Thread: Oh no. Why?

This bloke explains the paper clip check.

https://youtu.be/H1zXtY_eY3E?si=5rj9IzoueDEbuOx5

Originally Posted by inglishill

So in order to truly utilise this method you would simply need to put your good cases in the groundwater and leave the marginal ones on the ground right? Does having residual Druidic ancestry help? I have a mate that reckons his family tree has some druids from way back.

It does, other helpful factors are reciting the moor creed backwards under a waxing moon and reloading only when your chosen stars align in the shape of a ragged hole with a single star just slightly higher and to right of the others.

Originally Posted by DBD

Ok thanks, I'll give that a crack. I did a fl resize with a tiny shoulder bump as some brass was not cycling properly

Rem mag like all belted cases head spaces off the belt not the shoulder. If it's tight to chamber use sharpie or engineering blue to find the sticking point, as dollars to donuts the other rifle has a slightly different chamber size. As everyone else has said, case head separation. Overworking and repeatedly FL sizing is a good way to cause this. Sometimes "once fired brass" or range produce turns out to be less of a bargain than we would like.

Cross section another piece of brass and see how it looks. The paper clip test is only good if you can feel it and for various reasons that feeling isn't the same thing everyone

Oh dear I seem to have upset some folks....druids indeed. Pray tell me you unbelievers.....how would YOU determine if a case was going to let go???? The paperclip method has been around for a very long time and in very short order will tell you if there is something funky going on so you can discard case before it causes issues. To each Thier own.

Greetings,
One thing not mentioned is the possible need to size the area just in front of the belt independently from the rest of the case. There is a special tool for this called a bulge buster but you can use a stripped 300 win mag die and this may need to be done first. Next the case needs to be sized just enough to chamber freely. There are special shell holders and head space measuring kit for this as well. Avoiding excessive sizing or setting the case shoulder back to far is the fix. The paper clip, although important, won't extend your case life if you continue to over size your cases. Someone local should be able to help you with this.
GPM.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Oh dear I seem to have upset some folks....druids indeed. Pray tell me you unbelievers.....how would YOU determine if a case was going to let go???? The paperclip method has been around for a very long time and in very short order will tell you if there is something funky going on so you can discard case before it causes issues. To each Thier own.

You haven't upset anyone, it was just a bit of fun.

I've experienced what the OP describes, but 300 Win Mag once fired Hornady brass. Factory ammo that genuinely was once fired. The ammo must have been fired in a tight chamber as I didn't need to size it to fit my chamber, but I did so without shoulder bumping to size the necks for holding the projectiles. I loaded up ladder charges of 10, shot them and two or three separated while others got the horizontal split above the web. They really needed fire forming first but I couldn't be bothered so gave them away to someonewho wanted to use 'em. As obtained they were simply too small for my chamber.

Originally Posted by inglishill

You haven't upset anyone, it was just a bit of fun.

I use that paperclip method if I want to check for imminent separation. Works fine. I also visually check cases to see if any show telltale horizontal rings above the web.

The joys of buying second hand-used-fired brass, false economy

Some Rem/Win mag chambers are big in the diameter just above the belt, like really big & you will get another belt forming when you size it or try to

Sometimes you can't even size it back enough to fit into another different brand of rifle

Combine that with a long shoulder/short brass & here comes head separation pretty quickly

If the first firing stretches the brass enough you are in trouble no matter how little you bump the shoulder in subsequent firings

Rem/Win mag "match" reamers are small in the diameter above the belt & it makes a difference

I was told to treat the belted magnum the same as any cartridge and only bump the should back .002 thou.
Case separation is usually from over sizing of the brass.
I've seen it happen after 2 firings.

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Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Oh dear I seem to have upset some folks....druids indeed. Pray tell me you unbelievers.....how would YOU determine if a case was going to let go???? The paperclip method has been around for a very long time and in very short order will tell you if there is something funky going on so you can discard case before it causes issues. To each Thier own.

By muzzle flash and shooters luck
I’d neer post gainsay @Micky Duck
Mine words though bent with tongue in cheek
Do ought but back the sense he speak
The druids joke a jesters play
Tis just fine to check your brass this way
You could even see this timeless creed
In years gone by if you did read
The Ancient scrolls of NZ Guns
Where wisdom flowed in smokeless runs
Upon that parchment they proclaim
The paper clip doth earn its name
No chant or creed that earns more trust
When checking brass thats near to bust
Than the bent sharp wire Druids trick
To check brass that grew too thin too quick.
If bant and barb did turn and stick
Forgive me Micky for being a twit.

Usually before case separation you can see the line just above the belt from the outside, it looks like a hair line crack forming as shown in 30 06Kings post. I have had a few different calibres seperate but mostly the 303 as the rear locking action allows more stretch in the case.
Neck sizing helps slow this from occurring. Always before loading have a good visual of your cases and any showing the stress line check with paper clip and throw away the real bad ones.

Some solid info there to confirm the so called once fired is not always what you get. Inspected all the Nosler brass and 90% is fu?kd.
These got fired today and it is very obvious now that there is a fracture above the band.

Originally Posted by DBD

Some solid info there to confirm the so called once fired is not always what you get. Inspected all the Nosler brass and 90% is fu?kd.
These got fired today and it is very obvious now that there is a fracture above the band.
Attachment 276172

Holy moly