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I like the sound of a Grendel. How much of an improvement would one be over a 223 shooting heavier bullets?
This would be out of a short barrel bush hunting set up.
My gut feeling would be that there would be no real discernable difference over sub 200 m ranges.
Would this be a fair assumption?
The "advantage" of the Grendel/6.8SPC etc is the 120+ grain projectiles "might" have a bit more penetration if you are shooting bigger animals. I've now shot two big reg stags with less than optimum bullet placement with the 6.8SPC (for all intents and purposes identical to a Grendel) and in both cases go away with it. Im not too sure I would have with a 223. Cheers
I haven't hunted first hand with the 6.5 Grendel but compared to the .223 it has better muzzle energy, better BC, better sectional density.
The Grendel typically has 20% more muzzle energy than the 7.62x39 due to higher muzzle velocity, and the better BC allows it to hold that velocity gain down range.
When I changed from .223 to 7.62x39 for hunting goats and deer, I was astounded at the extra real world killing power of the 7.62x39.
I expect you would see the same performance jump between the .223 and 6.5.
The 7.62x39 is I find really underrated in real world performance, I've never had any issues with it with dropping things - but also I'm not taking dodgy shots and a few inches offline for my shot placement is still a killing impact. I'd rather take the next animal than have to chase one hahahaha - although having said that I'm not chasing much right now as I have the same issue as the bloody ferries mechanical unreliability.
I suspect the grendel will offer the same advantage, the bigger the hole the more light gets in and the more the bits inside leak out.
Yeah, interesting these are all around the same usage as 30-30, 7 waters, 38-55, 35rem
Yep, I'm sure I'd be just as happy with a mini in 7.62 x 39Quote:
Originally Posted by No.3
I think the key to these cartridges (and the 223 for that matter) is to limit your shots to not too much further than 200M - the energy put on target is just so much less than a big centrefire . . .
I've never lost an animal with the 7.62x39. I've lost a red spiker hit solidly with a .223, and for me, that was one too many.
I personally find the 7.62x39 the perfect mix of stopping power without the massive meat loss caused by the bigger calibers. I suspect that the 6.5G would be on par, on the basis that you are hunting at ranges under 200m.
Back in the days before the great confiscation, I had Mini-30's, and an AR15 chambered in 7.62x39. The AR was an awesome kit for goat culling. One afternoon I happened upon three hinds - three shots in just over three seconds and three deer down. Took me three hours to bone out all the meat :D Good times!
7.62 x 39 would be cheap to feed too.
PPU 123gn soft points @$27 box at reloaders is pretty good - advertised velocity is 2,350 - my magnetospeed said 2,300 from a 16" barrel with a DPT can on the end. I got 5 boxes should do me a while ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Chur Bay
I think if I did a Grendel again, I'd stick to 90-100gr bullets to get a boost in speed and just limit my range. I used 123gr SST's back in the day. They were going pretty slow out of my 16" and didn't kill things very convincingly. Granted all the shots I took were 200m+.
Yeah they make a great bush gun out to 150m sort of thing and factory ammo is probably about the cheapest option out thereQuote:
Originally Posted by No.3
The advantage to a Grendel is its ability to hunt out to about 400m with the right load
The disadvantage is factory ammo options are limited and expensive
So it’s really a handloaders caliber
As far as vs 223 it’s just a far bigger punch 100-120gn vs 50-80 odd (if you have a fast twist rifle)
Nothing wrong with 223 but Grendel is quite a bit more
Maybe like a 243 vs a 308 same sort of thing
If I went back to the Grendel I would run an 85 hammer and hammer them down lol. Seriously at around 3100 I would say lights out.
Where do you buy those?Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokeyJason
I'm hoping to mitigate your sst experience by using the eldm but I would prefer to run 100gr BTs if I could get someQuote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
+1 on the PPUQuote:
Originally Posted by AMac
I purchased 3 cases/slabs/crates of this when it was branded Highland and was on special and cheaper than milsurp. Couldn't believe my luck - brass cased, copper jacketed PSP cheaper than steel cased FMJ in .223 or 7.62???? Perfect performing hunting round, and I have enough for a couple of generations of shooters to follow me.
One thing that I think works in the advantage of the 7.62x39 - due to the odd ball projectile dia, the hunting projectiles for this round have been designed correctly for the 7.62x39 velocity.
The 6.5G, along with the likes of the 6.5x55 at M38 pressures, are at the slower end of the 6.5 spectrum. 6.5 projectiles are designed for average velocities for the caliber. At Grendel velocities, you are dropping off the expansion performance curve by the time the bullet gets to the target. Another example of this is the 300 Blackout, where it has performed poorly until dedicated, soft wall projectiles started coming onto the market.
Ive had good success with deer and pigs 100-150y 123g eldm. havent lost any yet. I limit my range as i only have a 16" barrel on a zastava mini. super light weight as i fitted a Paulownia stock to it. weighs less than a bare tikka with scope, rings and suppressor fitted.
The good old us of a. They are a bit pricey to import but if you have a friend or two then no problem to bring in the suitcase, I've got someone bringing me some 21 gr in 17 cal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Longrun
.223 vs grendel is not even comparable really.
We have both, used a .223 alot and pretty new the grendel(only maybe 20 animals) and its a night and day difference.
With most loads a grendel will have equal energy at 250 yards as a .223 has at the muzzle......
If your primary goal is shooting deer, grendel all day.
If your just shooting wallabies or goats the .223 is potentially better(cheaper, more ammo in the mag etc)
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I have no doubt the Grendel is a thing of beauty and a step up from the .223.Quote:
Originally Posted by JP100
I wonder what projectiles you were using in the .223? Not dissing your experience but the heavy for caliber .223 bullets in the 70-80 grn class are great and make up for lack of energy by causing disproportional wound damage and physical trauma. Mine kills well and cleanly out to 250 odd yards and further.
A Grendel sounds a good option if you don't have a slow twist .223 but otherwise I'd stick to the .223.
We have primarily used the 55gn Hornady soft points, because the ,223 we have was a 'normal' twist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahr
These bullets do perform pretty well, and have seen stags and even one Bull tahr dropped with them out to 200+ yards.
I have a fast twist .223 now, so will be starting on the 70gn projectiles, I have no doubt they are much better, but a Grendel will still push a bigger bullet, have more energy and with the right bullet have deeper penetration and a similar wound channel.
The only real disadvantage to the grendel would be ammo cost/availability(compared to a .223), but if your comparing it with heavy .223 ammo, chances are your reloading anyway, so the difference is minimal