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Not looking to buy yet- just interested to hear your thoughts.
I have a cheap Norinco jw15 that does the job but have issues with a thrifty mag release and have lost mags in past. Thinking upgrade.
What do you think is the best value for money for .22?
Preferably bolt action and 10 round mags.
Going after usual small game; rabbits, hares, possums.
Depends how you measure 'value'.
Best for $$ saved, best for accuracy, best for 'looks', best for quality of design/construction.
I like the CZ457 Varmint. Accurate, good looking, well made.
Tikka T1x maybe? I have never tried one, but some folks like them.
Howa 1100 is OKish and saves some $$.
Yeah...get the CZ457. Trust me on this!
https://www.czub.cz/en/firearms-and-...-family/cz-457
Bergara BMR gets my vote alot of gun for 1000$ compared to some mentioned bergara fit, finish and quality good value for money just like their centerfires
Attachment 201613
SPECIFICATIONS
Action: BMR
Barrel: 4140 steel matted blued finish. No. 4 taper
Twist: 1:16
Barrel length: 18”
Threaded muzzle: 1/2-28” with thread protector
Weight: 5lbs
Length: 36”
Mag capacity: 5 and 10 round magazine included
Scope mounts: 30 MOA Rail Included
Trigger: Bergara Performance Trigger. Compatible Rem700
Stock: Tactical grey with black specks.
CZ, 452, 455, 427.
Bergara.
try one of the plastic CZ mags in it.....and having owned three of them and shot many others,nope cant say Ive ever dropped out a magazine that was put in properly to begin with...slot it in and give a golly good wiggle to ensure it wont come back out....and get it fixed if it still will.... the humble norincos are a great wee rifle.
If you want a go to, work rifle, for busting bunnies etc, then I would go for either a 10/22, or a Marlin bolt.......if one of your budget was a major consideration. If you wanted a good bolt 22, then I would look at finding a tidy Brno. May be older, maybe a bit rough, but the basics will be good, and its what the Chinese copied to make your Norinco. And your lost Norinco mags will probably fit it. If your budget is huge, then a Bergara - they just bloody shoot!
It doesn't matter if his lost mags fit, only the ones he hasn't lost! :P:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Husky1600
I went through the same thing 2 years ago and bought a new Savage Mark II for $199. It's accurate and I'm really pleased with it. Oh; I already have a Ruger 10/22 (had it for nearly 30 years). I just wanted a basic workhorse bolt action that I could suppress for bunnies.
In the OP it asks what is best value for money rifle - then notes its for small game shooting - possums, bunnies etc. I'm guessing he's talking best value for a worker/hunter 22 bolt action, in which case expenditure on high end heavy barrel CZ or Bergara or Tikka not needed for that purpose. Doesn't need high build quality and PRS capability. Beautiful rifles yes, but there are several very effective hunter bolt actions that may fulfil his specific purpose for alot less.
Frape - first thing I'd do is get your JW release catch/mag checked - by gunsmith if neccessary. Have had/tuned 15-20 of those rifles and that's not a common issue - and likely an easy fix. Can help also to chop barrel and do recrown at same time. Almost all of our chop/modded JW15s 0.3-0.4" at 50m at best. They are brilliant wee workers, all the boys have/had them in the closet, and they've accounted for untold thousands of bunnies. Yep older ones, not Polytech or GC brand. I recall looking from truck at four bunnies on hillside ranged at 110m away. 15" barrel Norinco - boom,boom,boom,boom - all down. On another occasion walked into a small flat paddock with sparse matagouri/scrub. Bipod down, picking rest spots, and 108 bunnies down in 95 minutes. Very few misses - this with another chopped JW15. Deadly little hunters. Think twice before you sell that JW..
If you want to spend the coin to get into PRS etc then the recommendations above are good. But if function is primarily bit of bunny shooting, and you don't want to keep the JW, there are many basic bolts that would serve well. Here's a copy with some options from an earlier thread:
"Regarding most accurate bolt actions with repeatable 5 shot groups at 50m - no real surprises. Norinco Em332 (0.6" average four consec groups at 100m). Then you have the fine Marlin 25/925/880/980s etc (all 0.3- 0.4" at best), CZ and Brno (0.4s), and several Norinco JW15s which after we polished action, chopped to 16" and recrowned are consistently in 0.4s - with @gadgetman's JW shooting 0.3s for both of us. Other worthwhile field performers - Toz 78 (0.6-0.7), Toz 17 (0.7-1.0"), Savage Mk 2 (0.7"), earlier Winchesters eg models 67 and 69 etc. Less reliable performers include Brazilian makes - CBC/Magtech/Rossi etc and the Philippines made Stirling. Can be quite accurate but can also be poor construction quality. Quite a few other makes and models but can't remember them now. Surprises at first were the Marlins with their excellent microgroove barrels, and the number of JWs which once given the QC missed at factory, proved deadly and effective wee hunters. You can also consider the Euros - Krico, Voere etc but beware - parts very hard to come by now."
