cold/clean bore shot

Went to the range to check this, was horrified to find that my first shot was 10inches above the aimpoint but perfectly inline. I then fired a three roud group and they were all 2.5 high above the bull and just over an inch. I have found the rifle shoots better fouled so when I clean the barrel all I do is remove is the powder residue not the copper. I also store my rifles with a layer of oil on the bore which is then removed prior to firing. Obviously after running dry patches through there will still be small traces of oil remaining. Would this cause the first shot to be so far off?

Repeat the test 3 times to see if the same thing happens, might just be operator error :D

High shot on a cold/clean bore is unusual in my experience, mine tend to go slightly low. Couple of dry patches before shooting generally reduces the difference between clean and fouled barrel.

I'm assuming you are shooting at the same distance that you zeroed the scope ?

There are also different states of "clean"... Carbon ring in the throat area can cause vertical, short stroke the first 6-8 inches of the barrel with JB paste. Also leave a solvent like hoppes soaking in the barrel overnight and see what comes out on the patch after a day or 2.

Yep, any residual oil can cause an issue. I dung my barrels out real clean but when shooting on the 100yd range I still sometimes see a blackish ring around the first hole on the paper with the following shots being clean on the edges. Obviously still something in the barrel. Also with fouling it is not just a nice layer of copper with a nice layer carbon on top. It can be many overlaid layers. You say your rifle shoots better fouled - how much better? You might be better off cleaning out all fouling and then re-establish you first/cold shot zero. After all this is the most important shot out in the hills. Rifles can all be different though and you just need to determine how yours goes which is obviously what u r doing. With my F class rifle, if I absolutely squeaky clean it b4 going to the range I have 2 sighters which don't give me a typical elevation POI and I have to second guess my elevation after the sighters. My solution with that rifle is to fire 2 shots into a 2 metre deep hole I have specially drilled behind my hay shed and then I am away.

Definitely wasn't operator error all shots felt very good, yes same range as zeroed.

Clean bore groups are around 50-60mm fouled they shrink down to just on an inch. The rifle does foul quickly and thick orange streaks of copper residue are present, however still shoots just on the inch.

10 inches at is a bloody long way off if it's at 100 metres! I'd say it's more than a clean barrel, more likely a mechanical issue, possibly in the scope.

Scope is leupold vx1 bases are loctited rings mounted securely with even torque on each screw. If the scope was the issue the other rounds would be out as well.

Loads are also good powder charge, seating depth, case all the same etc.

I had a similar issue with my Finnlight, any oil residue in barrel for cold bore shot caused a similar POI difference, as mentioned, not good for hunting.
So I flush the barrel out before using with meths or a brake cleaner spray.

Righto cheers lads, went back to the range after oiling and dry swabbing the bore. First shot 10inches high perfect for windage, second shot perfect right where it should be for my calibre. In my rifle the residual oil really messes with my first shot. Just means I have to fire a shot at the range each time before I go on a hunt.

Change from oil to another rust preventive.

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Originally Posted by mawzer308

Righto cheers lads, went back to the range after oiling and dry swabbing the bore. First shot 10inches high perfect for windage, second shot perfect right where it should be for my calibre. In my rifle the residual oil really messes with my first shot. Just means I have to fire a shot at the range each time before I go on a hunt.

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What oil are you using in the bore?

I've been advised not to use Rem oil, as it has Teflon in it. Now using Kroil

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Originally Posted by dogmatix

I had a similar issue with my Finnlight, any oil residue in barrel for cold bore shot caused a similar POI difference, as mentioned, not good for hunting.
So I flush the barrel out before using with meths or a brake cleaner spray.

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+1. or white spirits then patch dry. I went down the same path you are proposing, but I would predict the accumulated time spent visiting the range prior to trips will quickly become much more than the time spent upfront quantifying where that first cold shot goes in relation to follow-up shots and what process to go though to minimise the change in POI.

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Originally Posted by GWH

What oil are you using in the bore?

I've been advised not to use Rem oil, as it has Teflon in it. Now using Kroil

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

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No teflon in rem oil or hoppes, etc but they are mixes of different low viscosity oils that penetrate quite well effectivly stopping rust but making complete removal a bit of a chore . Diesel does seem to work quite well mixed with no9 1:1 at least in my case.

10" from zero sounds a hell of a lot for a cold shot. Must be frustrating.
Whats the velocity on the cold clean shot?
Is there a huge difference from the second?

I have never fired a naked bullet thru any of my current barrels as I use HBN to coat all my projectiles. It doesn't matter what state my barrel is in I don't have any issues with POI shift due to a cold or clean bore.
If my barrels are really, really clean I need a couple rounds down them before the velocity on a cold shot is where it is supposed to be.
But that lasts easy a 100 rounds without any major cleaning other than a lightly oiled patch if I have been out in wet weather.

10" shift would do my head in.
Have you let the barrel totally cool before you fire the second shot to ensure it is on its zero?


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My first shot tends to go low as per the zero check I did on the weekend:

http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/m...psrkiib06h.jpg

The first shot is the lower one on the right.

After fully cleaning out, I put a -very light- patch of Kroil through it. It's a mistake to use a heavy coating of anything if you're not going to patch out before shooting next time, and I can't be bothered doing that.

My first shots in a cold barrel are generally pretty good. Normally on the money but just slightly low. I always at least put a snake bore thru if fired a shot in the field everytime when I get home. If fired a few shots at the range I generally put a patch thru until clear and every so often with hopes. Rifles always shot reasonable well right from the start at the ranget and never had huge flyers etc. don't go over board with the cleaning of the barrel but I just like it to look clean looking down it before I go for a hunt and it seems to work as everytime at range the firsty shot is never a big issue and it still be a money shot .

i think kroil is a winner
the dude from Gunworks wrote an article about kroil saying that a lite cote of Kroil after cleaning for storage till using it again goes a long way to alleviate this problem and i totally agree with him i don,t seem to have this problem any more but please make sure you always put a patch through the barrel before using your firearm again
in fact i now have changed the way i clean my barrels
, i use a good quality carbon remover (KG1 is good) that removes powder fouling and carbon build up, then i use kroil seems to take me less time to clean :cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::P

Lads to answer your questions I have used CLP, engine oil, Boretech, collings solvent all of them affected the first shot in the same way. Bore was always wiped clean prior to firing but to no avail.


As Dogmatix stated wiping the bore clean with an oil neutralising solvent worked wonders, it brought the first cold shot right down to where it should be. Problem solved cheers @dogmatix legend.