Thread: .303 Tank crew carbine

Originally Posted by Cordite

What new law, @Wingman?

OAL is now measured from the butt to the end of the rifling, no longer acceptable to have a welded/pinned/loctited on muzzle brake/extension/suppressor.
It was challenged in court recently with the new legistation being clarified that OAL must be measured to the end of the barrels rifling.
Turns out we are fit and propper enough to own a rifle 762mm long but an instant criminal with bank robbing tendencies at 761mm long.
The reality of it is quite ridiculous. The common crim will hacksaw off any firearm to what ever concealable length they desire not giving a dam about F/A legistation.

Trying to make sense of our laws is a pointless past time and even more so now the police can have laws changed at whim with their uninformed, inexperienced and unprofessional opinions via order of council.

Originally Posted by Wingman

OAL is now measured from the butt to the end of the rifling, no longer acceptable to have a welded/pinned/loctited on muzzle brake/extension/suppressor.
It was challenged in court recently with the new legistation being clarified that OAL must be measured to the end of the barrels rifling.
Turns out we are fit and propper enough to own a rifle 762mm long but an instant criminal with bank robbing tendencies at 761mm long.
The reality of it is quite ridiculous. The common crim will hacksaw off any firearm to what ever concealable length they desire not giving a dam about F/A legistation.

Trying to make sense of our laws is a pointless past time and even more so now the police can have laws changed at whim with their uninformed, inexperienced and unprofessional opinions via order of council.

So….long butt and thick butt-plate it is then?

Originally Posted by Finnwolf

So….long butt and thick butt-plate it is then?

I'm more worried about counterbored barrels. Need to go down and check...

Originally Posted by Wingman

OAL is now measured from the butt to the end of the rifling, no longer acceptable to have a welded/pinned/loctited on muzzle brake/extension/suppressor.
It was challenged in court recently with the new legistation being clarified that OAL must be measured to the end of the barrels rifling.
Turns out we are fit and propper enough to own a rifle 762mm long but an instant criminal with bank robbing tendencies at 761mm long.
The reality of it is quite ridiculous. The common crim will hacksaw off any firearm to what ever concealable length they desire not giving a dam about F/A legistation.

Trying to make sense of our laws is a pointless past time and even more so now the police can have laws changed at whim with their uninformed, inexperienced and unprofessional opinions via order of council.

Do you have a reference or date for that decision? This is quite important as the method of measuring the overall length of a firearm had already been established in a court case many years ago. The term 'overall length' has been established as 'the longest physical dimension' and that measurement is usually from the muzzle to the toe of the stock (not necessarily parallel to the bore). It is important to note the 'muzzle' is not always the end of the barrel but the part where the bullet exits the firearm. That includes parts of the firearm that are in the original design and not readily removeable without tools and/or specialised knowledge. The law has not changed and the current Arms Act, Section 2, Interpretation, states; pistol means a firearm (other than a prohibited firearm or restricted weapon) that is designed or adapted to be held and fired with 1 hand, and includes any firearm (other than a prohibited firearm or restricted weapon) that is less than 762 millimetres in length.

Originally Posted by gundoc

Do you have a reference or date for that decision? This is quite important as the method of measuring the overall length of a firearm had already been established in a court case many years ago. The term 'overall length' has been established as 'the longest physical dimension' and that measurement is usually from the muzzle to the toe of the stock (not necessarily parallel to the bore). It is important to note the 'muzzle' is not always the end of the barrel but the part where the bullet exits the firearm. That includes parts of the firearm that are in the original design and not readily removeable without tools and/or specialised knowledge. The law has not changed and the current Arms Act, Section 2, Interpretation, states; pistol means a firearm (other than a prohibited firearm or restricted weapon) that is designed or adapted to be held and fired with 1 hand, and includes any firearm (other than a prohibited firearm or restricted weapon) that is less than 762 millimetres in length.

After some searching on this topic I found heated discussion about it being 'Police policy' not legistation, and links to the police official decision on their website has since been removed.

Check these links on the bottom of this page and the last page of this thread.

https://kiwigunblog.wordpress.com/20...-policy-again/

https://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co....62/index5.html

I also found a letter of legal opinion from Nicholas Taylor so this policy may have been challenged post the court case that the accused was found guilty. Its a pdf so I cant share it here but it comes up in google.

I cant see any changes made to the arms act so I think just maybe the policy never got traction.
Interestingly my arms officer relayed this method of measuring oal to me so I will go back to him and ask for the reference to actual law stating this.

Great news if they pulled their heads in as I can make a much better Delisle suppressor with the shorter barrels

Originally Posted by gundoc

Do you have a reference or date for that decision? This is quite important as the method of measuring the overall length of a firearm had already been established in a court case many years ago. The term 'overall length' has been established as 'the longest physical dimension' and that measurement is usually from the muzzle to the toe of the stock (not necessarily parallel to the bore). It is important to note the 'muzzle' is not always the end of the barrel but the part where the bullet exits the firearm. That includes parts of the firearm that are in the original design and not readily removeable without tools and/or specialised knowledge. The law has not changed and the current Arms Act, Section 2, Interpretation, states; pistol means a firearm (other than a prohibited firearm or restricted weapon) that is designed or adapted to be held and fired with 1 hand, and includes any firearm (other than a prohibited firearm or restricted weapon) that is less than 762 millimetres in length.

I think that is "aimed" at Kea guns, but also means the Franchi SPAS-12 is a pistol --- if fitted with that curvy thingame on the stock that allow you to train it one-handed.