My suggestion is get your JW15 fixed, or possibly look at a Marlin 25/925/880 series/980 series. Very accurate wee hunters out to 100-110m. Here are some makes from quick glance at trademe:
https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/marketpl...3?bof=jSfxGBo3
https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/marketpl...9?bof=jSfxGBo3
and for something a little different - a lovely old classic Remmy 341. Would have snapped this up if in Chch:
https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/marketpl...6?bof=jSfxGBo3
When I first saw the title of this thread I immediately thought of a jw15. As mentioned above by Muzza, the older ones are better shooters from what I've heard. They have MADE IN CHINA stamped into the barrel.
Is anyone familiar with the Howa 1100s? Interesting looking 22LR and they were a good deal not long back at about $799 scoped- albeit basic scope. Went to shop to check one over - found vertical pistol grip a bit too thick and squarish for my liking. Not quite an easy hand fit - but that's just me..
Have however read several links on them having consistent trouble with mag feeding - people having to return them to retailer etc. Anyone had any experience with this, able to comment on this Howa 1100??
Stirling 14 p,10 shot mag can shoot the wings off a fly at 100 yards:D
Attachment 201639
And by shit it has had some kills,just new stock still the old rifle.
Don't get a marlin. Mine had a bunch of issues, all resolved with great customer service from Dunedin H&F, but a pain in the butt at the time. Plus no spare magazines to be found anywhere.
i have a mint browning blr-22 (modified mag capacity to komrade stalindas requirements )
octagonal barrel, nickel plated receiver. absolutely mint condition. $1300
I ve seen two of the Rossi semis in action at the range and that sample of two shot extremely well.
The Marlin 22s of the Remington ownership era (known as Remlins) were not nearly as good eg model XT-22. They could give problems. Earlier Marlin bolts like models 25/925/880 series/980 series were better made.
Still some mags around but yes you have to wait for them. They will get harder to find.
Greetings All,
Almost any .22 RF will shoot well given decent sights and trigger. There are half a dozen here at the moment of which half are favourites. My 10-22 sporter, bought new over 50 years ago, has been shot heaps on running boar target where the 10 shot mags are really handy and still are. It has also shot rabbits, hares and one goat and currently has a cheap 2-7 scope. An old Winchester Model 69 was used for entry level target shooting with its Lyman 8 power scope until it was displaced by a Savage MkII with a heavy barrel, thumbhole stock and a Leupold VXII 4-12 AO scope. It comes down to what you are going to use it for and more inportantly what you like. More money will get you a nicer rifle but even the cheaper second hand ones will do the job.
Regards Grandpamac.
My $200 jw15 shot just as well as my Brno.
Why do you want "value for money" ?
If you've got a max budget, say what it is and work within that (accounting for some good mounts, a scope, perhaps a suppressor, sling and some cleaning equipment). If you've got a specific need like target competition, 70m head shot rabbits, shortenability for children then that will determine what you have to get.
If your budget and future use of the rifle are a bit uncertain, you've got an interesting problem, which the forum is only too happy to help you with ...
My own limited experience is that above the JW 15 the diminishing return curve flattens over a lot (like when I carelessly hammer on a 4" nail). For those who have one, the moral is: paint the magazine a bright colour so you can find it in the dark and know which is yours. Yes, everyone has one and it was their first rifle and they still use it a lot.
I would bring up the EM-332 but the dearth of magazines is a real problem.
Whatever you decide on, a fixed magazine (tube or floor plate) has some real benefits. Otherwise, affordable and readily available factory replacements or aftermarket magazines is a real plus.
