Thread: 223 on deer

I know a few people that shoot deer with a 223 but its not a caliber I would recommend any new shooters using on deer unless you are confident you can get a good kill shot to the head.
I think the main reason they use 223 is the cheap ammo cost and low recoil.

Originally Posted by Old_School

I know a few people that shoot deer with a 223 but its not a caliber I would recommend any new shooters using on deer unless you are confident you can get a good kill shot to the head.
I think the main reason they use 223 is the cheap ammo cost and low recoil.

thats part of the problem.....a headshot ISNT the easiest or best shot to take...the neck is just as quick of killer and allows more room for error..a quartering away shot in the crease....tight in behind nearside leg angling forwards is by far and away the most CERTAIN killing shot with most room for error...yes animal may move off a small distance..but with no oil in the engine it wont be going far.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

thats part of the problem.....a headshot ISNT the easiest or best shot to take...the neck is just as quick of killer and allows more room for error..a quartering away shot in the crease....tight in behind nearside leg angling forwards is by far and away the most CERTAIN killing shot with most room for error...yes animal may move off a small distance..but with no oil in the engine it wont be going far.

The only time I've ever shot a deer in the neck was wish a 243 from 150 yards the bullet penciled through about 3 to 5 mm away from the spine and it did nothing. It penciled through and the deer just stood there shaking its head in pain and I had to shoot it in the head after that . So I've never taken another neck shot since it's either a headshot or a heart and lungs shot .

Sent from my SM-S918B using Tapatalk

@Old_School back about 10 years ago NZ Hunter put out a chapter in thier magazine titled calibres for under 16s find it and have a good read,sit on it for a week then read it again...really down to earth no bullshit look at what is a tricky balancing act
off top of head/from memory
the top options were in no particular order as my memory isnt perfect
243
223
7.62x39mm
22-250 got a mention as did a down loaded .308
the creedmores and grendals werent readily avialable then but the gist of article was well worth getting head around
I own a very accurate .223 but bought a 7.62x39mm for our Son to learn with.... considering we keep ranges below 150yards either kills well but the x39mm gave more room for error....didnt help us when I misjudged range resulting in the only deer Ive ever had wounded and not recovered...not for lack of trying...a flatter shooting 243 would have cancelled my error
suppressors have made many previously unsuitable cartridges entirely OK for young folks..look at how many 6-7-8-9 year olds are shooting first deer with Dads .308-270-30/06 etc etc prior to suppressors it just wouldnt happen as recoil is no good for learner thus the 222-223 was often used under strict supervision and for short range..100yards n under.... it works as this whole thread shows IF YOU DO YOUR BIT..get in close enough and place pill well enough.

Originally Posted by Old_School

I know a few people that shoot deer with a 223 but its not a caliber I would recommend any new shooters using on deer unless you are confident you can get a good kill shot to the head.
I think the main reason they use 223 is the cheap ammo cost and low recoil.

I would like to respectfully disagree with you there. Not sure if you have looked at all of the posts in this thread, but there is plenty of hard evidence that a .223 (especially using heavy for caliber bullets) is more than adequate for deer.

By your logic would you prefer a new shooters to use a long action or magnum cartridge instead? If getting a bullets in the vitals is the objective, I’ll put my salary on a newbie having a far higher hit rate with the .223…

Originally Posted by Hunter_Nick

I would like to respectfully disagree with you there. Not sure if you have looked at all of the posts in this thread, but there is plenty of hard evidence that a .223 (especially using heavy for caliber bullets) is more than adequate for deer.

By your logic would you prefer a new shooters to use a long action or magnum cartridge instead? If getting a bullets in the vitals is the objective, I’ll put my salary on a newbie having a far higher hit rate with the .223…

Look, you probably have a point, there is alot ive been going through in this thread.
When I was looking at rifles at H&F, the guy there steered me away from .223 which i was inquiring about since my friends recommended i go that way.
He told me they wont easily take down a deer unless you hit in the right spot, in saying that, my friends mostly go for head/neck shots most of the time, he does also use 7mm08 a fair bit too.
Perhaps the shopkeeper felt since i was an adult, and not a 16yo that it would be more suitable for me to go for something larger?
Im not saying that a younger shooter should not jump in with a .308/303 or any other heavy caliber either, but there are other options.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

