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Thread: why???

  1. #1
    Member Micky Duck's Avatar
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    why???

    ok guys here goes
    the 7.62x39mm is an ok sort of a round I use one for close range bush stalking but limit range to 150yards maximum
    thats a 123-130 grn projectile at about 2400fps
    now along comes the new kid on the block the 6.5 grendal
    they tell me its the same case...fires a 123-130grn projectile at 2600fps
    yet its all of sudden its the ducks nuts and good for deer at all sorts of ranges 4-500yards


    also can anyone confirm that a 300blackout will fit loaded round into .223 chamber??????
    that sounds like recipy for a major dental rearrangement
    once upon a time cartridges were made so it couldnt fit in similar rifles..eg 30/06 into .270


    neither round does anything we couldnt already do yet they seem to be all the rage,anyone care to explain why they are so good because Im begiggered if I can see it.

  2. #2
    Almost literate. veitnamcam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micky Duck View Post
    ok guys here goes
    the 7.62x39mm is an ok sort of a round I use one for close range bush stalking but limit range to 150yards maximum
    thats a 123-130 grn projectile at about 2400fps
    now along comes the new kid on the block the 6.5 grendal
    they tell me its the same case...fires a 123-130grn projectile at 2600fps
    yet its all of sudden its the ducks nuts and good for deer at all sorts of ranges 4-500yards


    also can anyone confirm that a 300blackout will fit loaded round into .223 chamber??????
    that sounds like recipy for a major dental rearrangement
    once upon a time cartridges were made so it couldnt fit in similar rifles..eg 30/06 into .270


    neither round does anything we couldnt already do yet they seem to be all the rage,anyone care to explain why they are so good because Im begiggered if I can see it.
    Firstly I am not real familiar with any of those cartridges/chamberings but my take on it would be.

    Better range of higher bc bullets designed for game available in 6.5 mm
    Better brass in a bolt action enabling higher pressures to be run? otherwise more velocity from the same case but with a smaller bore size is physically impossible.

    On to the blackout...cant see how a 30 cal would chamber in a 22 cal but the reverse may be possible? in which case a low pressure bullet rattling down the bore should result.
    "Hunting and fishing" fucking over licenced firearms owners since ages ago.

  3. #3
    Member scotty's Avatar
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    From Wikipedia
    change needed is the barrel.[13]

    Misuse[edit]

    The very advantage of the 300 BLK -its similarity to the popular .223/5.56 caliber- can also be a safety issue if ammunition of the two calibers is mixed. Because of similar chamber dimensions between the two calibers, SAAMI has listed the combination of using a 300 BLK round in a .223 chamber as unsafe.[1] Since the bullet of the 300 BLK is larger than the bore of the .223 caliber, chambering and firing would cause excessive pressure to build up since the bullet has nowhere to go, which can cause the rifle to explode resulting in risk of injury or death. Since the mix up easily can be done, some suggest owners of firearms in both calibers to carefully separate firearm and ammunition of the two types by for instance clearly marking the firearms and magazines, and visually inspect every round while loading magazines.[14] Whether a 300 BLK cartridge actually is able to chamber in a .223 barrel depends on bullet length and shape, bullet seating depth, crimping, and the volume of powder charge. Ideally, cartridges would use one of the longer projectiles, a case-filling powder charge, and have the projectile crimped into place.

    According to BearingArms.com, two shooters destroyed their rifles, chambered for .223 or 5.56 rounds, by mistakenly using handloaded 300 AAC Blackout cartridges in them.[15][16]
    Micky Duck likes this.

  4. #4
    Member scotty's Avatar
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    I think the grendel and blk were specifically designed for the AR platform as the soviet 7.62 wasn't a good fit not really a better cartridge just a more compatible

  5. #5
    Member rossi.45's Avatar
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    the part your missing Micky is the difference between case / chamber design . . . the 7.62x39 is a loose fit 1940s battle rifle job with stumpy little usually cheap bullets, the majority of rifles chambered in it are likewise loose in every department.
    now if you build a 7.62x39 with close tolerances in good cases with great bullets with a dialup scope i am sure you could increase your range some . . but its a cheap as chips rifle so who would, thats not its appeal.

    the Grendal owes more to the PPC design which is a benchrest cartridge of some fame which came from the Russian but with major modifications . . . it does matter.
    and people will push the range out on any cartridge maybe more than they should . . .

    im thinking how can you push a .30 caliber case neck into a .22 chamber .. . .


