beginner varmint hunter

Hi Guys

Just joined the forum today to get some info on varmint hunting.
Ive been hunting most my life from the age of 4-5 i would tag along with my Dad and tho I have done alot of bigger game hunting I have relocated to a part of the country where the biggest wild game is feral pigs....No Deer no goats no nothing.

So because of this ive decided that small game varmint shooting is the way to go, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of Cats rabbits possums magpies etc around here.
Ive had a bit of a read thru the varmint forum but have a few questions that id hope you guys could fill me in on.

Caliber: I own a .17hmr that I use for bunnies but I am looking at stepping it up a notch size wise for wind distance etc and am leaning towards the .223 or the .204, the .204 has always sparked an interest from the reading I have done about this round but I hear stories about how wind effected it is and have been told it burns out barrels quickly.
how many rounds would you expect to get thru a barrel with this round before it goes pear shaped?
most of the areas I shoot at the moment I wouldnt expect to get a shot out on a critter past 200m but there would be the odd to push one further. with this in mind and the odd pig would the .223 be a better option with the larger range of pill sizes?


Optics: with both these calibers what scopes would best suit this style of shooting? I currently have mill dot style hold over scopes on my larger game rifles but have been mucking around with a target turret style scope as of late.

other equipment: is there any other equipment you would recommend carrying on a varmint hunt as in binoculars etc.

I am planing on setting up in likely spots to wait for the game to present itself.

im sure ill have a million other questions will post them as they come up

cheers

.223. Save up for a 25" Harris bipod and you will have a ball.

A longer scope (4-12) makes life perfect.

Note other threads discussions re your barrel twist rate and pill size. Faster twist (1:8) = heavier pills (up to 75gn) instead of the usual 55gn. Which is fine through 1:12 twist barrels

And you can reload- though the H&F rebranded Hornady factory stuff works ok @ $1/shot

If you're using this calibre on larger animals (pig/deer) shot placement is vital. My .223 is not my go-to rifle if deer stalking.

You'll get heaps of advice on here. Pick up a few models in the shops. Find what fits YOU as well as your budget.

You're investing, not spending money. Remember that. Buy what u can afford that is most fit for purpose.

Ask questions and watch the for sales on here!

Go the 223. I have a dedicated varment rig that i an happy with. Ar15 with suppressor, Harris bipod and dial up scope shooting 50g v or z max projectiles. It's like a 10/22 for grown ups.

best binos you can afford . .


R

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SiB

.223. Save up for a 25" Harris bipod and you will have a ball.

A longer scope (4-12) makes life perfect.

Note other threads discussions re your barrel twist rate and pill size. Faster twist (1:8) = heavier pills (up to 75gn) instead of the usual 55gn. Which is fine through 1:12 twist barrels

And you can reload- though the H&F rebranded Hornady factory stuff works ok @ $1/shot

If you're using this calibre on larger animals (pig/deer) shot placement is vital. My .223 is not my go-to rifle if deer stalking.

You'll get heaps of advice on here. Pick up a few models in the shops. Find what fits YOU as well as your budget.

You're investing, not spending money. Remember that. Buy what u can afford that is most fit for purpose.

Ask questions and watch the for sales on here!

---

Pretty much what he said.

A .223 Tikka, Remington, Howa or similar bolt action with a heavy-ish barrel and good scope in the 4-12 or 4-16 range would be ideal.

A good suppressor as well.

Learn to handload. It's not hard or expensive to do it well.

223 1:8 twist.
It depends on how far you want to shoot. If max 200 either calibre will do. But personally I wouldn't go lower than .224. Rabbits and the likes are small. high magnification scopes are good. 20+ power is good. Just keep in mind if shots are close you want a fairly low magnification too. I get by with a minimum of 6.5 power scope.
Range finding binos are good. Take a look at the Bushnell fusion. Again fairly high power is good. I think the bigger ones are 12 power.
Round count or barrel life is subjective. It depends on how tight a group you expect.
Tight groups are handy with small critters, therefore i recommend the tikka 223 1:8 twist, they usually group tight. And if you, or if you move into hand loading the 1:8 really comes into its own.
Hand loading gives you the ability to shrink those groups down further again, and use heavier higher BC bullets to better buck the wind. Or more suitable weights for the pigs you may find.

