Thread: we are up against stupidity

Whilst what I am about to say will be unpopular, c'est la vie....
______

I paraphrase:

If we own and possess the ability to make fire in our backyards for BBQ's and fire pits and incinerators and such, and people across the land, foolishly burn down houses and sometimes kill people by the indiscriminate use of such:

Instead of screaming about our "rights" or "privileges" to continue doing so and opposing any moves by society to reign in the damage and injury cause by such use of fire:

Why don't we come to the party and propose workable and sensible solutions to the problems, instead of bleating loudly on internet forums with all the logic and aforethought of a toddler having his best toy taken away for repair.

______

My solution to this is get down the all the meetings that politicians hold and express a polite and well thought out view point.

______

the play book that goes:

"they are lying". "they are evil"
"what about that person who did something bad?" "leave me alone"
"remember that guy who was innocent"
"what about that time that the (insert authority here) didn't prevent a crime before it happened"
"there're places in the world that are much worse than us"

is the playbook of dolts
______

We'd be better off, if we all tried to work together, not complaining, every time an idea we don't like surfaces.

This is a democracy and if the changes to laws, are something we don't like, there's a polling booth coming up, just around the corner.
______

Lastly - in this world of reality TV, the viewpoints of the Karens and Man-babies in such programmes, is fast becoming the thinking of our younger society.

Originally Posted by MarkN

Whilst what I am about to say will be unpopular, c'est la vie....
______

I paraphrase:

If we own and possess the ability to make fire in our backyards for BBQ's and fire pits and incinerators and such, and people across the land, foolishly burn down houses and sometimes kill people by the indiscriminate use of such:

Instead of screaming about our "rights" or "privileges" to continue doing so and opposing any moves by society to reign in the damage and injury cause by such use of fire:

Why don't we come to the party and propose workable and sensible solutions to the problems, instead of bleating loudly on internet forums with all the logic and aforethought of a toddler having his best toy taken away for repair.

______

My solution to this is get down the all the meetings that politicians hold and express a polite and well thought out view point.

______

the play book that goes:

"they are lying". "they are evil"
"what about that person who did something bad?" "leave me alone"
"remember that guy who was innocent"
"what about that time that the (insert authority here) didn't prevent a crime before it happened"
"there're places in the world that are much worse than us"

is the playbook of dolts
______

We'd be better off, if we all tried to work together, not complaining, every time an idea we don't like surfaces.

This is a democracy and if the changes to laws, are something we don't like, there's a polling booth coming up, just around the corner.
______

Lastly - in this world of reality TV, the viewpoints of the Karens and Man-babies in such programmes, is fast becoming the thinking of our younger society.

I agree Mark.
Our best way forward is civilised face to face discussion with our MPs.
If every politician gets a well thought out view from a legitimate firearm user, they may have a different view when this topic gets discussed in house.

Originally Posted by 7mmwsm

I agree Mark.
Our best way forward is civilised face to face discussion with our MPs.
If every politician gets a well thought out view from a legitimate firearm user, they may have a different view when this topic gets discussed in house.

Regardless of if aspiring /incumbent polis agree with our POV or not its simply not likely to get them reelected or up the party ladder if it be known they agree which to them is the sole focus of their existence and in some cases sole reason for their existence. we are facing a multi pronged attack as I said previously and history shows a singular body facing a mutli axis force will always be at the disadvantage regardless of tactic .
There is a degree of naivety on here ,that is not meant as a detraction.Isee ample evidence of the multi prong anti ie media ,academia. judiary, police union ,police hq and assorted motley groups of fringe politicians and vested interests have imbued in the generally compliant urban populace an endemic abhorrence of firearms and anything to do with them,like a mass administration of a psychoactive tranquilliser and mere mention of the word (generally incorrect and hysterical in MSM cases) is enough to keep that loathing festering away .

Shes a sad fact of life gents but social media and psych manipulation is rife in Nz no matter how much we try to puit across a rational coherent case for our side of the argument.

