kick arse suppresor ?

Hi guys and girls, I am about to run out of super low velocity 22 ammo ( 770fps) and it looks like any more will be pretty hard to come by. I made the mistake of going into humping and bitching in palmy the other day to see if they had any or were going to get any in. Basically they replied with a No, No, No and given their attitude I decided any more talk would have been wasted so went out the door. I don't mind a trip to Welly but see guncity has almost no cci segmented very low velocity stuff either.

So, seeing as I have a metric shit ton of CCI subsonic 1050fps stuff, has anyone tried a very large suppressor to get the sound down to a similar level as the 770 fps stuff ?. The neighbours know I shoot possums, Starlings etc... but I am keen on them not hearing me actually shooting so like the super quite stuff.

I am shooting mainly out of my model 2 BRNO with a "normal" suppressor on but the cci stuff still makes a bit of a crack ( much to the excitement of the AOS as mentioned by me previously :) ).

Sorry for the overly long bleat

DPT with extra baffles

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I tried a big long centrefire suppressor and it was good with subs but still cracked with supers....if you getting crack...you going supersonic. NO suppresser will fix that.

Oh I thought 1050 fps was still subsonic ?
When I say "crack" it's probably just noticeably louder than the 770fps stuff which sounds more like a air rifle level of noise

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Originally Posted by rugerman

Oh I thought 1050 fps was still subsonic ?
When I say "crack" it's probably just noticeably louder than the 770fps stuff which sounds more like a air rifle level of noise

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My new 22semi is ultra quiet running cci subs and a gunworks fat 22 suppressor, the bolt cycling is louder than any muzzle report

What would be the diameter of the suppressor Danny ? The one on my brno is maybe twice the thickness of the barrel and about 150ish mm. I have a slip on one for my 10/22 that is maybe twice the diameter so maybe I should try that one. I do like the look of the DPT ones though :)

Try a 223 supressor but muzzle forward as the effective volume seems greater than over barrel. I am using cci subs in my unique with it's reciprocating baffle system and get the occasional crack which makes me suspect that the stuff is borderline subsonic as a 25 inch barrel should slow it down anyhow.

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Originally Posted by rugerman

Oh I thought 1050 fps was still subsonic ?
When I say "crack" it's probably just noticeably louder than the 770fps stuff which sounds more like a air rifle level of noise

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Yeah, the CCI Quiet ammo is definitely quieter than other subsonic ammo. I have also tried Fiocchi Long Z (I think!), it is quieter than most at 850fps but still louder than the CCI segmented.

Apparently the first shot of a string is louder due to the "pop" of the oxygen inside the suppressor burning off.

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Originally Posted by 7mmsaum

DPT with extra baffles

End of story

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This.

I just use my standard centrefire overbarrel DPT that i run on my 223's, i have tried it with a couple of extra 22 cal baffles on it on the 22lr with cci subs and you cannot really hear the shot, but you certainly hear the thud of the projectile hitting its small game target.

Every now and again i find that a random sub does give a crack, so obviously it's one that's just supersonic

Yeah CCI quiet is insane, I used it on my little badger with a DPT can until it got hard to get. All you could here was the click of the trigger and then the impact.

I have had the same issue with CCI subs as everyone above (going super), I honestly believe they are tuned to the american market where everyone is running semiautos, and end up going a little faster on non-semis. So I changed to Aquila subs and I've had a much better run with them (also found them more accurate than the quiets, the quiets used to suck over 25m).

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Originally Posted by rugerman

What would be the diameter of the suppressor Danny ? The one on my brno is maybe twice the thickness of the barrel and about 150ish mm. I have a slip on one for my 10/22 that is maybe twice the diameter so maybe I should try that one. I do like the look of the DPT ones though :)

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35mm diameter by 150mm length muzzle forward

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Originally Posted by vulcannz

Yeah CCI quiet is insane, I used it on my little badger with a DPT can until it got hard to get. All you could here was the click of the trigger and then the impact.

I have had the same issue with CCI subs as everyone above (going super), I honestly believe they are tuned to the american market where everyone is running semiautos, and end up going a little faster on non-semis. So I changed to Aquila subs and I've had a much better run with them (also found them more accurate than the quiets, the quiets used to suck over 25m).

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Aquila subs are definitely slower than cci subs, we chrono tested them can't remember exactly but there was a reasonable difference between them, the Aquila do run very dirty though :psychotic:

I'm currently running Winchester longZ but they are solid tip which gives the odd ricochet which made me thought I might try the cci quiet segmented.
I might have a look at a 223 suppressor with extra baffles, although I'm not rushing into anything yet. I still have 1/2 a box of the Winchester rounds left. I do like the click....thwack that the very low velocity stuff gives.

i use a dpt magnum on my M597 POS 22 as its a left over from another gun. Bloody quiet!!

