Thread: Charging overseas hunters

Has your duck license fees stopped you from shooting ducks, has your fishing license fees stopped you from fishing, I don't think that a hunting fee of let's say for shits and giggles $100 per year is going to stop people from hunting. How much are the fees to be a member of the DA. As mentioned earlier, if the revenue can be used to benefit our sport, I'm all for it.

Originally Posted by Titanium

Has your duck license fees stopped you from shooting ducks, has your fishing license fees stopped you from fishing, I don't think that a hunting fee of let's say for shits and giggles $100 per year is going to stop people from hunting. How much are the fees to be a member of the DA. As mentioned earlier, if the revenue can be used to benefit our sport, I'm all for it.

There's an irony in that a slab of shotgun ammo will cost you 300-350 dollars, but guys still complain at a 100 dollar duck shooting licence. I buy a licence every year, and yet I dont have to as I shoot on my own property. Because I believe in contributing.

To see benefit to hunters from applying any sort of charge you'd need to start from the position of policy formulation for the purpose of developing some kind of benefit to hunters (and then applying a charge might arise as a sensible policy solution through that process). However the current legislation means there isn't really going to be anyone working on policy formulation from that perspective. At best you'd see policy intending to better manage numbers (and hence impacts) of wild animals, and benefits to hunters may be a secondary benefit.

The legislation just sucks for hunters.


Until the purpose and some specific parts of several acts is changed to match what is realistic and a different set of values, the legislation will continue to suck for hunters.


National Parks, reserves, conservation and WAC acts specifically

I agree.

But

I actually think the status quo sucks for conservation in relation to hunting/conservation outcomes too.

Its no good seeing an issue ignored because to be proactive might be seen to legitimise or value wild animals on public land, and then get too the stage where intervention is deemed necessary.

I think the value for both hunters and conservation is ultimately in legislative change - hunting sector advocates need to build strong bipartisan relationships in parliament to look for legislative change towards realistic outcomes that recognise the value of wild animals




Or shoot more hinds cos really we've got it pretty damn good right now and if deer numbers keep increasing, only bad changes are likely with the current legislation and attitudes

Gimp you and whanauhuia are onto it --DOC has never recognized the value of recreational hunters in controlling deer numbers - that has not changed except where public pressure has forced DOC to actually listen - and even then it is only in a few specific areas - Wapiti for example - but I detect some winds of change - lets see what happens with a Minister even though to date been bloody silent - so Minister and GAC get of your backsides and do the job we taxpayers paid you to do- we wait with baited breath - so what could they do better
1) herds of interest include Sika White tail Whakatipu Thar for a start -2) really get on top of access including sale of land adjacent to DOC land being required to provide access to DOC land on its boundary's - freeing up the sale of venison for hunter to provide meat - best thru local butchers - DOC get of its arse and start providing better information to hunters by way of its web site

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

Gimp you and whanauhuia are onto it --DOC has never recognized the value of recreational hunters in controlling deer numbers - that has not changed except where public pressure has forced DOC to actually listen - and even then it is only in a few specific areas - Wapiti for example - but I detect some winds of change - lets see what happens with a Minister even though to date been bloody silent - so Minister and GAC get of your backsides and do the job we taxpayers paid you to do- we wait with baited breath - so what could they do better
1) herds of interest include Sika White tail Whakatipu Thar for a start -2) really get on top of access including sale of land adjacent to DOC land being required to provide access to DOC land on its boundary's - freeing up the sale of venison for hunter to provide meat - best thru local butchers - DOC get of its arse and start providing better information to hunters by way of its web site

Out of interest what's better info is required?

Area dependent obviously i see few places rec hunters are currently effective for population management. Access and info are not the current limitation hunter practices are atleast down south. Increasing access is unlikely to increase hunter harvest by anything significant.

complety and utterly disagree Stocky - you must be in one area without problems - we have seen in the Naki multiple access points closed by narrow minded farmers - and there is no concerted or combined iniative to get them back - numbers on the farms around have grown and the only people able to hunt are those with permission of the farmer - this kind of problem exists all over lower North Island - if hunters could get in there - well there would be some control - okay better info- imagine for a minute if DOC really got in behind recreational hunting - one may be able to go to a DOC website and here is articles from DOC Scientists ( they have them ) on deer behaviour deer preferred species of vegetation all kinds of info invaluable to new hunters and even better specific to areas like a how to hunt the Ruahines on line - combine that with a really top notch map system with recent aerial photos and combined with fresh aerial thermal imaging there are your deer hunters - even better tips from DOC hunters who know the areas all online - get out therei and here is how you get in there - no we are not looked at as a legitimate method- easier and cheaper to put a MD 500 and a Contractor up - can we change it - in very small specific areas maybe us hunters are doing good - but we should never give up and lie down simply because it looks like DOC dont take notice - and DOC dont know what a well educated motivated hunting fraternity with good access could achieve think about that -- hunter numbers are growing who is saying we could not make a difference

While we are after their $'s, how about a few for ACC levies, dumbest thing out supplying free accident medical care to visitors.