I have a mint EM with two mags I would sell. The reason I would sell it is because it accelerates subsonic ammo and turns it into supers. The chamber is standard ( I got Gunworks to gauge it) so it must be the 'gain twist' and taper in the bore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bol Tackshin
Re loosing detachable mags, a fishing swivel clip and a cable tie on the trigger guard allows the mag to be popped out and refilled with no chance of loosing it
I dont think there is much "special" about EM322's after owing two of them - they are not a great hunting rifle with many ammo brands being difficult to chamber with heavy bolt closure due to the supposed match chamber. Both the two I've had were only medium accurate (and both were tested throughly tested with a wire range of ammos including match grade) . Either of an secondhand Annie 1415/1416 or Brno (both $600 -800) or a Lithgow LA101 ($800 -1000) will be more likey to give real accuracy, have parts available and a decent stock. Cheers
There's this, which looks pretty sweet:
https://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co....le-22-a-84969/
CZ457 synthetic stock version, under 900 bucks, threaded, can buy 10shot mag, good trigger and accuracy, modernised classic design and workmanship, great brand reputation and resell value.Quote:
Originally Posted by frape787
Had a couple of Em332s. Great wee rifle for the price then - paid $247 for first including 3-9x Huntsman. It was not the most accurate sporter 22LR for me at 50m - probably 0.35" or so best average - and its the consecutive group average that matters. But at 100m it was/is the champ. Would shoot 0.5" groups at 100 with 2-3 ammos (Aguila Superextra HV, PMC Match etc), and had best four consecutive (3 shot) groups average at 100 of 0.68" - all groups under 1". I haven't found another 22LR sporter to come close.
Reason I sold mine was it required a warmer after barrel cooled, and would commonly put that first warmer like an inch high and to left at 50m. That didn't suit my hunting accuracy needs. Still a fine wee rifle though.
Norinco JW15A is excellent value for money when it comes to accuracy. I have owned higher end 22s like CZ and Weihrauch, but did not find them to be practically more accurate than the Norinco at 4x the price.
The Norinco does have some flaws depending on your style of shooting.
- Safety is back to front like the older CZs. Extremely stiff to the point that it's almost unusable.
- My Norinco refused to take any CCI ammo. It would jam every single time. Winchester ammo on the other hand worked perfectly so I stuck to that. So you can say it's picky with ammo.
- Trigger was heavy and creepy out of the box. Although there are plenty of online tutorials to improve it. I made mine very light and crisp. When I sold it on Trademe the buyer wrote me a positive review on how nice the trigger is. So DIY can be done and you wouldn't be to worried of messing things up like with an expensive rifle.
I actually never experienced any problems with the magazine.
Because Im old school, look for a good second hand Brno. Cant go wrong, always had and always will have a reputation for accuracy and quality. Look no further
I have one that I bought new 87-88 with a Tasco on it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bos
Very good to use offhand, still do muttons in the small paddocks around the yards.
Have bought an old single shot for in the yards.
I have shot this in only once check with the odd boresight but that's about it.
I have really only used Winchester Power Point or Fiocchi.
Did have a Stirling semi Model 20 before that and it was a shooter, shot countless possums and rabbits before taking kids shooting and didn't want them all excited with another up the spout.
If @Dundee have experienced the same with the bolt actions I am not surprised if as good as the semi.
A lot off us were in such a hurry to get into "big" rifles we still have the .22s we started with.
But there you have two to look at the Brno and Stirling not saying others aren't good I haven't used them.
TOZ. Cheap, accurate, light and reliable. Way better trigger than any standard 10-22. Only downsides are a heavy bolt, there seems to be a magazine availability issue and second hand price has crept up over the years.
I've only owned a .22lr Stirling 14p before I got a few more guns and rifles. But before I got mine used the old mans 5 shot brno bolt action it was bloody accurate till the sling broke while I was cycling to a hunting block in the 80s.:(
Grabbed my old stirling out today for a bit of a tune up.
Attachment 201787
Its only got a 4x32 nikko stirling original scope on it.
Backed the quad up and put two rounds through it before clicking a few adjustments.
Attachment 201789
Dead eye deer now.
Attachment 201788
No bag or tripod just took the three shots leaning over the front of the quad before it was bang! on!
Now the target has an eye!
My JW 15. It shoots awesome, have had it over 10yrs and even then it was second hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by frape787
Got a replacement mag release and extractor from shooters supplies and a CZ plastic 10shot mag when I got it, as the previous owner claimed those issues, so it cost me $50
I sold the original wooden stock for $50 and put a plastic stock on it because the quad can be harsh on wood.
