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My cheapo 3500 inverter gen set just decided to randomly sieze, so I grabbed a spare that a mate had sitting idle.
It took a bit of tweaking, but I got it running. However! As soon as I put a load on, in this case a 2.4 kw heater onto a generator rated to 3100w, the gen packs a sad. Guessing it is alack of voltage ?
Is it worth pissing around with or do I bite the bullet and buy new ?
What model had the seize ?
Someone might have a motor
Sounds like your loading it up considerably
What’s the 2.4 heater for ?
Can u use firewood ?
I dont consider lit to be loading up when gen set is rated to 3.1 and heater only 2.4.
Heater is a bi of an experiment due to design of the house. Wood is my go to
It’s probably a Chinese 2400 watts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pengy
Or the heater is trying to drag 4.1 on crank up until it settles in to it's work. Some things drag a scary amount of power in the first few moments of switching on, it's normally considered a motor startup thing but I've been surprised by it with a couple of other devices that normally aren't considered high load on startup.
A 2400w heater off a 3k geny will probably struggle due to the draw. 3 k is peak. If its a variable heater try turning down temp and see if it works.
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Generators are rated at kva, which is a bigger number than KW, so looks better written on the side of the generator. Generators usually have a power factor of 0.8. They also hate going to maximum power when cold.
If you are simply using it to run a heater, you would be far far better off running a Chinese diesel heater made for RV's. About 3 hundy and will produce 3-5kw of heat all night long for a couple of litres of diesel burnt
When got our bach to save some money I purchased a cheapo 3.1kVA inverter generator for ocassional vacuum cleaner, power tools, top up batteries if solar is poor, etc. Thought it'd be fine a surge rating was supposedly 4.2kVA. But it needed slow ramp up of the 1300W vacuum cleaner otherwise would cut out! Couldn't handle a 850W grinder. Piece of crap.
Brought a Honda EU20i and has zero issues with any of my loads. Quiet. Starts every time even after months of no use. Should have followed almost everyone's advice and brought Honda in first place. Lesson learnt. If buying an ocassional use generator buy a Honda.
EU20 has been discontinued (now EU22) but if you're wanting to run 2.4kW continious you'd need the EU30 anyway.
I stuffed my inverter gen a year ago but the shop fixed it for me
I was told I need to double up the req watt for loading up.
E.g. 2.4KW heater, you need a 5kw inverter to be on the safe side.
A man with sense!!Quote:
Originally Posted by uk_exile
Pengy, by a 6kva good quality unit and walk away. Probably $3-$4k. Or find a good quality secondhand one.
The original (siezed ) geny is a Powertec 3100 inverter model from Repco. Had it for almost four years and not done big hours as I only used it to run washing machine etc etc and top up house battery now and then.
The borrowed replacement is another chinese job, Powermax xpg3000, rated 2700 w to max 3100.
Interesting that the first time I used this one to run washing machine, the wash cycle stalled part way and wont carry on. This never happened with the old generator, which is what made me suspect low voltage. It would be a bastard if my washing machine has crapped out at same time as the generator but then old Murphy works in odd ways
Pengy, by a 6kva good quality unit and walk away. Probably $3-$4k. Or find a good quality secondhand one.
Honda or Dunlite are two good makes, sold heaps of the Hondas, they were assembled in NZ, coupled to an Italian alternator, no longer made, they were an open frame model.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
Your better with an inverter model for computer TVs etc, give a stable, clean sine wave.
Like thisAttachment 224025Attachment 224026
$5k but so much better than the non inverter open frame types
https://www.hondaoutdoors.co.nz/gene...erators/eu30is
Really depends how much you're prepared to pay, what you're supplying, how often you're supplying it and if noise, fuel economy or power quality are important. The generator calculator on this page will help you make an informed choice https://www.hondaoutdoors.co.nz/generators Also look at https://www.hondaoutdoors.co.nz/gene...ight-generator
In defence of the cheap chinese generators I did get one and a half houses built with a 3kva 'blackout' labeled generator. Built an open sided tent for the builders a workbench inside and a 'quietening' box for the gene to live in. $650 from memory:thumbsup:
Gave it a full service every time I came home for the weekends.