Originally Posted by kotuku

Regardless of if aspiring /incumbent polis agree with our POV or not its simply not likely to get them reelected or up the party ladder if it be known they agree which to them is the sole focus of their existence and in some cases sole reason for their existence. we are facing a multi pronged attack as I said previously and history shows a singular body facing a mutli axis force will always be at the disadvantage regardless of tactic .
There is a degree of naivety on here ,that is not meant as a detraction.Isee ample evidence of the multi prong anti ie media ,academia. judiary, police union ,police hq and assorted motley groups of fringe politicians and vested interests have imbued in the generally compliant urban populace an endemic abhorrence of firearms and anything to do with them,like a mass administration of a psychoactive tranquilliser and mere mention of the word (generally incorrect and hysterical in MSM cases) is enough to keep that loathing festering away .

Shes a sad fact of life gents but social media and psych manipulation is rife in Nz no matter how much we try to puit across a rational coherent case for our side of the argument.

I think you are correct but fuck I'm gonna go down fighting

Originally Posted by MarkN

Whilst what I am about to say will be unpopular, c'est la vie....
______

I paraphrase:

If we own and possess the ability to make fire in our backyards for BBQ's and fire pits and incinerators and such, and people across the land, foolishly burn down houses and sometimes kill people by the indiscriminate use of such:

Instead of screaming about our "rights" or "privileges" to continue doing so and opposing any moves by society to reign in the damage and injury cause by such use of fire:

Why don't we come to the party and propose workable and sensible solutions to the problems, instead of bleating loudly on internet forums with all the logic and aforethought of a toddler having his best toy taken away for repair.

______

My solution to this is get down the all the meetings that politicians hold and express a polite and well thought out view point.

______

the play book that goes:

"they are lying". "they are evil"
"what about that person who did something bad?" "leave me alone"
"remember that guy who was innocent"
"what about that time that the (insert authority here) didn't prevent a crime before it happened"
"there're places in the world that are much worse than us"

is the playbook of dolts
______

We'd be better off, if we all tried to work together, not complaining, every time an idea we don't like surfaces.

This is a democracy and if the changes to laws, are something we don't like, there's a polling booth coming up, just around the corner.
______

Lastly - in this world of reality TV, the viewpoints of the Karens and Man-babies in such programmes, is fast becoming the thinking of our younger society.

Closest we have here is COLFO and whatever one thinks of them (I'm a supporter), it would probably be better to put your shoulder to their wheel rather than reinventing ones own

Originally Posted by MarkN

Whilst what I am about to say will be unpopular, c'est la vie....
______

I paraphrase:

If we own and possess the ability to make fire in our backyards for BBQ's and fire pits and incinerators and such, and people across the land, foolishly burn down houses and sometimes kill people by the indiscriminate use of such:

Instead of screaming about our "rights" or "privileges" to continue doing so and opposing any moves by society to reign in the damage and injury cause by such use of fire:

Why don't we come to the party and propose workable and sensible solutions to the problems, instead of bleating loudly on internet forums with all the logic and aforethought of a toddler having his best toy taken away for repair.

______

My solution to this is get down the all the meetings that politicians hold and express a polite and well thought out view point.

______

the play book that goes:

"they are lying". "they are evil"
"what about that person who did something bad?" "leave me alone"
"remember that guy who was innocent"
"what about that time that the (insert authority here) didn't prevent a crime before it happened"
"there're places in the world that are much worse than us"

is the playbook of dolts
______

We'd be better off, if we all tried to work together, not complaining, every time an idea we don't like surfaces.

This is a democracy and if the changes to laws, are something we don't like, there's a polling booth coming up, just around the corner.
______

Lastly - in this world of reality TV, the viewpoints of the Karens and Man-babies in such programmes, is fast becoming the thinking of our younger society.