Must have shot rabbits out to 150m with it now, and some nights close to 200x in a night in central.
It just needs a gunk clean once in a while due to waxy 22 ammo.
Most of the used OZ rifles I've seen for sale are around the $700 mark now
I think this is always the real issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by muzza
We all have a different idea of best value, this is mostly dependent on the price range we can work with.
Some interesting choices possible here. If you're investing in a 22LR rimfire to do PRS shooting, or you simply want to enjoy owning a nicely engineered rifle then its entirely valid to spend $1000- 2000 on a 22LR - Bergara, Lithgow, Annie, VQ etc. But is it a necessity to spend this coin for effective field shooting - no.
One key point - the effective difference in the field between an accurate wee hunter 22 and a PRS 22LR rifle on bunnies is almost zero. The PRS rifle may shoot 0.25s average with match ammos, but we don't shoot bunnies with match ammos - with Tenex, Fiocchi Match etc. A PRS might shoot 0.3" repeatable groups at 50m with hunting ammos, whereas the sharp little hunter rifles (several JW15s, Marlins, CZ/Brno) in my experience will average around 0.5" at 50m - odd ones alot less. The difference on a bunny at 50m from a 0.3" group round and a 0.5" bullet is nil - both are close to minute of rabbit's eyeball. No difference in shoulder shot. At 100m there is also no real difference. In my experience it doesn't follow that the most accurate 22s at 50m are necessarily the most accurate at 100m. Example is Em332 - good at 50m but superb at 100m - while other sporter 22s (several) which were better at 50m could not match the EM332's 0.6" group average at 100m. One might reasonably expect both the PRS rimfires and the accurate hunters to be in the range 0.75 - 1.25" for consistent groups at 100m - easily inside 3" bunny chest/shoulder shots. No real difference on the bunny.
All of our Chch team have accurate hunter 22s and there are no rifles more costly than a CZ452 amongst them. Lots of chopped/polished Norincos, Marlins, Brno etc. Are they all deadly in the field - yes. In the north people tend to shoot less often and fewer rabbits. Even shooting 3-4 bunnies on a walk is alot of fun - often with time to bipod etc. But in the south - Canterbury/Otago etc - people often shoot alot bigger numbers in all sorts of terrain including alot from truck. Here you will find worker 22s are preferred - the inexpensive but accurate, durable, reliable units..
But...some day I would like to play with some nice high end PRS models - that would be a treat. No need for them at the moment but would be a pleasure spending some time with Lithgow, Bergara etc on the bench. Be cheaper than buying bloody sports cars every year or two....:)
Anschutz with a match trigger......cost you a hell of a lot, but it will keep increasing in value.....that's got to be good value, and unmatched accuracy
I saw a most unusual .22 two weeks ago. A pre 54 model Annie. Very very slim and elegant, just oozed class and it was ( the rifle was factory mint ) obvious that many many hours had been spent sanding and rubbing the stock to perfection at the factory. It had the look of a faultless piece of antique furniture
Went for a wander round 3 gunshops in Chch this afternoon and very few 22LRs under $5-600.
Found a brand new Marlin XT-22 which would be $599 with new Nikko 3-9x. Accurate, but not as reliable as earlier pre-Remington ownership Marlins. Be ok if they gave a good guarantee. Then looked at the Rossi model 8122 22LR bolt action - Hmmmm.. Picked it up and its a little hollow plastic stock thing with very simple action. Shop guy and I agreed it looked and felt like a $50 rifle...not $299. But that Rossi with GC 3-9x40 scope, rings and basic silencer is $449. Alright I guess, but it felt like my grandson's plastic water pistol. Did find a Brno model 2 for $600 - with a JW15 mag in it!! The Brno would be my pick of the 0-600 rifles on offer.
One H&F guy did say their will be more JW15s and poss other Norinco rifles coming into country within month or so. Said the Norinco firm had ceased production (of JWs?) so someone else in China must be making them for export. That could be ok IF IF they at least attempt a reasonable production standard. IF.. Will be worth having a look in month or so - will at least mean renewed availability of JW magazines etc.
Just use CZ mags, feed better than the norinco ones too.Quote:
Originally Posted by mudgripz
Yea the Jw15 as rough as guts as they are, well the one I have is but man do they shoot well lol, proberly the best value for money rifle I've owned at a whopping $140 bux brand new. Definitely shoots alot better then my Ruger American which is bit of a spu.
