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Looking to take the next step into higher end digital scales. I have a Hornady G2 which is entry level, but want to go a step further. What are you using?
I enquired with a scale supplier and the lowest end scale they supplied that measured in grains was $900...
Looking for digital over balance since they read out faster than a balance beam, so speed up the process considerably.
In my soils testing laboratory the balances are one of the more expensive bits of gear. To get the precision and accuracy you won't get much change out of $1k unfortunately.
Ideally the balance needs to be on a solid isolated mount, free from any drafts and have a clean power supply.
For reloading I use an elderly pacific balance beam and a moderate size bucket of patience. Sorry, no help to you at all....
In all of our chemistry labs at school we use 20 dollar digital scales, same for my reloading as they also have grains mode. No problems at all as they have little masses to check them .
Attachment 159553
A&D fx120-i, the ducks nuts, the cats pajamas. Brought my SD and ES waaaay down. Fast, accurate, and can be controlled by an app on your phone. Measures to 0.02 gr or one kernal of stick powder
Don't forget to mention that you have a $2300 set up there depending upon where you purchased.
@canross what is your stretched budget?
That really deserves a 'Reloading Gear porn' thread... :PQuote:
Originally Posted by keengunNic
I'm also curious what is considered the best of the non-dispenser digital scales?
Here's a starter, the difference between strain gauge balances (Hornady, Lyman Chargemaster etc) and magnetic force restoration balances (AnD, Sartorius).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89BOlViQXto
That's definitely the issue I'm up against. Part of the decision to move up in scales is the fact that I made the mistake of seeing if our work lab scales had a grain function then thinking about my home scale, so I've gotten used to a higher degree of precision/accuracy than is normally called for in reloading. Turned to the current digital as a way of speeding up with the balance beam acting as the safety check on the scale. I can usually get the second load done on the digital scale in about the same time as it takes the beam to settle, which has me working about as fast as I can without an automated self-feeding scale.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_90
I'm looking to push it a bit further than the low end digitals can - I might be wasting a lot of effort but it would be good to know what my options are and if it's worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by garyp
I can believe that - you've got a rolls royce there!!! Also a bit out of my budget :PQuote:
Originally Posted by keengunNic
I'm stretched to justify a $900 scale from our lab supplier - I'd been hoping there might be something decent with $400 being a cap. I know there's a tiny bit of markup with them being a lab supplier, plus the markup that all items seem to experience from just existing in NZ over the customs and import costs so figuring out if there's a good scale that people recommend that I can source overseas.Quote:
Originally Posted by zimmer
Given that an accurate and precise scale measuring in grains isn't likely for $400, I'll probably hunt down a decent balance beam scale and accept the loss of time rather than drop more money on a higher end digital scale that I can't really justify.
Me too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelisreal
This is definitely the issue here - just because a scale reads to one or two decimal places doesn't mean it's true or even consistently wrong :P No sense in obsessively measuring loads with a scale that's swinging wildly in actual weights without telling you.Quote:
Originally Posted by zimmer
@zimmer - I take it this' your job or related to your job?
Best non dispenser digital is the fx120i without the v3 autotrickler:XD:Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelisreal
l just use a cheap honady set of scales but do a calibration each time and also check against my old balance beam.
my main issue is that they still have a bit of a lag time settling and will roll up another 1-2/10 gr after a few seconds.
had an interesting experience recently with the battery's getting flat.
Calibrated OK but when i weighed my powder pan it was about 10gr heavier than memory thought it should be. weighted out 3 lots into cases and the level in the case looked low. So pored a load onto the balance beam and it was 3gr light.
got new batterys and all was good again.
z
ANNNNNNDD... there it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZQLewis
Electronic scales all rely on stable, consistent and smooth electricity supply. Also no interference from nearby fluorescent tubes, transformers etc.
I can guarantee lab quality gravity in my reloading room. Lab quality electricity, not so much. Still using old school balance beam scales.
It's not the power supply that causes drifting- it's simply that they're strain gauge-based. As has been said, you need to go with a mag restoration force system to keep things stable. I -never- have drift on my AnD 120i.
If you can't afford one or its Satorius equivalent, stick with a quality balance beam
Those wandering black holes really mess with the repeatability results :oQuote:
Originally Posted by Ross Nolan
I have used pretty much every cheap or middle of the road dispenser and scale system there is.
Have personally owned Lyman, Pact, Rcbs and now frankford. So far for me, the Frankford has been the best in accuracy, consistency and ease of use.
