How "cool" is cool for gunpowder storage.

AS it is illegal for gunpowder in bulk, i.e not in cartridges, to be stored inside a "house", we have to find alternative storage and for most it will be a free standing garage or outbuilding.

The containers state a requirement for "Dry" (no problem in most cases) and cool storage.

I am cognisant of the fact that many garages (mine included) warm up quite considerably during the day and wonder what the actual temperature is when cool changes to warm as well as what the safety limit is for gunpowder, including Black Powder .

Anybody aware of a specific temperature as opposed to the weasel Lawyer words "Cool"?

A quick Google comes up with ideally 21-25 degrees, definitely below 38 degrees.

I keep my powder in the shed and it gets pretty warm in there. I keep the powder in a chillybin in a wooden cupboard to try and minimise the temperature variation.

definitely try and keep it below 25 although I have used powder that had been stored for 15 plus years (at times in excess of 40C) with no problems ie. it worked but how efficiently is up for debate.

If you can modify it, fit a tropical roof to your garage.
Between 6 and 8 inch air gap should do the trick.

Attachment 126738

Attachment 126739

Considering our powder comes to our shores in a standard container (according to NZAmmo) and a lot of it comes from the Northern Hemisphere I do wonder how hot it gets as it sails through the tropics.

I’d say under 35 and under 30 would be ideal as a average mean summer max.

In western old we use old fridges as powder stores. Seems to work just fine.

You will have no issues in NZ if stored indoors away from the radiating heat of brick walls, heating etc.

I store mine in a tin shed, near floor level and not in direct sunlight. I'd be more concerned about degradation of double base powders in the heat, but them igniting is not a big concern. More worried about the plastic can of petrol by the lawnmower in the cellar under our house. Now THAT is a potential danger.

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Originally Posted by Kiwi Sapper

AS it is illegal for gunpowder in bulk, i.e not in cartridges, to be stored inside a "house", we have to find alternative storage and for most it will be a free standing garage or outbuilding.

The containers state a requirement for "Dry" (no problem in most cases) and cool storage.

I am cognisant of the fact that many garages (mine included) warm up quite considerably during the day and wonder what the actual temperature is when cool changes to warm as well as what the safety limit is for gunpowder, including Black Powder .

Anybody aware of a specific temperature as opposed to the weasel Lawyer words "Cool"?

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It’s that an old or a new Gnash idiot rule? I keep mine under the bed with my bank notes?

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Originally Posted by Maca49

It’s that an old or a new Gnash idiot rule? I keep mine under the bed with my bank notes?

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bank notes??????? what the hell are they ......are they those things with someones ugly mug on them ? havent seen something like that since i got married are they still legal tender?

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Originally Posted by Maca49

It’s that an old or a new Gnash idiot rule? I keep mine under the bed with my bank notes?

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With your plastic inflatable doll or in the box with the whips and dress up costumes ?

What Ho Chaps,
Many thanks for the informed replies,...................although some of the later responses did tend to wander slightly from the subject matter. (Haven't the quality of inflatable dolls improved in the last couple of years, even inflatable sheep are now available)

I recognise the sense in what @terryf says, but lack motivation to spend large amounts of moolah on my tin roofed garage, but as I have a small portable refrigerator made in the style of a chilly bin which is of little use now that it has lost it's refrigerant I will adopt the ides of @Dicko and @Cigar.

I use one of those insulated lunchbox thermal container bags less than $10 on ebay or even less from the op shops.
They keep the temps even and the fluctuation low, fits 2 of the 500grams containers.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Insulate...dcP3RhxbLtySTA

Can you direct me to the legislation please.

I understand it's cyclic heat changes as much as the specific heat itself, so I keep my powder in a couple of cheap chilly bins in the garage. It's dry, and will be the most temperature stable place in the whole house. Uses no electricity etc etc

I too am wondering since when can you not store in the house?

