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Just posting so people won't miss it. Please read Kiwi Gun Blog's comments, check the linked documents, and write. Many of us wrote last year and may feel there is nothing new to say, but remember, death by a thousand cuts - do not give up using your voice.
Link to Kiwi Gun blog.
https://kiwigunblog.wordpress.com/20...e-submissions/
Good.
It's about time the security standards were raised. Things like racks on the wall with a gun held in place by the plastic trigger guard should never have been allowed
Bull shiteQuote:
Originally Posted by systolic
The Police Consultation Page:
News and updates
Consultation - Secure storage requirements for firearm licence holders: Police policy and practice
[18 April 2018] New Zealand Police is seeking feedback on the updated draft Secure Storage Requirements for Firearms Licence Holders.
This draft document has been updated since it was released in November 2017. Changes have been made based on feedback received last year. Those wishing to provide further feedback can contact us on secure-storage-firearms@police.govt.nz (link sends e-mail). Feedback closes at 5pm on 16 May 2018. Please put "Secure Storage" in the subject line.
Also attached is the report on Security and Storage of Firearms Public Submissions. This report will provide the reader with an understanding of submissions received as a result of the 2017 consultation and what action was taken.
Draft Secure Storage Requirements for Firearms Licence Holders (PDF 766KB)
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ce-holders.pdf
Report on Security and Storage of Firearms Public Submissions (PDF 587KB)
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssion-2018.pdf
List of Security and Storage of Firearms Public Submissions issues 2017 (PDF 551KB)
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssues-2017.pdf
Your feedback may be made publicly available by Police on its website, or to members of the public who request copies of submissions. Please indicate clearly if your identity or comments are provided in confidence, or if there is some other reason they should not be disclosed. Any request for non-disclosure will be considered in terms of the Official Information Act 1982. Your feedback may be edited for publication to anonymise it or remove sensitive information.
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ce-holders.pdf
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssion-2018.pdf
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssues-2017.pdf
The Police Consultation Page:
News and updates
Consultation - Secure storage requirements for firearm licence holders: Police policy and practice
[18 April 2018] New Zealand Police is seeking feedback on the updated draft Secure Storage Requirements for Firearms Licence Holders.
This draft document has been updated since it was released in November 2017. Changes have been made based on feedback received last year. Those wishing to provide further feedback can contact us on secure-storage-firearms@police.govt.nz (link sends e-mail). Feedback closes at 5pm on 16 May 2018. Please put "Secure Storage" in the subject line.
Also attached is the report on Security and Storage of Firearms Public Submissions. This report will provide the reader with an understanding of submissions received as a result of the 2017 consultation and what action was taken.
Draft Secure Storage Requirements for Firearms Licence Holders (PDF 766KB)
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ce-holders.pdf
Report on Security and Storage of Firearms Public Submissions (PDF 587KB)
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssion-2018.pdf
List of Security and Storage of Firearms Public Submissions issues 2017 (PDF 551KB)
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssues-2017.pdf
Your feedback may be made publicly available by Police on its website, or to members of the public who request copies of submissions. Please indicate clearly if your identity or comments are provided in confidence, or if there is some other reason they should not be disclosed. Any request for non-disclosure will be considered in terms of the Official Information Act 1982. Your feedback may be edited for publication to anonymise it or remove sensitive information.
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ce-holders.pdf
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssion-2018.pdf
http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/defa...ssues-2017.pdf
A little peeved to read Police did not review the over 600 submissions that followed the FOUNZ form... I specifically modified the FOUNZ form to suit my own comments and then found they basically didn't review it in detail just replied to the general comments of the original FOUNZ form!
That said, the revised Policy / Practice looks a lot better than last time - I still need to read it in detail.
The Police response to a whole bunch of the comments last time was pretty disappointing e.g. the receipt they proposed has been removed but they didn't explain its intended purpose / aim in being there in the first place.
More than a little peeved ! Call me a cynical bastard but I bet they read and did not like the content so chose to conveniently ignore the submissions
They probably treated the founz multi send as spam which in effect it was, read one read all.
I thought about using it but decided to make my own submission as I had slightly different views on some items.
