Maybe this is a silly question but even google can't seem to answer it for me, when reading different discussions around reloading I often see the term "ES" used. Anyone care to enlighten me?
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Maybe this is a silly question but even google can't seem to answer it for me, when reading different discussions around reloading I often see the term "ES" used. Anyone care to enlighten me?
Extreme Spread, difference between lowest and highest velocity.
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the lower this is the better. This CAN be a reflection of how consistent you reloading is.
15fps is great
80fps is shit
But all things aside, 80 fps is will not be an issue out to a fair distance😆Quote:
Originally Posted by Uplandstalker
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That's right in my F class rifle a drop of 70fps gives me 1 MOA lower impact point not really a problem in a hunting rifle until out past 500 metres,
at short range under 200 metres might not even notice it.
Thanks, just been out testing some loads and I was only getting 20fps or less difference between shots so i must be doing something right
Yup you are. That's pretty good. As good as you will ever need hunting at conventional ranges.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst
Start annealing and it could get even lower😆
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ES stands for 'extra shit' to worry about when a clover leaf is no longer enough :D
And here I was thinking enviroment southland
Is there a "traditional number" of shots ES is measured over ? The more shots you fire the bigger ES you are likely to observe, just like "spread of centres" group size.
I just shoot a one shot group, then my ES is amazing :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Bagheera
You're not alone mate, I suspect most of these "my factory rifle shoots 0.5 moa groups all day long" stories are due to single-shot groups :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
My best is ES of 6. Four shot group out of the Remmag. :) It doesn't mean much to me if the groups are shit though :DQuote:
Originally Posted by ebf
As a barrel heats up, speed will vary no matter how good your 1 shot ES is.😆
How much depends on your barrel and how anal you are at reloading your ammo.
I have tested 5 rnds over a half hour period and it was pretty good.
As said above low ES does not mean you will have good accuracy.
But as my rifle is a hunting rifle primarily and with shooting the odd bit of steel for shits n giggles I only see benifit in testing mine over time, cold bore.
I keep records or if I am lazy the V3 has all my strings recorded.
If your reloading practice is sound and you have a low ES over say 10 shots there is no reason not to assume it will be the same throughout.
If your a hunter shooting conventional ranges as long as it is under 100 fps it won't be an issue.
4 things that have improved my ES the most are weigh sorting, annealing, graphite and HBN coating my projectiles.
I sacrifice a bit of velocity by coating my projectiles but it's only a click or 2 on the dial at the end of the day.
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As already stated low ES doesn't guarantee a good group, conversely high ES doesn't necessarily give a bad group, well at 100yds at any rate. High ES will certainly affect vertical though at extreme ranges but for hunting purposes/ranges is not a problem. Bought my first box of factory ammo for many years, mainly to get the brass, and the ES was extremely shite up around 50fps, but the accuracy was shite also - Win 223.
The groups shot below were with my 6.5x47L (yeh the bottom 2 shots hardly qualifies as a group), 130gr Bergers, RL15. ES for 6 shots was high, nudging 30fps. Fired the first 2 shots and then adjusted up 2.5MOA and fired the last 4. Shot quickly, well at the speed I would normally shoot under F Class rifle range conditions. Decided to not use it as a long range load but to do a bit more development. Hopefully can reduce the ES but on the flipside the size of the group may grow.
Attachment 48101
I understand my optical chrony is not great but ive never had a duplicate x2 before. Shot 2666 x3 then 2672 then another 2666. Good group too :D
Hey r93Quote:
Originally Posted by R93
When you say graphite do you mean lubing inside neck with graphite or some other arcane practice I've never heard of?
Ive got some imperial neck media stuff ive been using it occasionally and can feel a slightly less resistance than without, but if your not ultrasonic cleaning the cases every time then a bit of a wire brush and the residual burnt carbon in the neck might do a similar job. I havent tested any loads yet with/without neck lube for reduced ES
i just dip my projectile boat tail down into the media and then seat it.
of course, unless you are talking about this type of ES:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gfNvTsSIGE :thumbsup:
Yup. Just got some graphite and filled container with some steel shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by WillB
Dip the necks in and swirl around.
You should notice the difference when seating a projectile.
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Cool thanks yeah I've got the same stuff, but mine came in a little jar with ceramic beads. Imperial. I also neck brush like you @scoped. Don't have a sonic cleaner.
Same dip pills in grafite, brass brush inside neck as part of case prep
Just out of curiosity, why did you adjust 2.5MOA, and not 1.25?Quote:
Originally Posted by zimmer
My guess, 200 zeroQuote:
Originally Posted by chalkeye
I adjusted to put the group where it ended up on purpose, just to have a different set of holes in a different place on the same target face.Quote:
Originally Posted by chalkeye
It was also a quick check at the time to see if my scope dialled correctly although that was secondary.
I was group shooting/load developing, not zeroing in. if I had been zeroing in I would have adjusted both elevation and windage to smack the guts outa it.
When group shooting there is no point blowing the centre out of your aiming mark as your group progresses.
You end up loosing your nice clean aiming mark.
That particular target is absolutely perfect for the centre of the scope reticle on that rifle (Sightron SIII Target Dot).