Attachment 126773

I use one of these, a fire resistant safe, briefcase size. I figure that the composition of it will keep powder at a stable temp. Lives tucked away from the house outdoors, each container of powder individually bagged to keep moisture out.

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Originally Posted by scotty

bank notes??????? what the hell are they ......are they those things with someones ugly mug on them ? havent seen something like that since i got married are they still legal tender?

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Another day in your life you will regret is when they cease to be legal tender, and yet some people think it is a good idea?????

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Originally Posted by Max Headroom

Attachment 126773

I use one of these, a fire resistant safe, briefcase size. I figure that the composition of it will keep powder at a stable temp. Lives tucked away from the house outdoors, each container of powder individually bagged to keep moisture out.

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Great for Black Powder.... BOOM!!

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Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

With your plastic inflatable doll or in the box with the whips and dress up costumes ?

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Your confusing me with Rushy!!!!:D

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

Can you direct me to the legislation please.

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OK Chaps and Chappess's.
You asked and I will give you a pointer.BUT remember that I just the messenger and have a nasty itch, which looks suspiciously like a bull's eye painted on my back ..
It's in your favourite reading publication. The Police's "Arms Code, 2013 and may be found on page 26 under reloading and here is a piccie, Enjoy but try not to burst an blood vessel..

Puts on tin hat and scurries off to my Anderson Shelter.

Attachment 126774

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Originally Posted by Maca49

Great for Black Powder.... BOOM!!

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Why's that Maca? .

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Originally Posted by Max Headroom

Why's that Maca? .

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It’s very volatile, don’t lock it up,

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Originally Posted by Maca49

It’s very volatile, don’t lock it up,

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Ooooooooooh. I understand the :Boom" ability but wonder about the rest.<section class="css-pnw38j e1hk9ate0" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(74, 74, 74); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px;">adjective

evaporating rapidly; passing off readily in the form of vapor:tending or threatening to break out into open violence; explosive:
changeable; mercurial; flighty:
noun



</section><section class="css-pnw38j e1hk9ate0" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(74, 74, 74); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px;">a volatile substance, as a gas or solvent.

</section>
Please extrapolate a little further

There's absolutely no hassle storing black powder in that case shown by Max.

What is important is to store it in a woven cotton bag preferably or in its original container, whatever that may be, as long as it doesnt have a screw cap of any sorts and isn't made of wood or static producing plastic.
Keep it dry as its incredibly hygroscopic and will drain humidity out of the air better than your fancy Harvey Norman dehumidifier.
Make sure that if you keep it in the shed that you don't use anything that creates heat,flame or sparks within 5m.
Don't handle it whilst wearing any fancy Kathmandu spandex or nylon clothing, it will bite you!
Fans create static electricity in the air, keep them away from BP storage areas. (or propellants for that matter)
If you're storing it for longer than 2 years you're not shooting enough, go and shoot the shit :)

Had it noted by my insurance company that reloading powder and ammunition of up to a quantity I'll never have could be stored in the house(Shed adjoined) or in the shed ( not adjoined). No point giving them an easy "out" if something was to happen. They have asked from time to time when renewing or changing policy's if this is still applicable. They were a bit prickly about it but did write it in. Mostly as they were unsure about such things was the feeling I got.

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Originally Posted by terryf

....................If you're storing it for longer than 2 years you're not shooting enough, go and shoot the shit :)

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Very true, very.....

No one has come back to the question of which legislation this is?

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Originally Posted by Sideshow

No one has come back to the question of which legislation this is?

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It is in the arms code but unsure if it was in legislation.

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Originally Posted by Sideshow

No one has come back to the question of which legislation this is?

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@Sideshow Oh yes I did..............see post # 20. I expected some flack challenging the Arms Code as not being Legislation and I have my view on that, but I'm not going to start a dog fight debate about that here,

Mainly 'cos Constable Plod who thinks he creates the law and knows all has said it is illegal BUT does not produce any justification for saying so.........apart from "I said so."

