Hey guys,
I currently own a Ruger American Rimfire .17 hmr.
I have the chance to get a CZ .17 and thinking of getting rid of the Ruger.
What does the CZ offer over the Ruger American? Particularly in terms of accuracy?
Thanks in advance.
Printable View
Hey guys,
I currently own a Ruger American Rimfire .17 hmr.
I have the chance to get a CZ .17 and thinking of getting rid of the Ruger.
What does the CZ offer over the Ruger American? Particularly in terms of accuracy?
Thanks in advance.
What accuracy are you getting from the Ruger?
My CZ 17hmr always shoots under an inch at 100 yards, more like .75.
Ruger is never known for accuracy. Especially the low end stuff. Stock 10/22 is significantly more inaccurate than CZ452/455 in 22LR. if you check out 25 mter sports rifle clubs, many intermediate shooters use CZ, almost no one who is a member uses stock 10/22. I would expect Ruger 17hmr to be slightly better than their 22LR but not enough to close the gap.
My guess is that CZ's craftsmen simply pays better attention and spend more time on each rifle.
I'd go with an Anshultz or Sako over a CZ and I've owned all three, I see an Anshultz just sold on T/m for 900, awesome accuracy and not built like a brick shit house IMHO
Thanks guys,
Beetroot, I shot my Ruger last weekend and got about 1.25 to 1.5" at 100m off the bench.
The Ruger American is a completely different rifle to the 10/22, not sure about the rimfire but the centrefire version seems to have a reasonable reputation for accuracy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimitsu
The CZ will be a big step up in niceness and finish though - comparing CZ with the Savage rimfires I've had the Savages had the edge for accuracy, but the CZ is definitely prettier.
I think @Happy had a very accurate Marlin,
I had two Americans, hmr and 223. They both group very well, the 223 was under an inch with factory ammo and my lack of experience at the dsa range here in whangarei. The hmr is much the same although I've just had it shortened and suppressed recently so yet to try that combo
Sent from my workbench
I've also had a 10/22 and it want as accurate as other rifles for sure but to say the American is shit because the 10/22 is is just silly. The Americans are built to a price for sure but they do shoot well and as rimfires go I thought the action was pretty good along with the stock. The centre fire actions are far more clunky and mechanical than higher quality actions but they work wellQuote:
Originally Posted by Ultimitsu
Sent from my workbench
Got a 10/22 groups 'ok' at 50, cz455 in 22lr groups fine at 100m if not better. Pros of the cz455 is a quick change of barrels and then u have a 17hmr or 22mag. Got a 17her barrel and really impressed, 0.75 at 100 if I do my part
The CZ/ Bruno, rimfire's have a good reputation for accuracy and function, the rugers not so much,
I have several CZ, including a 452 American, .17 hrm, very accurate, but soon, for sale as I have a 453lux, and a CZ .17 hornet.
You have to step up to a cooper, Anshultz, Sako, to get a more consistent accurate rifles,
If looking for accuracy, most of the time most rifles will out shoot the shooter and with a lot of rimfires ithe ammo becomes a limiting factor as well. But to compare a CZ with a Ruger is like comparing a Honda to a Mercedes. Both will sit at 100 and both will do the job but the quality of one will exceed the other. And stepping up to Anshutz or Sako is like going up another tier again. I would get the CZ if it was me. Whether you see much improvement in performance, I dont know, but you will feel the difference every time you pick it up.
Let me refine my view a little further...
I know that RAR has been getting fairly good reviews. However in my opinion, owner's testament often have Endowment Effect. if you want really gauge how good is a piece of gear, the best way is to check out how many people use that piece of gear in club/competition level. So far I have not see RAR in these scenes. (I take the same view when it comes to scope and ammo valuations)
Someone said RAR is a different rifle to 10/22. Of course it is. But it is still made by the same company, using more or less the same technology and same work force, so I would not expect drastically different outcome.
That is not to say RAR is a bad gun, in fact with the adjustable stock, factory fitted Williams Sight, and cheaper price, it may well be better value than CZ as far as a hunting rifle goes.
Someone mentioned CZ's appeal is quick barrel change. That is sort of true but not quite. I own a CZ455 with a 22 barrel and a 17 barrel. After changing barrels a couple of times I think I will not bother with it again. every time you change calibre you have to adjust the scope, that costs time and rounds. If you live on a farm or have the free time to go to open range every weekend, then it is not a big deal. For people with limited time and range access, it is probably easier just buy another gun in that other calibre.
What I will say is a good selling point however, is the ability to upgrade the barrel without going to a gun smith. My plan is to buy a high end barrel some day and install it myself. I will then have the freedom of selling either barrel at any time if I wanted to. Alternatively, it might be possible to change between two barrels of the same calibre without sighting in. For example, you may not want to thread your premium target barrel, and just make do with some slight POI error with the hunting barrel.
YMMV.
I have a CZ 455 and changing the barrel to a premium match barrel was in the back of my mind when I bought the rifle. Not interested in doing constant swaps between 17 and 22 at all. Lilja make a premium drop in and possible other barrel makers as well.
Club shooters would be a very small minority compared to hunters though wouldn't they? So a smaller sample size. And the impression I have (which may well be wrong!) is that many of them would be traditionalists who will stick with the proven option they've always used instead of trying something new to find out how it goes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimitsu
In response to your second point, I would suggest that a completely different design of rifle could well produce a drastically different outcome even when made by the same company. :)
Hi Ben,Quote:
Originally Posted by GravelBen
I would not say club shooters are a "very small minority" compared to hunters. Certainly not for the Auckland area! But even if it is smaller, it does not undermine my proposition for 2 reasons. Firstly, it is the competing nature of clubs that helps one identify better gear. If you wanted to know whether car A or car B is a faster racing car, you would ask 3 race car drivers, not 300 commuting car drivers, wouldn't you? Secondly, while within a given area club shooters may be s small sample, if you look New Zealand wide the sample is not that small. I bet if you went to every silhouette clubs and every indoor 25 metre clubs, you will find a few hundred of CZ but hardly any RAR. I used to go to two 25 meter clubs, I have never seen anyone shooting RAR, but lots of CZs.
Could some CZ owners be transitional? Sure. But many are not, because their CZ shoots almost as good as Annie 4 times the price.
Even the Americans choose CZ over RAR for competition:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TK1xTsqUQNk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGeoVHTWZwQ
As to the same company different design point, I agree with you as a general proposition. However the 10/22 is inaccurate mostly because its barrel. I have a 10/22 which came with a factory stainless steel barrel, it produced factory standard grouping (meaning: sucky) even with a KIDD 2-stage trigger. I upgraded the barrel to a mid-level aftermarket job, whistle pig. Now I get like 1/2~2/3 inch at 50 with el cheapo CCI SV. The stamped action of 10/22 almost has no negative impact on accuracy. The RAR has a better action (by just being bolt action, at the least in theory) and better trigger, but I doubt Ruger now uses significantly advanced technology on its barrel.
As a ruger shooter 77/22 , and a CZ shooter, I would go CZ out of the box every time, I handle the American most days, and for quality would put the CZ above it.