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Curious - how many folk here use a .223 as their main deer rifle? I've used them to good effect before, but always feel I need to have something heftier in the locker too.
I suppose there's a bit of trend towards longer range, but anyone hunting exclusively with .223 for regular stalking, bush etc? Ever felt like you needed more gun?
I'm predominantly hunting bush. Have been using my AR in 223 in the last year or three. Mainly because it has a suppressor and I've been hunting with my dog but also because it's such a handy carry. Goes good. Especially with short bush ranges. Shot pigs, Sika and Red Stags with it.
Not any more but I’ve killed more more deer with a 223 than all the other gun I’ve had combined. Nothing wrong with a 223 with the right shot placement.
Shot a lot of deer with 222, 223 caliber but prefer bigger stuff these days.
Can you talk about why you prefer the bigger stuff these days? Extra range? More emphatic results? Thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooseman
Year I’m with Mooseman, bigger bang;)
I’ve gone up from .243 to 7x57 just because I felt the need for a little more punch and range.
Like the .223 for paper but not had the chance to use it on game. Toyed with the idea of a .222
But am now looking at buying another .243 for range work while I wait for the 7x57 to cool.
I have 2 AR’s and a bolt action .223, they are good for me as I don’t shoot over 200m, I always aim for head/neck, not worried about knock down power would rather pinpoint accuracy, which I get
Like Tikka I've killed more deer with a .223 than all the other calibres that I've owned and absolutely love the .223 on Sika and Fallow and won't hesitate using it on trips but I also have other calibres in the safe that I use... guess it just depends on target species and country being hunted as to what I take these days with either a .222, .223, .243, 7mm-08, .284 Win
My mate has a sako vixen in 204 ruger(tf barrel)
The 204 is his main gun
Hes shot every Deer species in nz with it and probably shoots 20 goats a week also
He takes head shots only even with bigger guns so no point the 204 dose everything
If he can use a 20 cal as his main gun
You can most certainly use a 223 if you’re Confident
With a barns tripple shock or nosler partition
You could probably even take sholder shots with no issues on some pretty big Animals
Is there a projectile for malleting deer that the majority of you 223 guys use, or is it whatever soft point/ballistic tip you have to hand?
I often carry a .223 for work and recreation and end up shooting a few pigs & fallow deer. As the other guys said it's all about shot placement and having the discipline to pick your shots.
A suitable projectile sure helps. @Max Headroom
my fave affordable factory loads are
Winchester Super X 64 gr Power Point
Federal Power Shok 64 gr SP
Speer Gold Dot 64 gr SP
Hornady Frontier 5.56 62 gr Spire Point
I use a 223 exclusively during spring and summer.
Mainly fringe, creek or alluvial river bed hunting.
Change to a slightly heavier cal in fall winter.
I use a 62 gr scirocco now but have shot a fair few with the cheap as chips hornady 55gr sp.
Each to their own. Went to a light cal meat shooting where neck and head shots paid more money. Haven't changed since.
I have easily taken more animals with a 22 cal than anything else.
I have a 22 K Hornet that I use a lot nowadays. Starting to talley a few with that as well using a 45gr bullet at similar speeds to that I run a 223.
I have missed shitloads but I know for a fact I have only ever wounded one animal and lost it with a 223 in 25 yrs of using one.
I jaw shot it at around 10m thru some toi toi. Still bothers me to this day that I never caught up with that animal.
But I have had way more mishaps with other calibers.
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@R93 that makes for some interesting reading. The deer I've shot with .223 were using the 55gr Hornady SP's, left-over goat loads, when I got stuck without a magazine for my .260. They worked fine with neck shots.
I have a Hornet at the moment too, but I hadn't really considered it for deer. But hey, if a deer pig or goat popped up and I could get a clean shot, I'd take it.
There is a lot to be said for low-recoiling cals, and I hear that message coming through in the answers above.
If I went out tomorrow and bought a .223 with the intention of using it mainly on pigs and deer, I think the 65gr Sierra Game King would be my bullet of choice.
Realistically I currently own so many .223's, I can't even be bothered handloading anymore. Luckily, the Belmont 55gr SP bulk ammo works well as a do all load, and it is cheap.