    " neither round does anything we couldnt already do yet they seem to be all the rage,anyone care to explain why they are so good because Im begiggered if I can see it. "

    there are major differences that will be an improvement for some applications for poeple wanting that extra performance . . . i take my hat off to them
    Last edited by rossi.45; 29-07-2017 at 08:55 AM.
    without a picture . .. it never happened !

  6. #6
    Member rossi.45's Avatar
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    oooops . . . . just had a thought, the 30 Blk is a shorter case so it could chamber in a .223
    without a picture . .. it never happened !

  7. #7
    Caretaker jakewire's Avatar
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    I truly don't understand why anyone would bother
    The solution has been about for over 100 yrs
    just buy a 30-30.
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

  8. #8
    Member rossi.45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakewire View Post
    I truly don't understand why anyone would bother
    The solution has been about for over 100 yrs
    just buy a 30-30.
    totally agree, if your a handloader, limit yourself to 200grn. bullets, like leverguns, Yip . . . but if you want it in a AR or short action bolt gun with factory ammo the Blk wins hands down
    without a picture . .. it never happened !

  9. #9
    Member Beavis's Avatar
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    If you run the numbers through a calculator, of what people are reporting/claiming velocity wise with 123gr loads in a Grendel, it's roughly equal to a .243 shooting garden variety hunting loads. Granted, a .243 with modern VLD type projectiles, will piss all over a Grendel, but I still consider it to be pretty impressive performance from an AR15. I got that from comparing a 95gr 6mm SST @3000fps MV, to a 123gr SST @ 2500fps MV. They're pretty close to each other at 300m in terms of retained velocity and energy. Another reported advantage is the case life of Grendel brass is excellent when looked after. This is all academic, I am yet to do it myself. Hopefully I pick up all my brass and bullets next week.

  10. #10
    Member Beavis's Avatar
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    If anybody follows 8541 Tactical on youtube, he is just starting down the Grendel road as well
    He did a comparison to his 175gr SMK .308 load he has used in PRS competition. Grendel edges it out in terms of wind drift, drop and retained velocity at basically any distance. This is with Hornady factory ammo running 123gr ELD-M. Again, he will need to actually do it to confirm.

  11. #11
    Member john m's Avatar
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    They are not all lever guns.Name:  20161201_172055.jpg
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    Pointy bullets too. Name:  20160915_213109.jpg
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    Velocity is thrilling,but diameter does the real killing.

  12. #12
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    I've had a 7.62x39 in a Ruger mini30 many years ago and accounted for many a dead deer. I'm not going to argue on what's the best caliber as you can dailup on any to hit your target.

    Don't be a muppet and do this.
    https://www.nrablog.com/articles/201...k-ar15-kaboom/

  13. #13
    Member Marty Henry's Avatar
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    Whats the rifle? Looks like its rear locking. I used to have a h&r topper single shot in 3030. I used to seat the bullets way out and use spitzers, squeezed a few extra grains in and really upped the performance.

  14. #14
    Member john m's Avatar
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    Name:  20160913_153358.jpg
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    Name:  20160913_153346.jpg
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    Marty Henry likes this.
    Velocity is thrilling,but diameter does the real killing.

  15. #15
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    Heard they made them in that cal but never seen one...

    CZ and a few others do 7.62x39 in bolt guns, Norinco do one that can be great or atrocious depending on spec and actual factory. They are surprisingly useful little rifles, the original bushpig without the pricetag and hype.

    Also of interest, the single shot rifles in 7.62x39 - minimal recoil and hardly any bulk. Next project...

 

 

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