@Old_School back about 10 years ago NZ Hunter put out a chapter in thier magazine titled calibres for under 16s find it and have a good read,sit on it for a week then read it again...really down to earth no bullshit look at what is a tricky balancing act
off top of head/from memory
the top options were in no particular order as my memory isnt perfect
243
223
7.62x39mm
22-250 got a mention as did a down loaded .308
the creedmores and grendals werent readily avialable then but the gist of article was well worth getting head around
I own a very accurate .223 but bought a 7.62x39mm for our Son to learn with.... considering we keep ranges below 150yards either kills well but the x39mm gave more room for error....didnt help us when I misjudged range resulting in the only deer Ive ever had wounded and not recovered...not for lack of trying...a flatter shooting 243 would have cancelled my error
suppressors have made many previously unsuitable cartridges entirely OK for young folks..look at how many 6-7-8-9 year olds are shooting first deer with Dads .308-270-30/06 etc etc prior to suppressors it just wouldnt happen as recoil is no good for learner thus the 222-223 was often used under strict supervision and for short range..100yards n under.... it works as this whole thread shows IF YOU DO YOUR BIT..get in close enough and place pill well enough.

Yes good advice, one of my friends had a 7.62x39 and was a great rifle, not much recoil, but still had plenty of punch at your target.
But most shops ive spoken too have recommended .308 to me, I think price and availability of ammo was also one factor in all of this.

Regarding .223 ammo, i also assume there is quite a variety to choose from and correct ammo selection would be critical.

Originally Posted by Old_School

Look, you probably have a point, there is alot ive been going through in this thread.
When I was looking at rifles at H&F, the guy there steered me away from .223 which i was inquiring about since my friends recommended i go that way.
He told me they wont easily take down a deer unless you hit in the right spot, in saying that, my friends mostly go for head/neck shots most of the time, he does also use 7mm08 a fair bit too.
Perhaps the shopkeeper felt since i was an adult, and not a 16yo that it would be more suitable for me to go for something larger?
Im not saying that a younger shooter should not jump in with a .308/303 or any other heavy caliber either, but there are other options.



Yes good advice, one of my friends had a 7.62x39 and was a great rifle, not much recoil, but still had plenty of punch at your target.
But most shops ive spoken too have recommended .308 to me, I think price and availability of ammo was also one factor in all of this.

Regarding .223 ammo, i also assume there is quite a variety to choose from and correct ammo selection would be critical.

I do `t have too much experience of using 223 and 556 NATO, but I did have some experience of using 7.62x39 and 54r on multiple platforms before. Talking about humane kill, in my humble opinion first is you can hit the kill spot, not two MOA away. 7.62x39 is not designed for accurate shooting out of 80m, it `s for close quarters. Once before I was thinking use bow for hunting since I have encountered many deer, goats, pigs in where I can `t use firearms, but I gave it up. I can use bow to hit a target out of 40m, but I do `t think the energy left could kill a goat instantly, unless the arrow punch through the heart or head.
I was that close to buy a bushmaster in Auckland before the event in Chch since I shot M16A1 regularly once a year before, and that was sweet. 7.62x39....no

Originally Posted by Old_School

I know a few people that shoot deer with a 223 but its not a caliber I would recommend any new shooters using on deer unless you are confident you can get a good kill shot to the head.
I think the main reason they use 223 is the cheap ammo cost and low recoil.

Have you read the whole thread I wonder??

The wound channel and penetration of the 77 tipped match king is devastating and could easily be mistaken for a 243 or larger caliber. In fact Im using 74 and 80 grn Targex at present to tone the mess down a bit. Not quite the wound channel but great penetration and killing still.

Originally Posted by Old_School

I know a few people that shoot deer with a 223 but its not a caliber I would recommend any new shooters using on deer unless you are confident you can get a good kill shot to the head.
I think the main reason they use 223 is the cheap ammo cost and low recoil.

Bullshit

Originally Posted by Old_School

I know a few people that shoot deer with a 223 but its not a caliber I would recommend any new shooters using on deer unless you are confident you can get a good kill shot to the head.
I think the main reason they use 223 is the cheap ammo cost and low recoil.

My mate was introduced to deer via my old Browning A Bolt. He shot 2 deer on his first outing. He bought an X bolt and unfortunately for big stgs up the coast he slays them with 55gr Barnes. He shoots a lot of deer. His best this roar of a 320 DS stag. Guess what he shot it with. LOL.