I was aware and told the gamekings were the go way back. But I couldn't get them to shoot as good as other projectiles in any of my 223's. I have no idea why.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
Since I have gone to the sciroccos I have had a great run.
They're friggen pricey but work well on medium sized reds. I have taken 2 or 3 mature bull Thar in the body at average ranges with them as well.
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I have seen a nice 12pt drop on the spot with a 223
As they say above it is all about shot placement
Shot placement is always the answer eley.22 subsonic, Attachment 106912
@Taff, nice one. Looks like your aimpoint was about 30mm behind the eye?Quote:
Originally Posted by Taff
This leads me to another question re headshots from the front.
Is the head of a deer similar in structure to a cow, so that you can use the same rule of thumb for a headshot?
( ie draw an imaginary line on the forehead from opposite eye to opposite ear to form an x.)
I shot one deer with the .223 and my AR and I was very comfy. Just stuck my neck up over a ridge and neck shot it at something like 100m. If you can shoot well enough to head and neck shoot then it is great. A .223 will make a proper mess of a neck where a larger caliber could sail straight through. Problems only arise when noobs get the idea that the best hunters use .223, try using one as a beginner and try aiming for the big bit.
I used to 4x4 with a guy that dropped a couple of deer shoulder shooting with a .223 and they just dropped. He was not really a hunter. Eventually he shot one three times and it just ran away and he could not understand it.
My go to is a t3 in 223, shortened and suppressed. Gets used more than the 308 due to shortness in the bush and quieter over the dog also less recoil... (not that the 308 is bad)
not sure for front on but behind the ear from the side works well. Have eased this successfully with 17hmr at 150ish m. Used my 10/22 at 70m and it dropped the deer and wasn't getting up (well it didn't in the couple of minutes it took to fall out of the tree and walk over) but it wasn't actually dead so don't use the 22 outside of 50m on larger critters
Have used the old Nosler 55gr Solid Base in 222-223 for 30-40 years, they do the job with good shot placement. Have also over later years used 53gr Barnes with out a problem. Do at times go .243-270 if not using a dog and in the few open areas I hunt.
Speaking for myself I think using a light caliber has a little to do with good shooting and more so with being more deliberate and waiting for the perfect shot. Even then shit still happens.
It slows the whole process down for me apposed to using a larger caliber.
I have become patient and not worried if I miss out as I know there will always be another animal around the corner.
If it was just down to just good shooting I doubt I would have missed as many as I have[emoji16]
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65gr GK and 24gr BM2. I supppose those stags my son shot yesterday would have preferred been shot by a large calibre including the stag shot on the run thru the neck @ 140m.The debate will last until God gets an E class licence.LOL.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
A zastava that rides as the bike gun, done several thousand rounds, I feed it 55 gr gamekings and 26 grains of 2206h, deer, pigs, goats hares, rabbits, and wallabies.
Ive used it so much its like an extension of my hand, and takes no thinking about what to do.
Im pretty sure the pest control guys on here get to know their rifles and what they do under different conditions inside out, and that knowledge and the confidence to use it goes a long way towards making you a better shot.
I still have a long way to go by the way.
I use the .223 for meat hunting missions in spring and summer and use the .308 in the roar or going in for a stag. I use the 55gr gmx, drops them hard and exits too, I've drilled sika in the shoulder and dropped them on the spot easily. i'd be confident to shoulder shoot smaller reds with the gmx. I'd probably limit it to head or neck shots with soft points though. 200m max for shooting deer imo.
More into the long range shooting so the extra power is a requirement for ethical kills. The 222,223 were good out to about 200 odd yards but there wasn't a lot of room for error. Bigger calibers work better. The 223 with the slower twist barrels that shoot heavier bullets would obviously improve on longer range performance but still a long way behind a 7 mm or 30 cal. The 222etc are great if you don't want to disturb the country side especially now that they can be suppressed .Quote:
Originally Posted by Coelacanth
The 55 gr Hornady SP is a good ,cheap bullet for the 223 . If you want more penetration the Barnes 50 or 53 gr would be the answer. Using lighter calibers does help you become a better more careful shot as you need to be more accurate so as not to misplace your shot. I certainly wouldn't stop hunting if I could only use a 223 as it would do the job ok.
