Exactly. If you didn't own the guns, there wouldn't have been a need for the register in the first place. It's a predictable narrative.Quote:
Originally Posted by scotty
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Exactly. If you didn't own the guns, there wouldn't have been a need for the register in the first place. It's a predictable narrative.Quote:
Originally Posted by scotty
'Mosaic' The UN rearing its ugly head again.
When a District Court judge comes up with finding 'A', the High Court says no, we believe its finding 'B' then the Supreme Court says no silly, its finding 'C' I have lost any faith I had in the supposed Justice system.
Couple that with the work and life practises of the vast majority of people these days who can go through their entire existence never being exposed to the harsh realities of practical life and sensible legislation and regulations is but a dim distant memory.
Something about hard times breeds hard men, easy times breeds soft men etc etc.
Yes I watched that clip on one news myself, and my ears did prick up too,,, however..Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnwolf
I am pretty sure the word he used, was not "semiautomatic" but actually "weaponary".
Not a suprizing stance, since the police are always on the receiving end of illegitimate firearm use.
But vary scary for the legitimate users.
Yes, that point has been raised before. Apparently it's a known thing that to be a successful Police officer you are one or two steps removed from actually being a criminal in your mindset - I forget the study that raised that as one of it's findings but those of us that don't function in that fashion will not make a good cop. For the general public, the easiest way to rationalise this is simply that the functioning viewpoint for some Police is that every law abiding person is simply someone that hasn't been caught yet. It's easy to see in that context why having the firearms regime administered by Police is going to run into conflict, and also why having someone like Mark Mitchell as Police minister is a shitty serve simplky because as an ex-cop he's indoctrinated and taking the line he's trained for. One could argue it is setting yourself up to fail as the mindset from the outside looking in is so closed you stand very little chance of changing it. And that applies to a lot of my current dealings with Govt entities - point out the obvious failings in the policies and dept line of thinking and it's instantly too hard and you get silence back. Delay delay delay... It really doesn't need to be that hard, but the issue appears to be in a large part that the lower down workers do not want to raise the issue with the higher ups, as it might look bad but are also not empowered to deal with it themselves so stick it straight into the too hard basket until it can be biffed off to someone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by trapperjohn
That is a typo or a misprint, surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
"Firearms are not a thing New Zealanders should just have to learn to live with"Quote:
Originally Posted by Oscar
Remember, he is ex police, even if it was only to the lofty heights of being a dog handler.
The mindset of police is that ANY civilian with a firearm is a criminal until they prove themselves to be otherwise.
The only people who should be allowed possession/use of firearms are the military and (para)military i.e. police.
A registry is the ultimate shopping list for the "powers that be" when they deem it to be an appropriate time to disarm the populace, in accordance with the whims of the unelected "new world order" thinkers.
When was the last time that the voting public of this country were asked to either approve or disapprove of the various "rules" that we are obliged to follow, at the behest of body's such as the UN, WHO etc. Look where that's getting us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by no1_49er
Statistically the dog handlers are on the receiving end of bad guys intentions more often than other police. My neighbour is dog squad and has been shot at several times. It would give a biased viewpoint about firearms.
Wrongthink - rather than blaming the criminal for undertaking an action that is a crime using an inanimate object, lets take the easy way out and make excuses for the criminal and try to stop them from doing criminal acts by trying to stop them from getting the tool they used.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Waimata
Can anyone else see the very slight flaw in that master stroke of genius?
"Bad people do bad things, and good people making rules will not stop the bad people from doing bad things". As soon as we can get that little snippet bit of wisdom accepted we will all be better off and more financially stable as a society one would think.
This entire gun fetish that is flopping about like a dying fish on land at the moment can easily be applied to motorbikes, cars, trucks (and probably especially trucks as they are used to flog containers full of whatever off the wharf) and anything else already registered. Doesn't seem to do much for crime stats, I see more waffle about crushing cars getting flopped out. What, we've had two or three cars only crushed so far? Starting to very much sound like no new ideas but if we stick to the line it will be enough.
As far as Mark Mitchell's statement, it does offend me that he is so accepting that criminals will do bad things and it can't be helped. He really does not have a clue.
Something, something, only tool is a hammer, something.Quote:
Originally Posted by No.3
It's more important to give the impression of doing something than to actually effectively do that thing, it seems.
Quote:
Originally Posted by No.3
Mitchell is ex-dog squad, and has seen combat in Iraq. All I'm saying is he's seen what bad guys with guns can do, and supports his old mates in the police. It's not hard to understand where he's coming from, even if we don't agree.
Personally I don't think there was ever any chance the register was going to be canned before it collapses, for political reasons. What will be interesting will be to see National response to the Arms act rewriting. Semi auto rifles for sports shooting are no more problematic than the public owning pistols, will both be legal, or both banned?
The Iraq side is interesting, as from the stories it's likely he's seen what bad guys with improvised munitions can do as well. No thought to increase control of fert or fuel, or vehicles or any of the other myriad of things that were used in the fighting over there. That can do real serious damage... My own opinion is that I suspect there is more to the story with firearms than we are being told and that for whatever reason the 'line being pushed' is not going away as others have said and that to make any changes in that space may be non-starters no matter how good the evidence or how undeniable the logic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Waimata
8.5mill just to run the registry a year would likely either 'fix' or go a very long way towards fixing the Nelson hospital issues, and that would save a lot more than 2 lives a year that Mitchell quoted as justifying the registry (and that's ignoring the fact that there are no stats or any measures that could prove this either way and that he stated that the registry is only intended to give a picture of lawful firearms ownership but then stated that if it saves 2 lives a year through criminal use of firearms then it is worth it - both statements being mutually exclusive).
On this one, despite the fact that I think Act don't get everything right by a long shot - I think that on the Arms Act issues they have nailed it on the head and that National's position is not supported by evidence and only exists to fuel emotional arguments.
Speaking of distractions we need like a serious medical event:
https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/na...ety-authority/
....And then our 'overlords' get pinged for not being 'fit and proper' themselves:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politi...NZZSV3VQIU5OU/
The statistical value of a human life in NZ is 12.5 million I think. Theoretically that's the number they use to base Government decisions from health to roading from what I understand. You'd think there would be better return on lives for your dollar than the firearms registry. Interestingly it looks to have trebled in the last 5 years so they should be looking at a pile of projects to spend money on to catch up with that.
It's a fair bet that by bailing early (resigning) he'll keep his pension because there's no further need for scrutiny.Quote:
Originally Posted by XR500
Had he been fired, Bye bye pension.
....And since he was put on leave on full pay only a couple of weeks after the new Commissioner was in the seat he's pocketed half a year's salary (say half of half a mil).
Hopefully the "very serious allegations" result in charges. Then he'll spend all his pension on lawyers...