a jump but the classic hunter don't mind it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny
All in all I think a better option than hornady..... But that's just me
Hamish
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Good to know. Thanks
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My 308 and 260 with vlds have huge jump. The hate jump thing is all shite in my opinion :D
How how have these shot? I’ve never had any shot any good at all...Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst
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We had several problems with VLD Hunter a few years ago, in 7mm out of two Rem Mags. Probably 2011 or thereabouts. No expansion and penciling through, on fallow, at medium ranges (300-500m). There was one really really bad day when we had to go back and fetch the dogs cos two of us shot two bloody good bucks at the same time... 1, 2, 3, BANG...THWOP!!! they both jumped and took off into the bush. Both had good hits in the top of the heart but tiny wee wound channels and slow bleeds. Took bloody hours to find them. Then it happened again to my shooting buddy and that was enough thank you very much.
We cut some bullets in half and to our way of thinking the ogive jacket was too thick and the hollow point diameter too small.
So we complained to NZ Ammo and if memory serves me correctly there was a full refund for several boxes and a sorry letter (I'd have to check on exactly what happened with my business partner who went into battle on our behalf.)
Anyway again if memory serves, there was a problem with a production run of Berger VLDs a while back, that caused an overly staunch ogive and consequent lack of expansion. Something along those lines. Someone here with probably knows more about it. I think there was quite a big problem in other markets as well and so they didn't put up a fight at all, just went straight to accepting there was a problem, which is unusual in life!
Subsequently I've heard blokes we hunt with in Aus and NZ say they're getting very good results and I am led to believe the problem has been fixed. Whether it extended to other calibres I don't know. Though as posted earlier the VLD Hunters are regarded as pretty damn explosive.
Anyway, in .30cal and 6.5mm I'm using ELD-X and I doubt very much I will ever change as I find them bloody excellent for what I do (deer and long-ish range goats). Here's a couple of photos from Sunday, this spiker was shot downhill (-27°) at a bit over 300m, in through the spine between the shoulders, roughly in line with the front of the foreleg, straight down through of the lungs, autonomic plexus, arteries and into the brisket, which is where I recovered the remains of the bullet's jacket from. A perfect bang-flop in steep country, just the ticket. About a 1" radius of meat damage in the lower neck.
https://vgy.me/SqJMIx.jpg
https://vgy.me/eBP8lI.jpg
https://vgy.me/QdTVQm.jpg
https://vgy.me/E5ZWS8.jpg
Avoid heart shots and go lung
Fair comment, though at that range it was about the percentage shot. And it wouldn’t have made much difference if we’d gone front lungs, rear lungs or heart & lungs, the wounds were that narrow. If the bullets had opened up like they should’ve and fragmented, it would have been heart, lungs and arteries. Only thing that would have put them down with those specific VLDs was a braxial plexus or a bad shot that accidentally hit the spine.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
Anyone have any recent experiences to share? I'm looking at changing to the classic hunter (30 cal 168gr) from hornady. this thread seems typical of most ive seen - generally people love them but the odd bad experience.
Best hunting pills I reckon. From 10 yards to 1000. They are accurate and deadly what more do you want.
I ran the 210s and 215s out of winmag, 168s outof remmags and now my 7mm saum. I did use eldx for a long time but still think vlds are better killers especially on big bodies animals