Hey bud, firstly welcome to the forum and good to see both the next generation of shooter coming up and a varmint shooter to boot, good stuff.
Your questions are good ones and often asked.
I am pretty much a varmint shooter through and through so have some idea's also like the above postings to your question.
I had a .223 which I loved, awesome caliber and versatile enough to shoot a rabbit at 300 mtrs plus or knock over a close in Deer with a well placed shot.
I sold it and got a .17hmr and within 6 months had sold it for a ............................223 for more range and knock down.

Came full circle , there are plenty of other great calibers for rabbits but they generally are more expensive to shoot per round.
223 has a massive range of brass, primers, and powder / projectiles both in factory loads and reloading .
As the guys said a Tikka is hard to go past, I don't run the 1/8 twist but just a 1/12 twist. For varmints the 1/12 is great as you want to shoot light bullets for max velocity and damage ( my opinion )
Brands to look at are Tikka, Howa, Savage, Remington, there are some great models and shit models within those brands , particularly Savage and Remington, CZ are awesome but will be more pricey.

Scopes are a whole subject within itself, nothing less than a 4-16 power in my experience. As Rossi said, Bino's are a must, my most used piece of gear for spotting rabbits.
Bipod and suppressor also will be needed at some stage.
Hope this helps , all the guys will have a slightly different idea as some things work well for some guys and give good results so that becomes the bible for them.

Ditch the 17 mate, once you pull off a 300mtr plus shot on a rabbit you ill be hooked.

I had a 204 for a while, ended up selling it and getting a 223 instead for a bit more versatility - heavier projectiles giving more options for larger animals etc.

That was due to the rifle as well as the round to be fair, it was a heavy barrelled varmint rifle that weighed 10lb bare, lovely to fire from a bipod but a bitch to carry anywhere or shoot offhand. Switched to a sporter weight 223 that is a much better all-rounder and just as accurate (both Savages but different models).

Depending where you shoot, it may also be worth considering DOC's somewhat arbitrary restriction in its hunting permit conditions that only calibres .222 and larger are permitted.

All good advice all I can add is what I use for varmint shooting I use a 222 and shoot 55 gn bullets in that one my other rig/ rigs are a couple of 22 hornets the 222 and one hornet have 4x12x42 scopes and the other hornet has a 3x9x40 and the hornets shoot 35gn bullets you'll need to hand load to get a hornet accurate

I have a different view from the above. First how many rounds are you hopping to shoot every year?
If your rounds count is going to be high and your distance limited to 300 m then yes 223 make sense.

But if your varmint victims are going to be a limited number ( under a 100 per year) and shot quite far then I would look at 204 ruger, 22-250 ( AI if you reload) or even 243. The later two could take care of a deer or a pig as well with the proper bullet ( dual loads).
Although a mate of mine has shot a 40 kg boar with a 204 ruger and I have seen a few farm pigs being shot with 17 hmr ( I don't say they are adequate for the task and I would not recommend them for that).

Scope wise and binocular wise, as above. You would although do well with a small rear bag of some sort to get super stable on your bipod when shooting far.
Reloading your own ammo is essential also if you want to achieve the ultimate accuracy and you might save a bit of $$ if you go with something else than 223.
Rig wise, if you are very static or/and shoot a lot, then you might look at a heavier barrel, if not a standard barrel if fine. Avoid the ultra light barrels ( Remington 7, kimber, savage ultra light...). Free floating barrels with a good bedding is essential.
Good luck

As mentioned above both the calibres you have mentioned are good for varminting. Both have pro's and cons.