I'll agree with comments above from personal experience that the 55 gr Hornady projectiles are cheap projectiles but have worked well on Goats and Fallow but the majority of my deer have been shot with 55 gr Sierras.
The majority of deer I've shot have been sika where I haven't waited for head or neck shots but gone for chest shots with all apart from two were bang flops. The two were runners that ran 30-40 metres before collapsing where I couldn't figure out why until I realized I underloaded the cases and instead of my usual 26 gr AR2206H I had loaded those with 24 gr AR2206H so it was a lesson learnt that they needed to be driven hard and fast in my rifle at least and all of those deer were shot while bush hunting.
For the bang flops, my reason behind this is all of the kinetic energy from the projectile is being dumped into/inside the animal, I've shot a few animals with other calibres where projectiles would pass through leaving amazing blood trails even a blind man could follow yet those animals were still standing... dead on their feet but they were still standing.
Last year we shot a bunch of Fallow for meat, I was running my .284 with 150 gr Sierras and the round would punch right through, the animal would stand there unfazed with a hole through it and eventually fall over and I felt quite sad doing this so I switched to my .223 where they were just bang flops and felt it was just far more humane.
I loaded up some 140 gr BT's for the .284 so if I returned I could use a lighter projectile which would open up faster but as yet haven't had the chance to test that theory.
Most the 55 gr Sierra projectiles I chest shot Sika with I would find buried under the skin on the other side.
I have even used some 55 gr V-max on sika where the chest cavity was pulp but I kept using the Sierras as I like a good lead tip. I tried some Barnes but found them too expensive in the long run and I just couldn't get them to group well.
I've also started using heavier 63 gr Sierras and found them to be awesome aswell, there slightly tougher which will make them great for bigger critters.
As for head shots, a mate shot a Fallow stag head on with his .222 loaded with a 55 gr Targex projectile. It bounced off the skull giving it no doubt a terrible headache where he spent two days trying to find the animal to no avail. My son shot it a couple months later at 225 metres in the heart.
Once we boiled the head you could see the wound had calcified and it makes an interesting head.
We just prefer neck and chest shots with the .223 like we do when using any other caliber.
i enjoy my zastava, nice to carry. the 55gr PPU worked well on a deer just on 150 metres and a couple of pigs close up. i have a deer load using the 55gr barnes and that goes well too.
know your rifle, know your shot placement.
When I used the 222 most the time I tended to chest shoot most animals, shot some big stags too. So long as you shot is true and with a reasonable bullet that will get into the vitals you had a dead deer. The animals would usually run up to 50 yards then pile up. That's one reason I like a bullet to exit nowadays if possible, if it runs there is blood everywhere and easy to follow.
My father was a vet and would advise farmers to put down cattle (if needed) using a 22lr and the x aimpoint, but very close range and aiming square onto the headQuote:
Originally Posted by Max Headroom
Ive bounced 9 shots from .22 magnum off stags head at 50 yards..they were furrowing along and wouldnt go in....very messy.it was one in the crease as it walked away that tipped it over.
my zastava .223 has taken a few deer for me now,my go to load for years was 24.5 grns 2206 behind what ever projectile took my fancy 50-52 or 55grn.
present load for bigger stuff is a 50grn ttsx and I really cant fault it at all.
I dont target deer as such with the wee rifle but sometimes I just like to take it...funny thing is Ive shot more pigs using this rifle than any other in the last 20 years,the last one was 140lbs at 100ish yards bang flop in the crease.
given a quick shot at bush ranges at piss poor angle....the .308 with 180grn round nose all day long...quite settled deer in the open sub 200 yards,the .223 is fine n dandy.the poohseventy will do both and handle longer range with ease.
Shot most of my deer with the .223 and goats. Used a .308 on both as well. Currently using a Blackout and liking it. The first and last rounds make you think about the placement of your shots for sure. I’m happy to walk away if I’m not comfortable with the shot.
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