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Originally Posted by 7mmsaum

DPT with extra baffles

End of story

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Normally say yes but not sure if DPT makes a magnum in 22 line. The magnum centrefire is sublime for sound suppression. Friwi will conjure up a can for you.

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Originally Posted by rugerman

Oh I thought 1050 fps was still subsonic ?
When I say "crack" it's probably just noticeably louder than the 770fps stuff which sounds more like a air rifle level of noise

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What altitude do you shoot at? My mate in Twizel has a problem with most subsonic brands as the speed of sound is slower at altitude due to the less dense air, so many subsonics are not subsonic in the High Country. I can't recall which subsonic brand he finally decided was reliably subsonic for him, may have been CCI.

If the issue is "enough suppressor", have you tried shooting the suppressor wet? Detach, pour in water and empty it out, reattach, first couple shots are significantly quieter. I super-tuned a small steel suppressor with wire rolled mesh which would retain more wetness. Other option is to use KY gel, this basically will coat the inside of the suppressor with more water than it usually would hold without it squelching about. The water is SUPER effective at absorbing heat from the gases, remember back in science classes about something called "latent heat of vaporisation".

6 minute video, jump to 4 minutes for the bare bones and comparison.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Z_AXc7FIvw

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Originally Posted by rugerman

Oh I thought 1050 fps was still subsonic ?
When I say "crack" it's probably just noticeably louder than the 770fps stuff which sounds more like a air rifle level of noise

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The speed won't be exactly what it says on the box. From the few brands of subsonic ammo I've chrono'd you can easily get +- 50 fps. Shooting subs, my .22LR rifle with a suppressor is quieter than any break barrel air rifle I have (which is quite a few)

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Originally Posted by Cordite

What altitude do you shoot at? My mate in Twizel has a problem with most subsonic brands as the speed of sound is slower at altitude due to the less dense air, so many subsonics are not subsonic in the High Country. I can't recall which subsonic brand he finally decided was reliably subsonic for him, may have been CCI.

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Interesting, because air density has virtually nil effect on the speed of sound. Temperature is the condition that has most affect.

Had issue with CCI subs going supersonic every now and then in my Brno model 2 ,mentioned it to the gunsmith he suggested cleaning the barrel and it worked,apparently the build up of wax from .22 rounds can make the od bullet go faster due to more back pressure or something.worth a shot..

I found a few boxes of the Aguila sniper subsonic 60gr, far out that stuff is quiet and hits super hard!

I tried all my suppressors on my 1022 as most of my rifles are 1/2-20 thread too
it makes bugger all difference and centerfire suppressors including my muzzle forward dpt with at least 8 baffles on cuts bugger all off if any over my normal knock about 22lr solid core drilled type

with my brno model 2 I did find it was sending the occasional sub once in a blue moon over the sound barrier or near to
id say above a 22mag suppressor the sound suppression benifits will taper off rapidly

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Originally Posted by Mintie

I found a few boxes of the Aguila sniper subsonic 60gr, far out that stuff is quiet and hits super hard!

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man iv only ever heard stories of that stuff

Cheers for the suggestions guys :) I might try cleaning my rifle first as it is a bit of a dirty bitch and then try Cordites wetting the suppressor idea. I am in Shannon so not very high in altitude and depending on the day quite close to the gutter :)
Geez Mintie those 60gr rounds sound like they would pack a pretty good wallop.

If I do buy another suppressor I think I might just go for a 223 one with extra baffles, although I guess if I buy a big one and it doesn't make much difference I could put it on the Tikka. Not looking for an excuse to go shopping but......:)

I use a dpt .22 suppressor on my 10/22 with couple of extra baffles,wouldn’t get much quieter I don’t think.

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Originally Posted by rugerman

I'm currently running Winchester longZ but they are solid tip which gives the odd ricochet which made me thought I might try the cci quiet segmented.
I might have a look at a 223 suppressor with extra baffles, although I'm not rushing into anything yet. I still have 1/2 a box of the Winchester rounds left. I do like the click....thwack that the very low velocity stuff gives.

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I had a 223 suppressor a while back, chucked it on my 22 and didn't notice any difference. I do have a couple of extra baffles on my DPT 22 suppressor. I have 2, one on a Savage Mk2F which I use supers/stingers with - that has the extra baffles, and one on my little badger that is standard size.