My submission was quoted in the report, and I see they do make mention of the founz document but correctly state that the items raised were already covered by other submitters.
A bit dissapointing though that such a low number of individuals and organisations took the time to get off their arses imo
One aspect that would be useful to throw in the review pot is the transport and storage of firearms a thread here bought this up and it needs to be dealt with definitively
I think they clearly read some submissions. Some encouragement from the following:
-- Metal bars on windows, they added an opt out possibility by substitution with laminated security glass at discretion of inspector (which does not attract the same unwelcome attention as steel bars).
-- Binned a proposal to allow A Cat bolt actions, shotguns, .22 semis and bolt actions to be stored in a rack, but semiautomatic centerfire rifles to be kept in cabinet/safe only. This effectively banded A-cat into two levels of dangerousness -- a banding which was questionable at best.
Instead: practical solution - NO wooden gun rack for ANY A-cat firearm! Too right! Steel gun racks OK, sturdy cabinets OK.
-- Binned a reference to a British Standard which some protested it cost $200 to access!
Instead: document describes in detail the elements of what makes an acceptable cabinet. Niice, off to Mitre 10 and DIY now.
-- Binned a "contract" at the end of the document which would have made signatories contractually obliged to more than the law asks.
IMHO replying to this consultation was worth the time and effort, especially the sheer mass of us who were mobilised into action at short notice and took the time out to pen their thoughts. It indeed reminds me of another great and glorious moment:
'WESTMORLAND. "O that we now had here
But one ten thousand of those men in England
That do no work to-day!"
KING. "What's he that wishes so?
My cousin, Westmorland? No, my fair cousin;
If we are mark'd to die, we are enough
To do our country loss; and if to live,
The fewer men, the greater share of honour.
God's will! I pray thee, wish not one man more.
By Jove, I am not covetous for gold,
Nor care I who doth feed upon my cost;
It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desires.
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive.
No, faith, my coz, wish not a man from England.
God's peace! I would not lose so great an honour
As one man more methinks would share from me
For the best hope I have. O, do not wish one more!
Rather proclaim it, Westmorland, through my host,
That he which hath no stomach to this fight,
Let him depart; his passport shall be made,
And crowns for convoy put into his purse;
We would not die in that man's company
That fears his fellowship to die with us.
This day is call'd the feast of Crispian.
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when this day is nam'd,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say "To-morrow is Saint Crispian."
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars,
And say "These wounds I had on Crispin's day."
Old men forget; yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember, with advantages,
What feats he did that day. Then shall our names,
Familiar in his mouth as household words—
Harry the King, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester—
Be in their flowing cups freshly rememb'red.
This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be rememberèd—
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day."'
i fail to see how my ar15 is more dangerous than my 7mm rem mag bolt action
@gonetropoQuote:
Originally Posted by gonetropo
Well, they appear to agree with you now -- at least as long as they're both A-cat.
E-cat is a legally defined category. Thus the hands of the guideline committee are tied from shining either wisdom or stupidity on MSSAs.
Raising the standards only makes it a detriment for us all and once the law has been changed it can never be taken back.
@systolic if we carry on with your logic only the rich will be shooting. Cheaper alternatives to safes are an option for: Uni students, people on low income, the elderly, people with holiday homes/bach/hut, people with RV's and caravans, people who hunt/shoot at multiple locations throughout NZ e.g: A family members house or friends house.
These are just to name a few, do these people no longer have the right to enjoy the sport we love? It's unrealistic and unfair to expect everyone to buy a "certified" safe for every occasion or circumstance.
lets face reality.
If they want into most normal gun cabinet and lock ups, a grinder with a cut off wheel, saw etc or any other electrical tool to suit and they are in, in about 5 minutes even 3mm ones. Consider the battery grinders around now. @Sasquatch Agreed- once up there it would be a miracle with nowadays anti gunning, lack of common sense society to get it back.
Current laws suggest to be made of stout enough construction to prevent a crim getting in there easily. If they are prepared it would have to be 6mm and up but again those thin cut off wheels cut like light sabres so it wouldn't take long.
The blades are good too! I just cut up 50 odd meters of old cast iron sewer pipe while working on a house here. Only used five blades!
Wonder what that is in safe meters :P