They all have their quirks and ways around them. The goal is to be loading accurate ammo with usable ES and SD.
You can do that with all of the above. A powder charge that may vary .1-.2 will hardly show up on paper unless shooting beyond 1000 yrds if you're in the node.
If you ever do ladder tests you can have up to .3 or .4 grain nodes where the load will shoot under 10fps ES. 1 kernel of powder accuracy doesn't mean shit in real world results imo.
You can have the most accurate scales available but if your prep and shooting ability is not that sharp, the scales are the least of your worry.
If you are meticulous and mainly hunting you will be fine with any of the cheaper options out there.
I have tried to find a video where they compared a lot of the most popular sets available against the more expensive gear. 1 machine being worth around 5000 USD.
They had reputable shooters shooting the loads inside 1000 yrds and there really wasn't anything in it. The cheaper gear produced ammo that was just as if not more accurate in some cases.
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The A&D FX-300i and FX-500i have exactly the same accuracy as the FX-120i just cost more and have the capacity to weigh more.Quote:
Originally Posted by keengunNic
The Sartorius lab scales are even more precise than the A&D scales, cost a lot more and their 1/100th of a grain accuracy isn't necessary.
Never had any of the issues you describe with my AnD Fx-300i. And I live at the end of a pretty ropey rural supply with all sorts of shit going on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ross Nolan
Only concession to any hash that I considered was to have the balance on an ant-static mat. Never got around to it and won't bother now.
There's virtually no difference between comparable models of Sartorius and AnD balances. The Sartorius are mostly made in Germany whilst the AnD are made in Korea. The similar Sartorius to the AnD Fx series has glass side shield whilst the AnD has plastic. Game changer?? The AnD has a vastly better display which is easier to see in daylight conditions.Quote:
Originally Posted by 10-Ring
My preference is AnD as there is excellent backup thru AnD Oz.
I had an issue linking my Fx-300i into my computer and Excel spreadsheets. Sent an email to AnD Oz asking for advise and they replied requesting my phone number. Next thing a guy rings me and talks me thru the process. Most impressed. Conversation ended with guy stating if I ever have any problems be they warranty or otherwise just contact him direct.
Zimmer, from what I remember, without having to look it up, the equivalent Sartorius models measure to 1/100th of a grain whereas the AnD measure to 1/50th of a grain. Not an issue for reloading although some 1,000 yard U.S. shooters would argue otherwise. I'm very pleased with my AnD Fx-300i even though I can't honestly claim it has improved the accuracy of my reloads up to 300m (which is as far as I normally shoot) over my old RCBS 10-10 scales.
Ha ha, my old Ohaus D5 still sits in the back of my cupboard. Have yet to change its batteries in a 50 yr term of ownership.Quote:
Originally Posted by 10-Ring
Ditto with the accuracy experience. I could achieve similar with the old D5 beam balance. I just like using the AnD better and I'm at a stage in life (life's too short aye) where I can afford toys that others regard as superfluous.
Was watching Gavin Toobe on Youtube last night reviewing the AnD EJ-54D2 with a 0.003 grain rating. He mentioned them being suitable for weighing primers. I stopped viewing soon after that...
I actually use a Chargemaster to dispense a charge just short of required then finish it off on the Fx-300 using a Little Dandy trickler.
Whilst I shot Fullbore, which I was half reasonable at, I used the Chargemaster for all my powder dispensing. My loads where very accurate and velocities consistant. It's only after I added the Fx-300 in that I found how inconsistant the CH was. Did that affect my loads, obviously not greatly or at the time not enough for my perception.
Nowadays I'm seeing much improved on paper and velocity consistancy performance. ESs are single figures. Runout 0 or close to it. I put this down to a combination of things though, my AnD, plus a total change to my reloading techniques. I now anneal after every firing, FLS after every firing. I no longer use bushing dies but FLS without expander and then expand using a 21st Century or Porter expanding dies.
Apologies to the OP for going off topic but you can probable glean from some replies the answer to your original question.
Whether or not the upper end quality in balances is required I won't get into. (Much like the neck sizing full length sizing argument.)
From memory, the Entris series by Sartorius were more equivalent to the AnDs. As has been said, there is no point going one decimal place past what the AnD can deliver.
I have had issues with fluro lights with my AnD, swapped to for a led light and problem solved- the fluro tube was closer than I would imagine being normal so I can see how its a uncommon issue. @zimmer no way I'm going to even think about weighing primers either!
