I've got a jacket serrater die for that purposeQuote:
Originally Posted by kimjon
6 serrations IIRC. Not at home at the mo to check
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I've got a jacket serrater die for that purposeQuote:
Originally Posted by kimjon
6 serrations IIRC. Not at home at the mo to check
Rubbish pic, but you get the idea. Kim's sub-smasher V1.1
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...psaae9a6fe.jpg
Four slits cut lengthwise, starting a few mm from the hollow point nose. The idea is that the nose should tear off or expand on impact...then the jacket should rip apart along the four cut ''slits''. The rear section should remain fairly intact and would weigh about 160gr on its own, so hopefully this will smash its way right through both shoulders tearing a large hole along the way????
Well that's the idea anyway, only one way to find out? Will take it out for a hunt next week and see if the theory matches reality?
kj
Post up results :thumbup:
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The cannelure on the M193 causes it to break apart when it tips over, if speed is sufficient. The change over I believe was due to concerns about defeating body armor - M855 has a steel penetrator.Quote:
Originally Posted by hanse
Back on topic, what about a 110gr V max? Yay/nay?
Don't think the vmax would work being designed to be launched at well over 3k. The pistol pills do work just need to be heavyer .
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Roger, was just thinking thin jacket might = some degree of expansion at low velocity
Okay, getting serious now...the V1.1 sub-smasher is loaded ready to go. I'll load up ten or so and I'll take a day off work next week to find some goats to trial it on. Poor goats, they seam to be my default testing medium these days for all my projects.
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...psf0c6a2ce.jpg
If the general concept works out, then I'll make up a jig to get a more ''professional'' finish.
kj
looks like it could work. I have the powder now, all im waiting on is a decent projectile to start loading some of these for the 308. Following with interest
And slightly more serious (yes I have OCD), just to make sure that my results are based on a few kills (hopefully?)
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps8bfcdc01.jpg
kj
Let us know how they go
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
Results here http://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co.n...94/#post117907
kj
What thickness is the 240 SMK jacket in the nose section?
Ahh, you're onto it spanners, I just filed the tip off one to see and its real thick! Maybe 1mm and hard as fuck! The hollow point is only in the jacket material too, so nothing in the lead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanners
So this inspired V1.2
Braking news: Version 1.2 is now out!!!!
I filed the tip off, turns out the jacket material is very thick. Then I drilled a very long hole, and did my ''flutes'' as well, followed by using a primer flash-hole deburring tool to put a nice bevel on the inside of the hollow point.
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps2cd0cd54.jpg
Puling the bullet
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps9af7f64b.jpg
Drilling the massive hollow point hole (20mm deep)
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps9a6be89c.jpg
Cutting the flutes
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps57a89c5c.jpg
Deburring tool used to open up the front of hollow point
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...pseab35a33.jpg
V1.2 V1.1 and standard 240grSMK for comparison.
Now I just need some more time to fully test it again - fingers crossed?
kj
The jackets ill be using are Hornady AMP jackets.
Measure 0.4mm thick in the nose section
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/9azugepa.jpg
The pushed base 1st through this die
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/utyzu7ez.jpg
The core is seated with this punch to weaken the core nose
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/e6y5urup.jpg
Then hollow point cavity is made
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/he4y8u8u.jpg
Plastic or steel ball set into the hole then nose formed in 1.5 radius
On a note of progression, Vietnamcam made me some nice lead billet moulds which arrived today.
If the rain does down ill try and pour one and make some wire for the cores
A wee bit more professional looking than my backyard attempt. But hey, I'm still working out the bugs in the prototype.
I'll be very keen to see what results you get.
kj
Ill send you some up to have a play with when done
Will just be flat base as wont have chance to sort the rebates boat tails immediately
That sounds awesome, thank you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanners
kj
Id be keen on a few.
You'll get a few lolQuote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
Found an off cut of wire so had a play
1st 4 30 cal
All with serrated jackets and split cores
They are rough as I wanted to see what weights can be made
From left to right 230gr 1E, 245gr 1E , 245gr 1E hollow point, 245gr HP 6S nose
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/ajagy6en.jpghttp://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/haruhe2a.jpg
The big HP measures 8mm deep and 3mm wide
208 for size comparison
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/py8etapy.jpg
300 blackout/whisper case
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/y7ajuqy7.jpg
All on all pretty happy for what was nothing more that proving time for the sizing of dies.