In an ideal world I would get a 204 over a 223 if you are varminting. From what I have seen, they are not the barrel burners that the 22/250s are.

With Varminting you get longer ranges on small critters easier with smaller flatter shooting projectiles and the 204 does this very well with a very small 30grain projectile going down range very fast. I have seen guys hit magpies at 350m or more.

The 223 is a bit moe versatile but again there are trade offs.

The 1:7 or 1:8 twist ones work well with the heavier ranges of projectiles such as 55gr, 62gr right up to 75gr, but for varminting where even the humble 22LR punches clean through your game, you dont need to retain energy with the heavier bullet and the lighter 35gr and 40gr ones are brilliant. But these really need the slower 1:12 twist to get the best acuracy.

For rabbits etc at 200+ metres you need a decent scope. I would not go below a 4-16 and would actually suggest 6-24 would be better. A rabbit at 300m is a very small target in a 4-12. And with a proper varmint rig there is no reason that you wont get out to 300m.

Finally, varminting rigs tend to be heavier for a more stable platform and repeat accuracy after multiple shots so are not condusive to lots of carrying so if you want a gun to chase pigs, get a bigger calibre suited to the task rather than compromise on your varminter.

I tend to agree with the guys above, while I have several dedicated varmint rifles, the .223 is the most versatile, esp for NZ conditions, were we go hunting for small game ,and may take a deer or pig should the opportunity, present its self,
Get a good pr Binos, a bi pod or something for a front rest,(small back pack with a rolled up swani) and a .223 or .222, with a accurate load, in the 50-55g weight, a scope of 12-16 power, a sound moderator and your golden for starting out. Once you get into it you can and likely will, modify your gear,
Nothing wrong with the .204, its likely the better varmint cal, but its not legal on crown land, nor as versatile.

I have over 2000 rounds threw my CZ .204, seen as you asked, I Know of rifles with over 6000-7000, I have been working and living in Canada for several years, and, do quite a bit of varminting on ground squirrels, (size of a rat) nothing to shoot 500 plus in a day, barrel life depends on powder burnt, heat and maintenance,(cleaning), I would expect a well maintained .223 to do close to 6-10000 rounds.
for this high volume shooting, like the varmint field in Canada, I favour .17 hornet, .17 fireball,:thumbsup: but just sold my .204 for a .20 vartarg.

Nz you won't get that sort of numbers, start of with a general purpose .22 cal centerfires,(.222,.223) and then if you decide to, get a dedicated varminter like, .17 fireball, .204, .20 tac,.17 hornet etc.

I shoot .223 and .22-250. For walk around shooting I use the .223 (AR and T3), and for shooting off fixed position I use the .22-250 as its a little flatter and the ranges a typically longer. I agree with Friwi. If your rabbit numbers a low(ish), go bigger in caliber and have the flexibility to hit whatever presents its self. .243 is a good option.
I use the .223 because of cost. I'll reload 1,000 at a time to take rabbit shooting for 3-4 day stays and use it all, then switch over to the 800 rounds of .22-250.

A couple of things to consider from experience:
1. If you are shooting longer ranges, and you want to be able to see the destruction of the bullet impact, think about recoil. With the .223 and smaller size cases the recoil is very low so you will see the hit 99% of the time. With the .22-250 the recoil is just high enough that at times, you will miss the impact as it will be outside of the field of view of your scope.
2. Scope magnification - don't go too high. I personally have a range of scopes up to 20x but usually have them set at around 14x as this is typically the best compromise between field of view for finding the rabbits and being able to see the impact. I personally find the Vortex 4-16 FFP a very good option as the reticle remains calibrated regardless of power setting, and I only have time to undertake holdover, not dial up.
3. Good Bino's are a must for lower light rabbit spotting from a fixed position. If you want small, then I recommend the LEICA ULTRAVID 10X25. If yo are going larger bodied, the choces are better, and based on what I looked through at the recent Sika show, I would be looking at the mid range Leupolds. You can spend way more money, but I struggled to see the value. Better to have a cheaper optic and use the crap out of it an replace it than spend mega bucks and be scared to mark them.
4. HAVE FUN!