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Originally Posted by Hunter_Nick

Interesting, because air density has virtually nil effect on the speed of sound. Temperature is the condition that has most affect.

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Thanks. Yes, that is indeed correct. I'll pass it on to my mate, he may have done his tests in the very cold Twizel winter (24/7 hoar frost for weeks on end) and camr to draw the wrong conclusion that it was to do with altitude alone.

Still, his observation remains, that only one brand was reliably crack-free, the others too close to the sound barrier to perform well in NZ-encountered conditions of lower sound velocity.

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Originally Posted by rugerman

Cheers for the suggestions guys :) I might try cleaning my rifle first as it is a bit of a dirty bitch and then try Cordites wetting the suppressor idea. I am in Shannon so not very high in altitude and depending on the day quite close to the gutter :)
Geez Mintie those 60gr rounds sound like they would pack a pretty good wallop.

If I do buy another suppressor I think I might just go for a 223 one with extra baffles, although I guess if I buy a big one and it doesn't make much difference I could put it on the Tikka. Not looking for an excuse to go shopping but......:)

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Forgot to mention, in suppressor expansion chamber, in addition to the wire mesh roll, I inserted two coil springs, one on inside of wire mesh, one on the outside of the wire mesh up against the suppressor wall. Gives sound something to travel round and as said above gives water / gel something to stick to.

If you just want to do the springs without the mesh, just use the weapon mainspring trick of having the springs wound in opposite directions so they won't interlace. If you have a selection of springs (dismantle any automatic transmissions lately?) you might have the right size range to slip in three or more springs!

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Originally Posted by Hunter_Nick

Interesting, because air density has virtually nil effect on the speed of sound. Temperature is the condition that has most affect.

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Yes, but temperature drops as altitude increases, so there is an indirect effect of altitude.
I read something in a hunting or tramping book years back that stuck in my brain - if I recall correctly, it said temperature drops 6.5 degrees for a 1000m increase in altitude, meaning the temp at the treeline is roughly 8 degrees lower than at sea level, all else being equal.

Have a look at Shootingstuff. To see if their ammo shipment has landed.
They used to have the Eley 38gr hp hunting subs that are noticibly quieter than the cci ones.
( well not as quiet as the CCI CB's 29gr at 770fps)
Z

How much quieter are they than the standard Winchester 40/42gr subs?


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Originally Posted by Cigar

Yes, but temperature drops as altitude increases, so there is an indirect effect of altitude.
I read something in a hunting or tramping book years back that stuck in my brain - if I recall correctly, it said temperature drops 6.5 degrees for a 1000m increase in altitude, meaning the temp at the treeline is roughly 8 degrees lower than at sea level, all else being equal.

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Yeah but some people get confused because in aviation you have Indicated Airspeed and True Airspeed (IAS and TAS). Airspeed indicators rely on pressure, so as you go higher your TAS increases relative to your IAS. So at 0 alt, the speed of sound is around 660 knots (IAS and TAS ), and at 50000 feet it is ~ 570 knots TAS (due to the temperate drop) and 285 knots IAS (due to the temperature drop and decreased pressure reading).

And for some reason this gets crossed over into the belief that pressure has an impact on the true speed of sound (in air).

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Originally Posted by Bill999

How much quieter are they than the standard Winchester 40/42gr subs?


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Bit hard to define. The CCI 40 or Eley 40/42gr subs still have a bang with a silencer, The CCI CB's 29gr at 770 fps in my bolt action the loudest sound is the firing pine and the thump from the bullet hitting the target.

While Eley 38 gr subs are closer to the 40 grainers but are quieter.
Z

One reason when doing proper suppressor sound testing, why a few shots with out suppressor are recorded beforehand . That is allowing to establish the sound pressure and bullet speed for the conditions around the time of the test being carried out.

At 970fps the 45gr CCI Suppressor HP's should stay consistently at subsonic speeds in most 22lr setups, could be worth a look. I've got a box but haven't tried them yet as the std CCI subs work fine for me in the jw15.

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Originally Posted by Friwi

One reason when doing proper suppressor sound testing, why a few shots with out suppressor are recorded beforehand . That is allowing to establish the sound pressure and bullet speed for the conditions around the time of the test being carried out.

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That should get all the oxygen out of the suppressor too stopping it from encouraging ignition inside the suppressor and getting that first round pop. My Dpt is pretty awesome on the first shot and even better on the second onwards but on the same gun my OD alpine mini titanium suppressor gives a hell of a first round pop but is great second shot onwards. Usually tho I only use one shot so that’s the only one that matters if it’s quiet or not


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As long as the bullet arrives in the animal before he can hear it and react to it is all that matters ;-)