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Thread: 7 million new shooters since march.

  1. #61
    Member Ben Waimata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GDMP View Post
    Not really true.I can think of laws that got ditched after a short time....who remembers carless days and what an absolute shambles that turned out to be.Also the Arms act was changed back in 82 to get rid of registration that had been in force for the previous 60 years.So laws can and do get changed and undone if the motivation is there to do it.
    Yeah I agree with this. I truly believe that if Nat/ACT had got in we would be looking at something like E cat (probably with B cat restrictions) coming back soon. The fact that the police had already sidestepped the law to allow landowners to access semi autos for pest control by the end of last year just goes to show even the police understand the whole thing was blown out of proportion and gained it's own momentum, that 119 MPs were too gutless to stand up against. I mean seriously, how often do the police deliberately create legal loopholes to bypass the wording of legislation to allow wider of civilian use of semi auto rifles? This is exactly what they did at the end of last year, and they deserve some credit for this at least. I'm just amazed (and disappointed) that so few land managers appear to have bothered to apply for this endorsement.

  2. #62
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    Hard to believe there was 119 for and only a single MP voted against what happened....pretty sad indictment of the state of our democracy.
    Ben Waimata and Dago like this.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Waimata View Post
    Yeah I agree with this. I truly believe that if Nat/ACT had got in we would be looking at something like E cat (probably with B cat restrictions) coming back soon. The fact that the police had already sidestepped the law to allow landowners to access semi autos for pest control by the end of last year just goes to show even the police understand the whole thing was blown out of proportion and gained it's own momentum, that 119 MPs were too gutless to stand up against. I mean seriously, how often do the police deliberately create legal loopholes to bypass the wording of legislation to allow wider of civilian use of semi auto rifles? This is exactly what they did at the end of last year, and they deserve some credit for this at least. I'm just amazed (and disappointed) that so few land managers appear to have bothered to apply for this endorsement.
    You give the police too much credit.

    All they've done is recreate Cat D like in Aussie. Which in effect means that if you are rich enough to own land you're deemed fit and proper enough to own a semi by no other virtue than wealth.

  4. #64
    Member Ben Waimata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russian 22. View Post
    You give the police too much credit.

    All they've done is recreate Cat D like in Aussie. Which in effect means that if you are rich enough to own land you're deemed fit and proper enough to own a semi by no other virtue than wealth.
    Land owners can't get D cat in NSW anymore, and it's becoming increasingly difficult everywhere. The law still says they can, but as the people who sign off on the paperwork refuse to do it you basically can't get one. And if you do, it's only for one year. In NZ you need to be able to show significant economic/ecological damage to be eligible for P1/2. In NSW they don't seem to care. Example being my father-in-law in the NSW drought 2 years back, his crops were basically plowed by feral pigs (he shot 600 with a single shot .223 that year), he was paying $2000/week for feed to keep his cattle alive while the feed he had tried to save was destroyed by feral pigs and deer, but not eligible to own a more appropriate firearm. So this older guy (heading for 80) is out stalking highly suspicious feral pigs on his knees in flat Aussie scrubland while going broke and still not eligible to own a decent rifle. The law is stupid.

    The story went around that our police were advised by NSW police re firearms. This may well be true, but the differences are quite obvious too. NSW A cat you can't use semi auto .22 or shotgun (restricted to primary producers C cat only), NZ A cat you can. NSW A cat allows pump action centrefires, NZ A cat does not. NSW D cat is not available to land managers, NZ P1/2 is. In NSW it's still a much slower and more difficult process to get a FAL than here. In NSW you need to be able to justify why you need a FAL at all, in NZ only endorsements need this.

    Both countries are suffering from ideology over logic. The proud ANZAC tradition, woke version.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by GDMP View Post
    Hard to believe there was 119 for and only a single MP voted against what happened....pretty sad indictment of the state of our democracy.
    Yep, that's it in a nutshell.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Waimata View Post
    Land owners can't get D cat in NSW anymore, and it's becoming increasingly difficult everywhere. The law still says they can, but as the people who sign off on the paperwork refuse to do it you basically can't get one. And if you do, it's only for one year. In NZ you need to be able to show significant economic/ecological damage to be eligible for P1/2. In NSW they don't seem to care. Example being my father-in-law in the NSW drought 2 years back, his crops were basically plowed by feral pigs (he shot 600 with a single shot .223 that year), he was paying $2000/week for feed to keep his cattle alive while the feed he had tried to save was destroyed by feral pigs and deer, but not eligible to own a more appropriate firearm. So this older guy (heading for 80) is out stalking highly suspicious feral pigs on his knees in flat Aussie scrubland while going broke and still not eligible to own a decent rifle. The law is stupid.

    The story went around that our police were advised by NSW police re firearms. This may well be true, but the differences are quite obvious too. NSW A cat you can't use semi auto .22 or shotgun (restricted to primary producers C cat only), NZ A cat you can. NSW A cat allows pump action centrefires, NZ A cat does not. NSW D cat is not available to land managers, NZ P1/2 is. In NSW it's still a much slower and more difficult process to get a FAL than here. In NSW you need to be able to justify why you need a FAL at all, in NZ only endorsements need this.

    Both countries are suffering from ideology over logic. The proud ANZAC tradition, woke version.
    We are just a short way behind them, NSW is where we are heading.

    Why would NZ be any different?

    My Aussie cousins used to be all riteous about my guns years ago. Now NZ city folk talk the same way.

    Very easily propagandised.

    Sent from my CPH1701 using Tapatalk

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tussock View Post
    It's not your point. It's your perspective.

    He has rights.

    As a New Zealander, you have none. Only privileges. We can only hope people will be kind to us. It's not a given. There is nothing stopping anyone from stripping you of your freedom and resources.

    England could sell you to China in a post Brexit trade deal. Wouldn't be a damn thing you could do about it.




    Sent from my CPH1701 using Tapatalk
    Its an exercise in semantics. You either are free to do something or you arent. Those freedoms are rights. If a goverment has banned you from doing something it has taken your rights. Their 'dripping with benevolence' phrasing doesnt change the facts. We are trusted and free, or we are crushed by bad press and an ignorant public/corrupt politicians. Theres no third option in reality.

 

 

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