But a Honda gene is never money down the drain. Just look how attractive they were after cyclone Gabriel:omg:
It would be lovely to have 3k plus to splash out, but not realistic right now unfortunately.
Guess the washing machine will be out of action for a while.
When you say the Generator packs a sad, what is the specific nature of the tantrum? Does it trip its breaker but the motor continues running?, or does the motor stall? Or does the generator just shut down?.
When you first switch on a motor or a heater, there is much lower resistance in the armatures or elements than there is once its running.
Basically a cold conductor conducts much better than a hot one, so will draw more current. This is known as Inrush current. The device won't draw that extra current for long (due to high currents causing conductors to heat up and become more resistive which allows less current) but it can be long enough to make a generator stall or cut out.
Industrial electric motors often require a 'motor rated' fuse or breaker to operate. These fuses/breakers are designed to cater for the Inrush current.
Chances are your new generator cannot cope with the inrush current from your heater. You could try starting your heater on a low setting and slowly notching up the temperature.
If you can't adjust the setting, you could switch it on for less than 0.5 seconds. The generator should restart under it's own momentum if it has tried to cut out. Rinse and repeat several times to get the initial element temperature up before switching the heater on completely.
This second option has about as much chance of working as one of Macgyvers schemes but it may work. If on the off chance it does work, it should not be seen as a long term solution as it will wear out your switch contacts.
The washing machine situation is possibly due to an incompatible AC frequency from the new generator. Some electronics need the correct AC Hz to operate properly. Same with some motors.
Likely suspect is that at a certain point in the cycle there is a step that is supply frequency sensitive and the washing machine can't complete this step running from the new generator.
Generator does not trip a breaker, but starts searching, or surging when heater is at 50% and then dies when heater is at 100% (2400 w)
Does your heater have just the two settings?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pengy
For heat, yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by longshot
If it is already struggling at 50%, which would be 1200w, then doing the on-off trick to pre warm the elements is very unlikely to work for the 100%.
The hunting and surging at 50% informs what the expected capacity could be as things are right now and will give a more honest indication than the rating sticker. Did you have to do some tweaking of the throttle/carb/choke etc to get it running?
It's rpm may be too low.
The situation with the washing machine is consistent with a low rpm from the generator.
Sorry I can't give you a definitive answer to all this and I know it's frustrating when gear doesn't work as per how it should.
Without being there in person with Multimeter in hand, fault diagnosis becomes mostly informed guess work.
I did indeed have to mess with the mixture etc to get it to run without surging. Maybe is it a simple fix by doing same again to achieve optimal rpm.
Thanks for al the great input
If that genny has previously sat around a bit it may well have old fuel-turned to gum in the carb jets, making the engine run lean . a lean engine will surge a bit then give up long before giving you full power. I bought a little mitsi generator of trapme years ago and it ran lean as all hell (with a light green slime throughout the carb) doing the same as yours not handling half its rated load .took lots of carb cleaner and fuel set condtioner to sort it but now it handles load near to its rated max (2400w from memory). a quick check would be to start your genny up and after a couple of minutes see if its happy to have a bit of choke given to it - if so good chance its got slime in the carb. if not as others have said its too pathetic...
How old is the stalling genetic?
Has it been run unloaded or lightly loaded for a portion of its life?
If your lucky you might be able to load bank test it for a couple of hours and get it accepting load without stalling,
Plug in a 2kw heater for a couple of hours and see if it improves the load accepting,
Used to have to do it to rental gensets that had been lightly loaded while out on hire,
Everything gets gummed/coked up and you have to get it hot enough to burn out the crap....
Cheers
Dave
Ahhhhh, carb jets and emulsion tube probably need a going over. The pilot jet will give surging conditions like you've described if it's so much as a few degrees out of line - some engines are very prone to this as an individual thing and the next identical example runs fine without the pilot jet fitted - go figure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pengy
Well, thanks to the great kindness of a fellow forum member who I had not met previously, I now have the loan of a grunty 8kva job that runs the washing machine etc etc without blinking an eye. THANKYOU ! You know who you are and I am eternally grateful.
Now, just need to get my a into g and sort long term project
