Thread: seating die is pulling out bullets

I pulled out the depriming pin and getting much more tension.
Probably too much now.
I noticed it left some marks around the neck which you may see in the photo.
Anyway, I seated the bullet back and its definitely in nice and tight.
However it buckled the brass near the base of the neck where the base of the projectile would rest.
I believe this is due to too much neck tension.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

I do it to ALL my does to make them slip in and out smoother. My lee dies actually smoother than rcbs or Hornady sets I have... Guess like anything some products leave factory floor at 16:55 Friday afternoon lol.

This set appears bear new, perhaps it wears in with use?
Some people rubbish Lee stuff, so thats why I was asking.

Originally Posted by Longranger

I am not seeing much in the way of measurement here. If the projectile is 0.311" then the ID of the neck should be at least 0.002" less than the bullet diameter. "Neck tension" is a misnomer as it can vary considerably with the hardness of the brass....the best we can do as reloaders is describe the "interference fit" by measurement. In this case I have described an interference fit of 0.002"....you could increase that more if the brass is soft ie just annealed.

Regarding full length sizing versus neck sizing.....invariably brass failure is primer pocket expansion or necks splitting. I have never seen a case failing because of full length sizing and would recommend that every time to ensure headspace is correct for every round loaded, but you will need to be able to measure that with the correct tools to get it right. Your brass will grow over time and full length sizing will be unavoidable so best to start now make every load the same....

I can check measurements later. You're right hownit can vary, as some brass cases are heavier than others. Looks like ive made some improvement anyhow.
I believe with 303 that base separation occurs with too much full length sizing. Its not the neck that gives much trouble.

Originally Posted by Longranger

Now the question remains, how do i improve neck tension? Do i need to look for a better die set, or simply screw the die down further?

Lee collett die will do the job.....if the ID is too great you can reduce the mandrel size to produce what diameter you need. Are you measuring the neck ID....?[/QUOTE]

Ive been on the lookout for one. Reloaders had none available when I was in their store.
I believe RCBS has a similar type of die?

Originally Posted by Crusty

Get a Lee collet die. This is an absolute must for the .303 cartridge.

Full length sizing should be avoided on this cartridge, as you can get case head separation in as little as 3 firings. With a collet die, you can get 10+ reloads out of a case.

I agree, I haven't needed one yet, because its my first reload and I had to FL size the brass I had that had been once fired in a different gun.
Will be neck sizing everything going forward. Bit if a pain keeping different loads for each gun, but its the only real way to maximize life.
That being said, others seem to be getting a good 6 reloads or more with FL sizing, depending on the brass.
Will do some tests with HXP and DIZ brass.

Why haven't you deburred case mouth???? No the expander won't wear in..it's steel,expanding brass,brass is softer than steel.as said above,spin in drill with fine abrasive paper to remove sharp angles and if feel so inclined polish the knob while you have it there. When seating,start pill in case mouth and about half way through stroke lift arm a tad and rotate case 180 ish degrees before completing stroke. It helps keep things straight.LEE is good...

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Why haven't you deburred case mouth???? No the expander won't wear in..it's steel,expanding brass,brass is softer than steel.as said above,spin in drill with fine abrasive paper to remove sharp angles and if feel so inclined polish the knob while you have it there. When seating,start pill in case mouth and about half way through stroke lift arm a tad and rotate case 180 ish degrees before completing stroke. It helps keep things straight.LEE is good...

I'd imagine 600 wet & dry followed up with about 1000grit. Perhaps a few drops of light oil too. ATF would perhaps do the job.
Measure often with a good micrometer.