When hunting/shooting small game -accuracy is king

Use whatever you enjoy most and puts a smile on yer dial


Fast twist .223

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7mmsaum, zero taper bull barrel, Houston Warehouse length :)

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Thanks Guys for all the information its alot to absorb and process.

realistically I dont think I will shoot more than 100 rounds a year from this gun but I would like to think I will.
I do own a rem 700 in .243 already which I have had the barrel floated properly,action bedded and trigger lightened. it has a sporter barrel on it and no suppressor. I use this rifle for deer and would rather have a separate rifle for varmint shooting.

Im happy to use a longer heavy barrel on a varmint rig as I plan on setting up in a likely spot and glassing for targets.
theres not alot of crown land around here that would be suitable for shooting over 50m as its quite dense bush. most of my shooting will be done on private land and open forestry areas.

so to recap. with a .223 ill have more versatility with a range of projectiles but if only using as a varmint rig better off with a 1-12 twist over a 1-8 ?
and if only using as a varmint rig it maybe a better option to go for the .204 and learn to reload?

I do plan on learning to reload in time. I have been looking at the savage model 12 fcv as well as the model 12 low profile and also wondered if the model 10 predator would make a good option due to its 24 inch barrel medium contour barrel making it slightly lighter but really its only half a pound.
ive never really been a big fan of tikka but ive never owned one, they just dont come up well on me.

when a suppressor is fitted to a varmint rig how many inchs would i expect to be taken off? giving a final length of...?

don't get a new rifle, get into reloading now if you already have a .243 - you have one of the best Dual Purpose calibers around.

get a better varmint style stock if you have to - a better dual purpose scope - get out there and do it.

R.

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Originally Posted by planb

Thanks Guys for all the information its alot to absorb and process.

realistically I dont think I will shoot more than 100 rounds a year from this gun but I would like to think I will.
I do own a rem 700 in .243 already which I have had the barrel floated properly,action bedded and trigger lightened. it has a sporter barrel on it and no suppressor. I use this rifle for deer and would rather have a separate rifle for varmint shooting.

Im happy to use a longer heavy barrel on a varmint rig as I plan on setting up in a likely spot and glassing for targets.
theres not alot of crown land around here that would be suitable for shooting over 50m as its quite dense bush. most of my shooting will be done on private land and open forestry areas.

so to recap. with a .223 ill have more versatility with a range of projectiles but if only using as a varmint rig better off with a 1-12 twist over a 1-8 ?
and if only using as a varmint rig it maybe a better option to go for the .204 and learn to reload?

I do plan on learning to reload in time. I have been looking at the savage model 12 fcv as well as the model 12 low profile and also wondered if the model 10 predator would make a good option due to its 24 inch barrel medium contour barrel making it slightly lighter but really its only half a pound.
ive never really been a big fan of tikka but ive never owned one, they just dont come up well on me.

when a suppressor is fitted to a varmint rig how many inchs would i expect to be taken off? giving a final length of...?

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Howa made some 1:12 twist 223s but their mini action is a 1:7 I think. They make a good platform for varmint rigs too.

As for length, most suppressors stick out 3 inches (ish) from the muzzle so if you dont want your rifle getting too long then take that much off and it stays the same overall length. But if you are unsure, don't shorten it. You can always rethread it later and drop another inch off for about $70, but adding it back on one it is gone is effectively impossible as you will likely have a rebarrel and start again type task....The reason most shorten barrels when suppressing is to offset any weight gain and length. With a varminter this is not really an issue so the decision is all yours.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by planb

so to recap. with a .223 ill have more versatility with a range of projectiles but if only using as a varmint rig better off with a 1-12 twist over a 1-8 ?
and if only using as a varmint rig it maybe a better option to go for the .204 and learn to reload?