I'm just looking for a resolution to avoid problems with either Plod or Boom.

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Originally Posted by Kiwi Sapper

@Sideshow Oh yes I did..............see post # 20. I expected some flack challenging the Arms Code as not being Legislation and I have my view on that, but I'm not going to start a dog fight debate about that here.

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It states it is illegal but doesnt cite the law....police are known lairs so I would like to see the actual piece of legislation.

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

It states it is illegal but doesnt cite the law....police are known lairs so I would like to see the actual piece of legislation.

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This I have already acknowledged and also said I'm not up for a dogfight on how "Legal" is the "Code."

So, if you want it, I leave you to get it and wish you well and good luck under the current tyranny,

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Originally Posted by Sideshow

No one has come back to the question of which legislation this is?

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It's in the HSNO regulations.
I did track down the actual legislation a while back, it was quite hard to find as there are lots of different bits of legislation. Under 15kg you are okay with a FAL and storing separate to a dwelling, over 15kg a pile of extra storage and licensing requirements kick in.

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Originally Posted by Kiwi Sapper

This I have already acknowledged and also said I'm not up for a dogfight on how "Legal" is the "Code."

So, if you want it, I leave you to get it and wish you well and good luck under the current tyranny,

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Not looking for a fight, just thought some one may link or copy paste it here.
Lots of clever people here who seem to be able to do that stuff... I'm not one of them.

Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

Not looking for a fight, just thought some one may link or copy paste it here.
Lots of clever people here who seem to be able to do that stuff... I'm not one of them.

Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk

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Here is what you are looking for I believe. The only place I can see that states that smokeless powder (Class 1.1D) can not be stored in a dwelling is in section 23-3 but that relates to a Class 1 substance held under lock and key.
When you look further down to Table 7 it states that less then 15 kgs of Class 1.1D does not need to be under lock and key.
Hopefully someone else can point us in the direction of where it says we aren't allowed to store less than 15kgs of smokeless powder in our dwellings.

One other thing I found interesting is that in clause 13A it says no one is allowed to display Class 1 substances for sale other than Fireworks. Guncity may need to take note!

Hazardous Substances (Classes 1 to 5 Controls) Amendment Regulations 2003 (SR 2003/177) (as at 01 December 2017) – New Zealand Legislation

Table 7 says under 15kg does need to be under lock and key

Bother........................I seem to have opened one of these.

Attachment 126903

I am not worried about a few kg’s of gun powder stored in my home or garage.
My wife’s car is parked in the internal access garage with 80 litres of petrol sitting in the tank not to mention the 5 tires and a truck load of plastic and fibreglass parts / panels.
In a fire, it’s going to go up like a Roman candle compared to a few kg’s of gun powder stored in a cupboard.

My understanding is you are allowed less than 15kg it powder stored in your home.


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Energy Potential taken from Google.

Gasoline - 47.2 Mj/Kg
Black powder - 3 Mj/KG
Smokeless powder - 4.6 Mj/Kg

Petrol has 10 times the energy of gun powder, weight for weight.





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Originally Posted by Simon

Energy Potential taken from Google.

Gasoline - 47.2 Mj/Kg
Black powder - 3 Mj/KG
Smokeless powder - 4.6 Mj/Kg

Petrol has 10 times the energy of gun powder, weight for weight.





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This is completely irrelevant - chocolate chip cookies have 8 times more energy than TNT and 15 times more than BP.

Try replacing the petrol in your engine with black powder and igniting it. It wont go well I promise.

What is important, which these internet tables don't tell us, is how quickly a substance can release its energy, ie, convert its energy to heat.

Following @Cigar 's suggestion, I have installed my 3 powders, still in their original containers as sold to me, in a non working refrigerated chilly bin under the bench in my free standing garage. I also included a max / min thermometer and have noted over the last few totally sunny, warm, days the min is 17c and the max 23c. Seems to be a temperature solution but awaiting @Maca49 's development of "volatile."