Time for a re crown?

Hi Guys,

I'll paint the picture first and upload the photos tomorrow.

I went to try out some loads tonight and the results were puzzling. The guns a browning a-bolt in .270 and the recipe is:

59gr 2213sc
SST 130gr
once fired federal
OAL: 84.50mm
Velocity: 2965 (average) 22inch barrel

I'm only firing 3 shot groups. First 3 shot group terrible 2 1/2 inches. 2nd 3 shot looked good (would have been sub moa) - well the first 2 were, god knows where the 3rd went and I'm extremely concerned about this. Shot felt good and there was no way I pulled it that much that it went of the target. 3rd shot group was terrible. 4th shot group was moa. I ended the night by firing some factory winchester SP 130gr to see where they were shooting. 1st shot was well right - now not an issue if the other 2 followed suit but they didn't. The other 2 were still right but touching. The 1st shot that was right is about 4 inches away from the other 2.

Bit about the rifle - I employed a local "Gun Smith" to thread the barrel and fit a gunworks suppressor, well I wont get into that story except to say what a cock up!!! anyway, since it was being threaded it was being re crowned. A couple of guys have had a look at it and have said what a shit job. I wouldn't know as I thought this joker knew what he was doing. Now based on the above information re the targets - does this sound like I need to get my barrel re crowned?

I'm not worried about the above load as I'm going to be changing pills to sierra pro hunters so I get to start all over again :), but before I do I would like to get this issue sorted first.

I hope I'm making sense - if not let me know and I'll try too. Also i'm a very novice reloader as well

Thanks Guys :)
Grunta

Did it shoot before threading?

Good question, I should have put that in the original post.

Yes it shot factory 130gr sst well. The previous owner who reloaded shot sub moa. I hadn't tried any reloads through it before the threading. I don't really want to buy a box of factory sst again, I will if I have to but I've got some big financial commitments coming up so moneys a bit tight for the next few months. The only other issue would be the scope (bushnell elite 3200 4-12), but I haven't got another one to try out. I put this thread in the reloading section to see what you guys thought as I didn't think I would get that much variation with the same load. I'm not the flashest of shooters out there but I know when I pull a shot or not and the bad groups weren't down to pulled shots.

Maybe the shots are going through the same hole?

Check everything is tight scope/action screws etc, could be the old 60degree center jammed up the muzzle trick?

Shoot a couple groups without the supressor. Sounds like your clipping it if hes done a shit job on both the crown and threading it may not be square/true

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

put up some phots of the thread an crown?
Bullet not striking the can if its a shit job?

Thanks for the fast reply's. All screws etc are tight. I wish the 3rd bullet had gone through the same hole, but if it has it's a one in a million fluke as there's no indication sadly. I'm assuming your refering to the abolts 60 degree bolt lift veitnamcam? Could you please explain the center jammed up the muzzle trick? I don't have the suppressor fitted as it doesn't fit because the "Gun Smith" threaded my barrel before checking what the thread type was in the suppressor.

There's an engineer here that does work on his own rifles and said he would re crown it for me but since being burnt by the last "Gun Smith" I'm not sure I want to go down that path again as I don't want my barrel getting too short because of cockups, so I'm toying with the idea of sending it to Guworks like I should have in the first place, but the cost of postage is nearly the cost of recrowning. Sounding like a tight ass!! lol

Well, sounds like that "gunsmith" needs a good kick in the nuts. he should pay you back the money to take it to a real one and get it threaded properly for your suppressor.

sorting photos now

http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps2891ca89.jpg
This is my 2nd a 3rd shot group with the very bottom ones (touching) and the extreme right (1st shot) being the winchester loads. The top 2 shots above the bullseye were the second shot group and the shots to the right above the red tape is the 3rd group.
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/z...psae7e4ea3.jpg
First group for the night is above the bullseye with the last shot above the red tape
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps90284081.jpg
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps9cedd186.jpg
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/z...psda906382.jpg
http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps4ebdf6a3.jpg

Ah na I was refering to a live center up the muzzel which can push burrs up on the end of the lands.
As Creepingdeath said try it without the can.

A crown would have to be seriously fugly to make it shoot that badly? I have seen a rifle shooting fine with a recrown job done with a leatherman...

What does the bedding look like (did he bollox that up while he had it apart?)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

Ah na I was refering to a live center up the muzzel which can push burrs up on the end of the lands.
As Creepingdeath said try it without the can.

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Gotcha. Dont have the can as the threading was all wrong :(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cyclist

A crown would have to be seriously fugly to make it shoot that badly? I have seen a rifle shooting fine with a recrown job done with a leatherman...

