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Thread: New firearms bill, clarification re semi shotgun mags

  1. #1
    Member Cordite's Avatar
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    New firearms bill, clarification re semi shotgun mags

    As the text in the legislation goes:

    2A Meaning of prohibited firearm

    In this Act, unless the context otherwise requires, prohibited firearm—
    (a)
    means the following firearms:
    (i)
    a semi-automatic firearm (except a pistol), other than—
    (A)
    a semi-automatic firearm that is capable of firing only 0.22 calibre or less rimfire cartridges and that has a magazine, whether or not detachable or otherwise externally fed, that is capable of holding no more than 10 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size:
    (B)
    a semi-automatic shotgun with a non-detachable tubular magazine or magazines that are capable of holding no more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size:
    (ii)
    a pump-action shotgun that is capable of being used with a detachable magazine:
    (iii)
    a pump-action shotgun that has a non-detachable tubular magazine or magazines that are capable of holding more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size; and
    (b)
    includes any other firearm declared by Order in Council made under section 74A to be a prohibited firearm for the purposes of this Act.

    What do you think, does the proposed act then allow a semi-auto shotgun with 5-round box mags?
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  2. #2
    Member stug's Avatar
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    Nope, shotguns with box mags are not tubular mags, therefore are not exempt and are a prohibited firearm.

    Actually I read that again. Might be ok. Send in a submission on it.

  3. #3
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    I know someone who was involved in the discussion about what would still be allowed....he reckoned we are lucky to still be allowed 5 shot tube mags in shotguns.I am highly annoyed that they have banned ALL centerfire semi's without the same sort of small magazine exemption,this just makes no sense to me at all.
    199p, tetawa, Woody and 3 others like this.

  4. #4
    Member Cordite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GDMP View Post
    I know someone who was involved in the discussion about what would still be allowed....he reckoned we are lucky to still be allowed 5 shot tube mags in shotguns.I am highly annoyed that they have banned ALL centerfire semi's without the same sort of small magazine exemption,this just makes no sense to me at all.
    No, not if you consider you can make a Sten from plans on the web. The 15 March massacre is repeatable just like that. I don't feel much safer with these new laws, except for one facet: I do trust NZP to be politically correct and inclusive...and so in future they'll give FAL's to anyone called Mohammed, even if a local AO might be uneasy about it. If my misgiving proves correct, then maybe best semi rifles remain off the menu for everyone - for everyones' sake.

    That said... see what just a bolt action battle rifle can be used for.



    No, banning stuff is not what makes us safer.
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  5. #5
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    Cordite posted: -

    2A Meaning of prohibited firearm
    In this Act, unless the context otherwise requires, prohibited firearm—
    (a) means the following firearms:
    (i) a semi-automatic firearm (except a pistol), other than
    (B) a semi-automatic shotgun with a non-detachable tubular magazine or magazines that are capable of holding no more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size:

    And the subsequent question: - What do you think, does the proposed act then allow a semi-auto shotgun with 5-round box mags?

    GDMP said: - I am highly annoyed that they have banned ALL centerfire semi's without the same sort of small magazine exemption, this just makes no sense to me at all.

    Why then is it that centrefire semi-auto firearms are singled out, when 2(B) appears to permit box magazine shotguns provided that said magazine can hold no more than five rounds?

    This is exactly why legislation that is rushed into law is bound to contain anomalies.

    prohibited firearm means a semi-automatic firearm, other than a semi-automatic shotgun with magazines that are capable of holding no more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size

  6. #6
    Member Marty Henry's Avatar
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    Commensurate with that firearms chamber size, off the barrel if my beretta, 3 1/2 in, 3, in, 2 3/4 in. All three may be used in it, the mag capacity is 5 3 1/2, so its legal but 6 2 3/4 fit so its also prohibited at the same time.
    The police disclosure doc mentions 6 rounds for tube mags so is at odds with the act.
    Needs sorting, and is part of my submission.

  7. #7
    Member gadgetman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Henry View Post
    Commensurate with that firearms chamber size, off the barrel if my beretta, 3 1/2 in, 3, in, 2 3/4 in. All three may be used in it, the mag capacity is 5 3 1/2, so its legal but 6 2 3/4 fit so its also prohibited at the same time.
    The police disclosure doc mentions 6 rounds for tube mags so is at odds with the act.
    Needs sorting, and is part of my submission.
    No, it's quite clear.

    commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size
    So if it says it has a 3.5" chamber then it is OK if it can take 5x 3.5" rounds.
    There are only three types of people in this world. Those that can count, and those that can't!

  8. #8
    Shootin the breeze.... Survy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gadgetman View Post
    No, it's quite clear.



    So if it says it has a 3.5" chamber then it is OK if it can take 5x 3.5" rounds.
    @gadgetman I ain’t the smartest cookie in the jar but your explanation makes clear sense to me.
    Why didn’t they write the bill that way, with examples.
    “he waka eke noa”

  9. #9
    Member gadgetman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Survy View Post
    @gadgetman I ain’t the smartest cookie in the jar but your explanation makes clear sense to me.
    Why didn’t they write the bill that way, with examples.
    They don't want it too easy. If they did that the lawyers would get bored.
    There are only three types of people in this world. Those that can count, and those that can't!

  10. #10
    Member chainsaw's Avatar
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    they deliberately want ambiguity in what/how they write this so they have the opportunity for further punitive interpretations in the future
    sightpicture likes this.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cordite View Post
    As the text in the legislation goes:

    2A Meaning of prohibited firearm

    In this Act, unless the context otherwise requires, prohibited firearm—
    (a)
    means the following firearms:
    (i)
    a semi-automatic firearm (except a pistol), other than—
    (A)
    a semi-automatic firearm that is capable of firing only 0.22 calibre or less rimfire cartridges and that has a magazine, whether or not detachable or otherwise externally fed, that is capable of holding no more than 10 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size:
    (B)
    a semi-automatic shotgun with a non-detachable tubular magazine or magazines that are capable of holding no more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size:
    (ii)
    a pump-action shotgun that is capable of being used with a detachable magazine:
    (iii)
    a pump-action shotgun that has a non-detachable tubular magazine or magazines that are capable of holding more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size; and
    (b)
    includes any other firearm declared by Order in Council made under section 74A to be a prohibited firearm for the purposes of this Act.

    What do you think, does the proposed act then allow a semi-auto shotgun with 5-round box mags?
    As long as it isn't detachable.

  12. #12
    Member Cordite's Avatar
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    "a semi-automatic shotgun with a non-detachable tubular magazine or magazines that are capable of holding no more than 5 cartridges commensurate with that firearm’s chamber size:"

    Further reflection...

    ...I think "or magazineS" refers to that unusually ugly Kel-Tec shotgun with twin tube magazines -- in case some joker turns up with a 2x5 shot capacity SG and thinks he is smart.

    ...The end of the sentence "commensurate with that firearm's chamber size" must still refer to a shotgun tubular magazine. You always count capacity in terms of the max length of shell the chamber can take - it can not apply to box magazines as shell length does not affect their capacity.
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