Thread: New to reloading - to what fraction of a grain do you test new loads? 0.5gr, 0.3gr...

Originally Posted by zimmer

There is no one answer. Figure on roughly 10% steps of the nominal load. So yes, catridge capacity dependant.
0.5 gr for say 308 sized, for a 22 Hornet 0.2 gr dropping to 0.1 gr when approaching book max.
Once close to desired result a smaller final change may be in order.

Dickhead this should have read 1% not 10% Back to school....
As per @Pommy post.

Originally Posted by Pav

New to reloading - Just wondering to what fraction of a grain does everybody generally test to when making a new load? 0.5gr, 0.3gr?
Current cartridges are .308 and .222 predominantly used for hunting with a little target shooting for good measure.
Am I right to assume that a charge difference of 0.3gr will have a more noticeable result in the smaller 222 case than it would in the 308? And to what fraction have you noticed significant variation in results before you contend with human error etc in charge weights eg. 0.2gr, 0.1gr?
Cheers

Greetings Pav and All,
The curmudgeon in me forces me to say that with the two cartridges you mention just about any reasonable load will shoot well. Returning to the actual question you asked it is probably more important how you test your loads. One three shot group tells you nothing. you could shoot the same string of loads again and get completely different results. For serious testing a better measure would be the average of three three shot groups. Also it is a good idea to set a goal of what you are trying to achieve. Look at a few of the manuals, in particular the manual of the projectile you plan to use. Select a load that will fill your needs and test first with three shots of the start load shot over a chronograph. If the velocity is similar to the data, you need to make an adjustment for barrel length, pressure is likely to be similar as well. If this checks out you can work up to your goal load in grain or half grain steps chronographing along the way. Once you get close to your goal load you can go to .2 grain steps for the .222 and .5 grain steps firing three three shot groups to test for accuracy.
I have to admit right here that once I have an accurate load that gives me the velocity I am after I stop right there. I don't do endless testing chasing that last erosive foot per second or the last millimetre in group size. The law of diminishing returns does apply to load development.
Regards Grandpamac.

Originally Posted by caberslash

Avoid over thinking, if possible, find yourself a local reloading guru/sensei. Grey hair and hearing loss are usually good signs that they have been shooting for a while

Read this first (Richard Lee's Modern Reloading) : http://marvinstuart.com/firearm/Manu...%20-%20ocr.pdf

Most important factors in descending order:

1. Tools used for measuring and dispensing powder

2. Type of powder

3. Case capacity

1. Tools
Try and avoid weight measuring with the whole beam scale balance and powder trickling setup. Waste of time, money and sanity if you are just making rounds to go hunting and plinking with. Use a volumetric measuring system (Lee scoops or powder thrower) with a small set of electronic scales to measure the initial charge then work from there. No point trying to measure down to 0.1 grain if your equipment only has an accuracy of +/- 0.3 grains.

2. Powder
Choose a good powder that 'meters' easily (ball powders or smaller stick powders). If you can get some Varget powder then you should be covered for both .308 and .223/.222

3. Case capacity
As you rightly pointed out, a 0.3 grain difference will matter a lot more in a .222 case vs a .338LM case. You might encounter the problem of compressed charges further down the line, but really nothing to worry about. There are some guys who literally use a primed case as a scoop, credit card to strike off the excess powder at the neck and crunch a bullet down onto the powder (really depends on the components, don't try this!). Not best practise but hey ho it works for them!

Best of luck and enjoy.

Cheers. I have someone from my Nzda branch who is an experienced reloader showing me the ropes, and I'm actually reloading with his gear at his house while I slowly put together what I need to get started by myself so have that one covered.
After browsing alot of threads and doing plenty of reading I have decided to start with Adi AR2206H, measuring with Lee powder thrower and Hornady digital scales.

Poll results are useless without the cartridge size as context

Originally Posted by 300_BLK

Poll results are useless without the cartridge size as context

yes AND no......even with .222 sized cases.... the half grain (which is big jump) would be my way to go...not exceeding book max of course.... if for arguments sake book start load is something like 20grns going up to 24 grns thats 8 jumps....or 8x3 loads 24 to test.
IF YOU WERE starting at the start load...or the 10% below other load thing.....and you went with .2 of a grain that makes it 20 jumps and 60 loads to test....

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

yes AND no......even with .222 sized cases.... the half grain (which is big jump) would be my way to go...not exceeding book max of course.... if for arguments sake book start load is something like 20grns going up to 24 grns thats 8 jumps....or 8x3 loads 24 to test.
IF YOU WERE starting at the start load...or the 10% below other load thing.....and you went with .2 of a grain that makes it 20 jumps and 60 loads to test....

I go this route - Lot of work and expense but i dont get out much so i have the time. Never found a 'perfect' load for me between increments but could miss it if i dont look...

.222 is a low pressure cartridge, load specs to work in rear locking actions like the Anschutz 1700s. I have no concerns doing my initial .222 and .223 ladders up in .5 grain increments as long as you are focusing on accuracy, looking for pressure signs and not going stupid hunting velocity. 0.5 and 1 grain increments in 08, 06 and magnum cases.