What does the bedding look like (did he bollox that up while he had it apart?)

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I could just be a shit shot, lol, but I didn't think I would be that inconsistent. I am new to this reloading buzz but surely my reloads wouldn't be that bad considering the 3 velocity tests I did there was only a spread of 20fps which I thought was good. And i meticulously loaded the powder grains properly. The bedding job is good as far as I know. Previous owner re did it and I know for a fact he was shooting sub moa groups so I'm confident the rifle shoots well - or at least it did. As said above, I'm no gun slinger in any terms but I know when I pull shots and am honest about it and none of those wacky groups were pulled that bad. The thing that annoys me is I'm truly buggered as to where my 3rd shot went in my second group of the night.

Did you try other loads? What velocity were you getting with factory sst loads? Es doesn't dictate group size unfortunately. Not uncommon to have single digit es loads that just won't group then have loads with ~40 that produce very tight groups.

I had a rifle bought from trademe, threaded with a can. Guy I bought it from said he'd taken it as a trade and hadn't fired it but the guy before him told him it grouped well.

Groups were all over the place, no consistency at all. Can was working loose and some shots were clipping, but even without can it was hopeless - similar badness to what yours is doing. Checked screws etc, turned out out someone had packed the rear scope ring up with cardboard! Took the cardboard out, tightened things up again. POI 18" low at 100m on max elevation. Signature-zee rings sorted that, sometimes it would group ok-ish and sometimes all over the show or right off the paper for no apparent reason.

Finally got a gunsmith to look at it, he cut off what was some rough as guts off-centre threading and recrowned it - straight away it shot half inch groups with 3 or 4 different loads.

If yours was shooting ok before it was threaded/crowned then I'd say thats the problem.

Whats your scope/rjng combo
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Quote:

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Originally Posted by horihunter

Did you try other loads? What velocity were you getting with factory sst loads? Es doesn't dictate group size unfortunately. Not uncommon to have single digit es loads that just won't group then have loads with ~40 that produce very tight groups.

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Yes I've tried other loads, even ones that were shooting sub moa for the previous owner, thats why i'm a bit confused and can only put it down to it needing a re crown. I hear what yuour saying re the Es spread, I just assume that I could rule that out as a factor. I'm learning all the time about this reloading caper :) I don't know if I can trust the chrony setup I used to test the factory loads awhile ago - they were going around 2800fps and that was supeformance which doesn't seem right to me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GravelBen

Finally got a gunsmith to look at it, he cut off what was some rough as guts off-centre threading and recrowned it - straight away it shot half inch groups with 3 or 4 different loads.

If yours was shooting ok before it was threaded/crowned then I'd say thats the problem.

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I hope this will be the case with mine as well. fingers crossed

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CreepingDeath

Whats your scope/rjng combo
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

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Bushnell elite 3200 4 - 12. Warne 1 inch steel rings. The scope Has had a hiding a couple of times from assing over so I would agree that this could be a factor and one I will need to rule out.


Thanks for the replies again guys.

I'd start with the simple stuff.

If the barrel was fully floated and action nicely bedded before the thread/crown job then I'd recheck that your barrel is still fully floated and the action has been refitted correctly.

Also check the scope mounts, rings etc are tight.

That should only cost time.

Cheers
Pete

I would do as p38 suggests and then take it to a decent smith. Seeing as how it's not performing as it was they must have changed something to take it off the boil. If everything else is ruled out then it only leaves the crown

Hey Pete,

Barrels still fully floated. I've checked the rings etc as well. I've had a very generous offer from a forum member to have a look and re crown it for me which is awesome and unbelievable. Failing that - I'll see if I can grab a scope a mates rifle as that should be the only other problem I can foresee. Whatever the end result is I'll post up weather the issues been fixed or not, but I'm fairly confident it will be after the new crown job.

Cheers,
Grant

Quote:

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Originally Posted by P38

...and the action has been refitted correctly....

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Thats a good point - heard a story from a guy on another forum whose .17hm2 started shooting like absolute crap after he put a new stock on it. Turned out he'd forgotten the recoil lug when he put it back together!

I will be amazed if the crown is solely responsible for those groups.

Its more likely a combination of all the factors mentioned. Crown, average shooting, wonky reloads blah blah blah. It soon adds up to less than stellar results.

Average shooting - definitely a factor, wonky reloads - I was anal with the measurement of the powder this time (re check 3 x). I've got around 25 rounds left of this load before I'm changing pills so I'll get to restart again.