I think your bang on the money, to beat the system, you've got to work WITH it not AGAINST it. You look at America and most non firearms holders think the NRA are a group of right wing gun toting lunatics, in no small part because there spokesmen consistently come across with not much credibility and that doesn't help our cause. To fight fire with fire we need to be able to present consistently accurate and plausible arguments to counter the anti-gun lobby. To my mind that maybe looks like questioning the rhetoric of the likes of Cahill where he makes claims that he can't substantiate and all the others and asking how can 26 known gang members be licensed firearms holders, given that one of the qualifiers for obtaining a FAl is to be a fit and proper person....and I don't see that aligning with gang membership.

My experience of working WITH the system (as in operating at a level they can comprehend rather than just throwing a tanty) stems from many years of being involved with the riders rights movement in UK/Europe in the 90's. So much legislation was stopped in it's tracks by our representatives making reasoned arguments backed up with facts that proved our position and disproved the position of the morons that were trying to insist that motorbikes should be fitted with airbags and leg protectors, to name just a couple

Your average car at 100 km/h has more impact energy than a 50BMG...

Ban cars!

Originally Posted by caberslash

Your average car at 100 km/h has more impact energy than a 50BMG...

Ban cars!

Ive mooted that for years in conversations with assorted do gooders and cops -none want to listen some wilfully ignorant .what happened when crusher proposed crushing the fuckers cars -a bloody great whohaa about peoples rights FFS and the silicone polis complied .

FFS theres a guy up before the beak on his 9th DUI recently ..lock him up ...not on your nelly well try the softly softly approach! .young prick full of cum and assorted substances going like a madman kills three people in his car -beak your traumatised enough ..intense supervision " 16months later he repeats the bloody act!!!

if we tried that as FALOs the beak and boys in blue would throw the fucking book at us and we know it . dont forget either theres a section of judiciary who it seems think they can reinterpret law as they see fit despite it being outside their mandate.
Mark N -sound in theory mate but reality is youre pissing into a screaming norwester and i suspect have a very distinct sensation of wet feet!

In principle I agree.
The difference in reality is that some of the party politics suggest firearms are no good. If you get someone relatively young from a city then sympathy and also even a small working knowledge of firearms is extremely low.
There will be a lot in there that are nudging towards the antis and don't actually want to listen. We shall see.

Well said @MarkN and @308.

Can’t help but wonder how these threads show up to them fellers who read it (no doubt it will at some stage) and the optics that comes from some of the comments left.

To be fair - the people that whinge and bitch the most about guns being dangerous and needing to be banned, are generally the same people who bitch and moan about the state of the public estate and the lack of conservation efforts.

Those same people don't realise that the work they've done to ban guns means the work they are doing to try to improve forest health and species conservation is going backwards.

I've had a couple of conversations with a few people that 'hate all things guns' and once you explain the way the system is set up in NZ and correct the bullshit being spouted by a lot of (urban) journalists they come around to the realisation that not all is as they have been led to believe. The problem is the (possibly intentional as my opinion) damage being done to conservation outcomes to justify a business outcome, its just that the resourcing no longer exists to do the job!

You make the world no safer by taking a firearm from an individual who was never going to use it illegally (or stupidly) in the first place.

Originally Posted by Basenjiboy

You make the world no safer by taking a firearm from an individual who was never going to use it illegally (or stupidly) in the first place.

You’re making entirely too much sense there mate. Probably should quit before it catches on

There are few inaccuracies in the article. A pta and 28 day wait applies to first purchase only in NSW. Other states also.

Laws vary by state, wa is and has always been difficult for shooters.

Most other states are similar to nz, timelines to get a license here are more rapid. Maybe 3 months max.

No limits on purchases outside of wa.
Genuine reason is a club membership eg nzda or handloaders or hunting permits for public lands. Farm permissions etc.


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Just heard carhill on the news saying theres still gang members out there with firearms despite the ones they have confiscated......no fukn shit