As others have said 1% of case capacity as an initial test, then smaller increments between the two groups that shot best or +/- the best group.

There's no point in doing small increments with a large case when working up to max unless you particularly like wasting powder, primers and projectiles.

Thanks for all the responses so far.
Reading through them all, something about skinning a cat springs to mind...
Good to hear how different people approach it.
My reloading sensei (as @caberslash called it) said to me the other day before we began "this is just how I do it, somebody else will do it slightly differently"
How many of you are still loading with the same process and testing etc as when you first began reloading?
I'm guessing not many, as I've already seen from the responses that the process varies depending on many circumstances such as the calibre and purpose eg. Short range hunting round vs. Shooting F class
Cheers

I think it all depends for me what powder I am using and whether it's pistol or rifle and how close I am to published max loads. I have a lot of reloading manuals so I cross reference everything and do my research to get a consensus.

Originally Posted by Pav

Thanks for all the responses so far.
Reading through them all, something about skinning a cat springs to mind...
Good to hear how different people approach it.
My reloading sensei (as @caberslash called it) said to me the other day before we began "this is just how I do it, somebody else will do it slightly differently"
How many of you are still loading with the same process and testing etc as when you first began reloading?
I'm guessing not many, as I've already seen from the responses that the process varies depending on many circumstances such as the calibre and purpose eg. Short range hunting round vs. Shooting F class
Cheers

Greetings Pav,
Your question above got me thinking. Rather than major changes I seem to have refined the process as my understanding of it has increased. Initially I was limited partly by my equipment and partly lack of understanding. Time seems to deal with both of those. I moved from full length re sizing to neck sizing early on to help with brass life but now use minimal full length re sizing for some of the more tapered cases which seems to work better for them. Early on I chased the maximum velocities for my hunting rifles but currently am happy with the softer current book max loads with some exceptions. Rifles used for target shooting and my old soldiers get reduced loads. Interestingly my handloading started with a Lee Loader and a .303 which was none too successful for a number of reasons. Currently 50 years later I am loading for a .303 using a Lee Loader and reduced loads and getting good results. The difference is knowledge.
One thing I do quite differently now is the use of graphs in load development. I plot the load data from different sources on an A4 sheet of graph paper with velocity on the vertical axis and charge on the horizontal. This gives some interesting results. I then plot my chronographed selected start load and you can see how your powder and rifle compares with the various data sets. You need to make an adjustment for barrel length, about 20 fps per inch of difference for the two cartridges you mention.
Last year I wrote some articles that were published on the NZ Guns site. These are now open access so you can read them on line. One talked about graphs and loads for the 6.5 x 55 and there was a two part one on loads for the .308.
Happy to answer any specific questions.
Regards Grandpamac.

what was the difference using the lee loader @grandpamac
i am very much a novice and have been mucking about with one for some 303s. Or should i say 1, but have another in the wings

Well, not wanting to be too much of a contrarian, I like small steps, so 0.2gr would be my call. I'm having some success with the Eric Cortina method of load development, and small steps with powder weight and seating depth work for me (see some write-ups in the thread on this forum). I used to do 0.5grn steps, and 0.5grn steps might be OK in a 308, but I now do smaller steps. Definitely 0.2grn in your 222. And hey - good luck! Cheers, M

0.1 / 0.2 grains will make a difference in a small case like a hornet, 222, 223 etc; otherwise 0.5 grains in larger cases

Originally Posted by csmiffy

what was the difference using the lee loader @grandpamac
i am very much a novice and have been mucking about with one for some 303s. Or should i say 1, but have another in the wings

Greetings Csmiffy,
The chief finding with .303 rifles is that you have to load to suit the rifle. I think that my first .303 had an out of round chamber and cases sized in the Lee Loader chambered hard. I solved the problem by full length sizing which would have got me into trouble with head separations if the necks had not cracked on their second or third load. What I should have done (and now do) is to keep the pressures down to about 38,000 CUP or less to keep them from stretching. I could have also full length sized the cases just enough to allow them to chamber which would have reduced the stretching but would not have helped the neck cracking. The latter was likely due to the poor quality of CAC cases at the time. I have also found that a tight case fired with a light load chambers easily thereafter. I was only using start loads, 34 grains of AR2201 behind the 180 grain Norma projectiles, so I probably would have been able to go back to the Lee Loader after the first handload. Annealing would have solved the neck cracks as well. Alas as a newbie handloader with one manual (Reloading Simplified by Cyril Waterworth) and no mentor I had no idea. To find the no stretch pressure you can try a light load, say a start load or a little less with AR2206H and see if the primers back out a little. If so there is no case stretching. I am using 32 grains of AR2206H behind the 174 grain Hornady round nose in my scoped no4. This gives 2,080 fps and great accuracy. I have also tried 34 grains of AR2206 H behind the Norma 150 grain for about the same speed and good accuracy. The barrel is a two groove in new condition and a reasonably short leade. The 174 grains are seated 3mm short of touching.
Happy .303 loading,
Grandpamac.