Could prob go heavier on the lead tip HP and will go 220-230 on the ball tipped ones.
How light can you go? Im 1 in 11
Light as you want really within reason
I was just jamming lead in to see how heavy could go
200gr would prob work sweet with jacket closing around the nose of the ball like my 44 cal ones I did ages ago
Just for you cam- found another bit of wire
204gr with ~7mm ball in the hollow point - fits jacket perfect
Next to 235 RN
I fucked up point form on the yellow tip- too much pressure hence the dent in the top from the ejection pin
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/sa6upyha.jpg
Reckon they will stabilize out of 1/11 at 1050fps?
I think make em as frangible as you possibly can for a start, 200 odd grains is plenty of energy if you can just get most of it in the animal
Maybe not?
I'm out of wire to try a 180
Started to melt some lead on the BBQ today and it started to spit. Fuck that for a laugh!
Got all the possible bases covered that I can come up withQuote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
AMP jackets, serrated jackets, split core and ball to fill the tip and initiate exp
Molten lead and molten water dont mix ay ;)
Wasn't going to chance fateQuote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
Just went to mates and poured a couple of billets in Cams sweet mould tubes he made
Perfect!
Billets just shock straight out.
Wire making tomorrow :)
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/05/17/va9atypy.jpg
This is starting to get real interesting. Just one question; will the long bearing surface cause any perceivable issues?
Kj
Anyone no what a rem model 7 .308 twist rate is? ? Bearing surface looks huge on those first pills. Following with interest
Bearing surface IS huge
It will be reduced with the rebated boat tails and some more refinement work in the front end
I don't see it being an issue but if it is I have got a bore rider (stepped) die available if need be
I just wanted to make sure I could get into the top end of the weight range. 245+ is MORE than heavy enough as its prob getting to the end of a 1:8/9 twists usability
I'm running down the path of fragile front end and pushing the front end open from the inside out
No wire making this weekend as the button I have is for the 44s- forgot to sort the 30 cal
Arse
Will get it sorted Monday
Your targeting the black out guys obviously but if you could produce a sub pill that would perform in most 308 win(1/10 1/12) you would open up your market:)
Not the BLK guys- 30 cal :)
End of the day it doesn't matter if its a WM RUM 308 or BLK, if its doing 1050fps the performance is going to be the same
I started on this 'project' prob before the BLK come out.FINALLY coming together
It's a weight issue for twist
The big boys are going to need a fast twist obviously but the Balance is going to be almost the middle where the likes of a hybrid or Amax is a lot further back and need more RPM to stabilize
Time will tell
What do YOU want weight wise?
I would have thought 180grain would be pretty safe for stabilisation in most rifles whilst still having enough energy. As long as they EXPAND energy shouldn't matter AS much, dont think their will be enough energy for hydrostatic shock so you need lots of cutting edges and big frontal area to cause the trauma. my 2c
Im no expert on stabilisation, I want as heavy as my 1/11 twist will stabilise at 1050fps.......... and I want it to explode!:yaeh am not durnk:
Sorry to parrot this in two threads, but I thought I'd chuck it in here just in case someone does a search and doesn't look at the results in my other one.
Okay, its going to be a few weeks before I can take another day off work to ''test'' this ammo on some game, so being a little impatient I decided to shoot it into a bucket of water instead. I had the bucket on top of some loose (wet) sawdust from the calf shed (last years calf shit = this years garden mulch). The shot ruptured the sides of the bucket and I had to dig the bullet out of the sawdust after the shot:
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...psbea89968.jpg
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...pse186fc54.jpg
http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/a...psd20bab78.jpg
The long drill hole did its job, with two out of the four sides shearing completely off. If I were to take the cuts a little further forwards I believe that all four sides would shear off and that is basically what I'd call a success.
Next, to try it on some game to see if this is going to be a winner?
kj
What size was the HP and how deep?