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A 1:8 twist let's you shoot higher b.c bullets which will come into effect after around 300 yards. To go with it a dialable scope to dial out error.
A 1:12 is relying on fast flat shooting light bullets, where often shooters don't use a dialable scope as there is little error in a flat bullet trajectory, yet this may only work to about 300 yards with success. Sure you can use a dialable scope on this set up. But after 300 bullet bc is your friend.

Hay mate

My advise would be along the same lines as others.

get your self a fast twist barrel in a t3 and buy the best binos you can afford.

Get a small off cut of closed cell foam to sit on and you're sorted. (Piece off a sleeping mat or thinner is amazing for comfort)

How did you go with this?
I loved my Tikka .223 in 12 twist.. shot the 50-55 grain loads like lazers.

Will get another when funds allow. Had to sell to get a Nightforce scope that was too good to miss out on!

Hey Plan B
All the advice above is spot on. If you read between the lines, you will end up with 2 rifles ... which is what I have.
For static varminting - a .204 sporter varmint barrel (Kimber), turret scope up to 20 power (Zeiss) with a suppressor (MAE) and a nice trigger job, bipod & 10X power bino's ... and a pain to carry.
For walk-around farm varminting - a .233 normal barrel, mildot scope up to 14 power with a nice trigger & 10X power bino's ... and way easier to carry.
General comments - if you burn out a barrel, then that's just wonderful as you will have done a shed load of shooting. If there is a chance of pigs - take the .243, but I have shot plenty of pigs with my .223. Wind - with the distances you are shooting this won't be too much of an issue. I shoot Tekapo heaps with my .204 and I use the iStrelok iPhone app and just dial it in. I'm consistently nailing vermin out to 400yds in 10-15mph winds. Harris bipod as a minimum as the cheaper ones will rust. Bino's - you will only ever need one pair in your LIFE so invest in quality. Over 15 years, I bought 3 pairs before buying Leica but I couldn't afford the big ones so only have the ultralight ones. Optics - never underestimate the pleasure of shooting through a good scope. Once again - invest here (before the Leica's). I am thinking of putting a very lightweight suppressor on my walk-up .223 as its just so much more pleasurable for a little more weight.
All the best - keep safe in the hills.

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Originally Posted by bully

223 1:8 twist.
It depends on how far you want to shoot. If max 200 either calibre will do. But personally I wouldn't go lower than .224. Rabbits and the likes are small. high magnification scopes are good. 20+ power is good. Just keep in mind if shots are close you want a fairly low magnification too. I get by with a minimum of 6.5 power scope.
Range finding binos are good. Take a look at the Bushnell fusion. Again fairly high power is good. I think the bigger ones are 12 power.
Round count or barrel life is subjective. It depends on how tight a group you expect.
Tight groups are handy with small critters, therefore i recommend the tikka 223 1:8 twist, they usually group tight. And if you, or if you move into hand loading the 1:8 really comes into its own.
Hand loading gives you the ability to shrink those groups down further again, and use heavier higher BC bullets to better buck the wind. Or more suitable weights for the pigs you may find.

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I agree about the Tikka .223 1:8,I aquired one before Christmas and I'm lovin it.

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Originally Posted by northdude

All good advice all I can add is what I use for varmint shooting I use a 222 and shoot 55 gn bullets in that one my other rig/ rigs are a couple of 22 hornets the 222 and one hornet have 4x12x42 scopes and the other hornet has a 3x9x40 and the hornets shoot 35gn bullets you'll need to hand load to get a hornet accurate

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I too shot a Hornet,great calibre.

old thread but may as well keep it going. After a few targets the other day i took one of the hornets for a walk as im quite happy shooting magpies as they are quite a challenge sometimes ended up getting 2 with the krico hornet