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Black Watch Alpine

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  • 2 Post By Moa Hunter
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Thread: Horizontal flyers

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2016

    Horizontal flyers

    Was out at the range shooting at 200m today with my new Kimber Hunter .280 Ackley, still in the load development stage.

    I had the first two shots group perfectly above one another, half an inch apart, then...

    The third printed at about 4 oclock on the target but 3 inches away from the centre.

    Rifle seems to be doing this consistently with the other groups I've shot, including the one where the first two shots thru' the same hole and the third printing once again at 4 oclock and 3 inches away from centre.

    Any thoughts on why?

  2. #2
    Member Sideshow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Got any pics?

    Might be too fast causing the bullet to tumble.
    Might be barrel.
    Might be poor shooting technique?

    Do you have any factory loads you can shoot with?
    Have someone else shoot the same loads.
    Have a crony to see what speeds your getting.
    Could you publish here your load data...what brass, powder, primer etc
    Cheers S
    It's all fun and games till Darthvader comes along
    I respect your beliefs but don't impose them on me.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    North Canterbury
    Shoot a five or more shot group and report back here
    Bagheera and bing like this.
    'Bother' said Pooh, as he chambered another round ...

  4. #4
    Member chainsaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Some of the Kimbers have very light profile barrels that heat up very quickly and rely on pressure point bedding at muzzle end of stock to counter some of the barrel whip. If its the 3rd shot consistently then I'd be looking at the rifle bedding. is the bbl free floated ? or is it touching at the pressure points ? if its very close to touching the pressure points then as the barrel heats up you could find it then does touch and that will produce flyers.
    Try waiting 2 or 3 mins or longer between shots to let bbl cool. If this removes the flyer then that would support my suggestion above.
    northdude likes this.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Western BoP
    What do the 4th and 5th shots do? You need to work out if it's you, the rifle, the load, the hold, the support etc etc and you can't do it with the information you have so far...

    I'd start by giving the rifle a very good once over, check everything assembled correctly, at correct tension and no movement where it shouldn't be.

    Then I'd shoot a 5-shot group with an observer recording to eliminate you - ensuring that it's a good suitable rest in good shooting conditions and you aren't clustering the shot release. If it's performing to task, chuck the scope on another rifle and try it there to eliminate a spring failure in the windage assembly. If that's showing the scope all good reassemble the original combination and have another go.

    If it still does it, see if you can force the correction by slipping a piece of paper in the muzzle contact point in the appropriate place (rhs for a left correction etc) and see if that forces the change - if the shot goes right with right hand pressure at the muzzle when you are expecting a left correction it points to bedding in another area or movement in the setup where there shouldn't be (pressure altering the position of the action in the stock).

    Consistently doing the exact same error either is a really obvious issue e.g. mechanical failure or a shooter-induced error (theory of the shot would suggest horizontal error is a shooter issue) or it's pretty damn flukey in my experience. One of the issues you have is you can't easily swap out to a different brand of ammo to prove that it isn't ammo-related as you are using reloads - I'm making the assumption here that the ammo is not the issue as the error is horizontal, not with some combination of vertical indicating velocity changes.
    Bagheera and Moa Hunter like this.

  6. #6
    dog chaser distant stalker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    If you overlay targets dies it present two separate groups? Sounds like a mechanical issue to me, scope mounts moving on action or bedding, something along those lines

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    3 inches away isn't bad at 200m. Do you really think the rifle is grouping half inch or "all shots touching" at that range ?

    Wind can easily shift a shot a couple of inches at 200m too.

    I would like to see a few 5 shot strings with each shot numbered before I conclude my own rifle has a consistent hot barrel flyer problem.

    Mauser 308 has posted some excellent technical suggestions. The most likely outcome is that if you follow best technique on a no wind day you will get some 5 shot groups around 1 MOA which is good for a lightweight rifle in a staunch clambering. Then you can move on , to honing group size, trajectory and wind testing and field marksmanship .

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    3 shots isnt really a group is what everyone is saying here. If its purely a hunter and cold barrel first shots is your thing then its good to go.
    if its a LR rig for multiple shots it may just be an MOA rifle not a half MOA one.
    A330driver and bing like this.



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