Theres money out there,I had a guest stay at my place last night.At breakfast time this morning he was talking about safari game park hunting in NZ and what they charge.He reckn some Out Fitters are doing pretty well.One game park got payed 160k for a very big stag(600ds plus).Another client payed over 600k for his tour of NZ hunting on Safari Parks and doc land shooting top Nz trophy's.

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

complety and utterly disagree Stocky - you must be in one area without problems - we have seen in the Naki multiple access points closed by narrow minded farmers - and there is no concerted or combined iniative to get them back - numbers on the farms around have grown and the only people able to hunt are those with permission of the farmer - this kind of problem exists all over lower North Island - if hunters could get in there - well there would be some control - okay better info- imagine for a minute if DOC really got in behind recreational hunting - one may be able to go to a DOC website and here is articles from DOC Scientists ( they have them ) on deer behaviour deer preferred species of vegetation all kinds of info invaluable to new hunters and even better specific to areas like a how to hunt the Ruahines on line - combine that with a really top notch map system with recent aerial photos and combined with fresh aerial thermal imaging there are your deer hunters - even better tips from DOC hunters who know the areas all online - get out therei and here is how you get in there - no we are not looked at as a legitimate method- easier and cheaper to put a MD 500 and a Contractor up - can we change it - in very small specific areas maybe us hunters are doing good - but we should never give up and lie down simply because it looks like DOC dont take notice - and DOC dont know what a well educated motivated hunting fraternity with good access could achieve think about that -- hunter numbers are growing who is saying we could not make a difference

I know nothing of the area your in and don't claim too. I'm asking questions because it seems strange to me based on my experience. Its genuine curiosity.

The Naki might have access issues. But the south island definitely does not. There is good access to most of the main divide from Marlborough to Southland. And most of that country is also crawling in deer. So to me that suggests that access is not the limiting factor at least down here.

In the lower north island I can imagine the smaller tracts of public land make access more of an issue. When you talk about access do you mean to public land or too the overpopulated private land? Could you name a couple access that have closed as almost all accesses (down here) ive seen lost are due to hunters being pricks. Most of the ones where a landowner try's it on seems to fail.

I agree we shouldn't give up and we shouldn't just say we don't do anything just that currently we don't do all that much. I would love to see rec hunters actually start to bring numbers back but as far as I see it the limiting factor is how many females people kill/are willing to kill.

On the info side I don't think someone's going to read any info and become a great/effective hunter overnight when your talking bush stalking that comes by doing (I'm no bush stalker) if your talking open country/clearings etc then there's no mystery in how to do it at all.

well stocky you must live in a blessed land down there

Originally Posted by Stocky

I know nothing of the area your in and don't claim too. I'm asking questions because it seems strange to me based on my experience. Its genuine curiosity.

The Naki might have access issues. But the south island definitely does not. There is good access to most of the main divide from Marlborough to Southland. And most of that country is also crawling in deer. So to me that suggests that access is not the limiting factor at least down here.

In the lower north island I can imagine the smaller tracts of public land make access more of an issue. When you talk about access do you mean to public land or too the overpopulated private land? Could you name a couple access that have closed as almost all accesses (down here) ive seen lost are due to hunters being pricks. Most of the ones where a landowner try's it on seems to fail.

I agree we shouldn't give up and we shouldn't just say we don't do anything just that currently we don't do all that much. I would love to see rec hunters actually start to bring numbers back but as far as I see it the limiting factor is how many females people kill/are willing to kill.

On the info side I don't think someone's going to read any info and become a great/effective hunter overnight when your talking bush stalking that comes by doing (I'm no bush stalker) if your talking open country/clearings etc then there's no mystery in how to do it at all.

Only if people posted these places so other hunters could go there and start reducing numbers

I can think of plenty of examples in Sth Is where access to (easy) public land is blocked or severely restricted by private land ownership and this has got significantly worse past 5-6 years with all the carbon forestry set ups. And no I won’t name them.

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

well stocky you must live in a blessed land down there

Talking to my mate in the deerless north, we do live in a blessed part of NZ down here on the Mainland, dozens and dozens of massive doc hunt blocks, most of which have pretty straightforward access, especially if you've got a 4x4 to cut down the leg work getting in but even if you don't most are within less than an hours walk from the roadside, this was a key driver for me relocating from Northland....that and waaaaaaaaaaay less people