I agree, I haven't needed one yet, because its my first reload and I had to FL size the brass I had that had been once fired in a different gun.
Will be neck sizing everything going forward. Bit if a pain keeping different loads for each gun, but its the only real way to maximize life.
That being said, others seem to be getting a good 6 reloads or more with FL sizing, depending on the brass.
Will do some tests with HXP and DIZ brass.[/QUOTE]

The base will only separate if the case stretches at that point. If you are headspacing the brass in FLS die to the correct dimensions it cannot stretch. You need to get a headspace comparator and measure your fired brass and keep each chamber measurement to match the case to the correct headspace/chamber. Obviously all chambers will be different and you will not be doing yourself any favours by using the shortest cases in the longest chambers....fastest way to have case head separation.

@Old_School

I bit of reading / info attached for you.

The neck is crooked as well. Something's not right here.

That mark on the case neck is a crimp as well.

Originally Posted by Rated M for Magnum

The neck is crooked as well. Something's not right here.

That mark on the case neck is a crimp as well.

Yeah,that's what I said above...why hasn't he deburred case mouth???? Either he not listening,is taking the piss..or just doesn't want to take advice.

Wish I had a lath, for me shaping the seating stem is done with a drill press using a projectile & valve cutting compound, coarse, med, fine waste a handfull of projectiles, projectile in the chuck & seating stem locked in a mill vice, means you can seer paste on easily & a dash of krill. Just done by feel when projectile looks worn use another one. With a lath would be so much more precise.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Yeah,that's what I said above...why hasn't he deburred case mouth???? Either he not listening,is taking the piss..or just doesn't want to take advice.

Micky Duck, Read the previous posts - he has exactly followed my suggestion of resizing the case MINUS the recapping pin. So, of course the neck will be distorted, as the neck is too tight.

Why bother trimming when the test was to make sure the die was reducing the neck diameter correctly?

Something is out of alignment. It doesn't matter how much you polish the seating stem if the cartridge isn't travelling in a straight line relative to the die.

All the symptoms are pointing to this.

The pic of the press ram and shell holder doesn't look right to my eye. Is there anything stopping the shell holder engaging properly? The case neck should still be in alignment at least to the naked eye without an expander installed.

Originally Posted by Rated M for Magnum

Something is out of alignment. It doesn't matter how much you polish the seating stem if the cartridge isn't travelling in a straight line relative to the die.

All the symptoms are pointing to this.

The pic of the press ram and shell holder doesn't look right to my eye. Is there anything stopping the shell holder engaging properly? The case neck should still be in alignment at least to the naked eye without an expander installed.

I couldn't see anything out of the ordinary, seems to engage the shell holder ok, but I think its a little sloppy and could be a more snug fit possibly, but appears to be centered ok.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Yeah,that's what I said above...why hasn't he deburred case mouth???? Either he not listening,is taking the piss..or just doesn't want to take advice.

Why are you assuming I have not deburred the case?

Originally Posted by Rated M for Magnum

The neck is crooked as well. Something's not right here.

That mark on the case neck is a crimp as well.

Yes its crooked, that's the buckling I was referring to earlier.
This only happened after seating the bullet. To me the neck looks a bit too tight after resizing without the depriming pin.
I can take another photo tomorrow to show you what it looks like after going through the die without the pin.
The crimp marks were there from the factory load, I have not run this through a crimping die.

Because we can still see original factory crimp and the outside edge still looks sharp...by time you have trimmed and deburred,we should be able to see it.

Also is this the light playing tricks or is that a gap on one side of your die in the press?

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Because we can still see original factory crimp and the outside edge still looks sharp...by time you have trimmed and deburred,we should be able to see it.

I have not had to trim these cases yet.
I have been gently running one of those tapered deburring /chamfering tools on the inside.
I do question if ive been giving it enough perhaps, but after reading the guide oldbloke shared it seems you dont want to remove much material on the inside and make the edge knife sharp or anything. This was something on my mind as well.
I can take a few photos to show how ive been doing it.

Originally Posted by Rated M for Magnum

Also is this the light playing tricks or is that a gap on one side of your die in the press?

Attachment 286436

I will take a look in the morning.
As its threaded, I dont see how it would have gone off centre or worn out in anyway. I think it may just be part of the casting perhaps.