Thread: National creates a Hunting and Fishing portfolio

Originally Posted by Cyclops

Of course they'll create a populist shadow portfolio.

They'll leap at anything that might gain them votes.

The real question is "what will they deliver?"

Remember the Blue team backed the Red team's first firearms law reforms.

They only changed their minds when they saw what way the wind was blowing later.

A plague on all parliamentary parties.

Ask National if they are going to revoke the Mil ban and give us our guns back. Dont be silly. National still has the mad Judith Collins whose counterpart in Labour is the dull as dishwater Nanaia Mahuta. The problem is the graft that Mahuta chiseled out of contracts for her hubbie will be taken up by some National grifter.

Originally Posted by TeRei

The problem is the graft that Mahuta chiseled out of contracts for her hubbie will be taken up by some National grifter.

yup the more things change the more they stay the same..........
we are in for a tough few years no matter who will be rattling the chains at the end of the year

Originally Posted by TeRei

Ask National if they are going to revoke the Mil ban and give us our guns back. Dont be silly. National still has the mad Judith Collins whose counterpart in Labour is the dull as dishwater Nanaia Mahuta. The problem is the graft that Mahuta chiseled out of contracts for her hubbie will be taken up by some National grifter.

They will never bring back MSSA. I think that has to be accepted. And frankly I’m comfortable with that.
On the fence with a small magazine capacity sporting semi.

I think the more pertinent topic or question is:
What do we/you want from any govt in terms of hunting or fishing?
Deer populations are growing rapidly, Fallow have spread massively in the last 10 - 15 years.
We don’t have a lack of opportunities to hunt.
It’s essentially free.

I’ve never supported the gun registration, but only because I don’t trust the data security. Not because I give 2 rips if they know I have 3 guns or 30.
But reading the story in last weekends Herald, i understand why now. I think they called them strawmen. Or straw licenses.
Basic premise of the issue is there are license holders who buy firearms and immediately on sell them to gang members or the unlicensed for profit.
There are blokes making a living doing this.
How else do you stop it?

I personally would like to see access to public lands tidied up.
Farmers will hate it, but access to crown land locked beyond private property must be guaranteed for all.
Crown land locked away by private interest, and then benefited by proxy by the private land holder should have a cost for that privilege.
A simple way of working it, allow access, or pay for exclusive use.

Originally Posted by Lauries Hut

They will never bring back MSSA. I think that has to be accepted. And frankly I’m comfortable with that.
On the fence with a small magazine capacity sporting semi.

I think the more pertinent topic or question is:
What do we/you want from any govt in terms of hunting or fishing?
Deer populations are growing rapidly, Fallow have spread massively in the last 10 - 15 years.
We don’t have a lack of opportunities to hunt.
It’s essentially free.

I’ve never supported the gun registration, but only because I don’t trust the data security. Not because I give 2 rips if they know I have 3 guns or 30.
But reading the story in last weekends Herald, i understand why now. I think they called them strawmen. Or straw licenses.
Basic premise of the issue is there are license holders who buy firearms and immediately on sell them to gang members or the unlicensed for profit.
There are blokes making a living doing this.
How else do you stop it?

I personally would like to see access to public lands tidied up.
Farmers will hate it, but access to crown land locked beyond private property must be guaranteed for all.
Crown land locked away by private interest, and then benefited by proxy by the private land holder should have a cost for that privilege.
A simple way of working it, allow access, or pay for exclusive use.

Police figures and statements don't support the idea that criminals are obtaining firearms from license holders selling them in large numbers.


You still don't get it. Just because you don't want a semi auto is no reason to not support their legal use. Your firearm of choice will be on the chopping block soon enough.

A more pertinent topic isn't access to public land, it's the new costs, and regulations for ranges and events.

Originally Posted by Danger Mouse

Police figures and statements don't support the idea that criminals are obtaining firearms from license holders selling them in large numbers.


You still don't get it. Just because you don't want a semi auto is no reason to not support their legal use. Your firearm of choice will be on the chopping block soon enough.

A more pertinent topic isn't access to public land, it's the new costs, and regulations for ranges and events.

Hell where do I start?

“Police figures and statements don’t support” I find that fairly had to believe. If you want to make such claims, stump up your evidence for all to see.

“You still don’t get it” quite an assumption from a short post. I lost a semi. I’d still like to use one.
The problem is not their legal use.
The problem is F-wits like Tarrant and god knows how many loopy Americans, who have exclusively used such weapons, to shoot up large numbers of innocents.
We fortunately live in a democracy, and we as a community of firearm users, need to present well, and fit in the the voting public. If we’re lucky Act will have their hands on the strings of power by the end of the year. They will possibly have the power to minimise further damage. Perhaps undo some of the more onerous rule changes. But life is a compromise from start to finish. This is a compromise we will have to accept. I didn’t say I liked it, I simply accept it.

“A more pertinent topic” What I said was; “What do we/you want from any govt” so yes that means you Danger Mouse. Rather than dismiss others, why don’t you just add your point. It’s a valid one.

Originally Posted by Lauries Hut

Hell where do I start?

“Police figures and statements don’t support” I find that fairly had to believe. If you want to make such claims, stump up your evidence for all to see.

“You still don’t get it” quite an assumption from a short post. I lost a semi. I’d still like to use one.
The problem is not their legal use.
The problem is F-wits like Tarrant and god knows how many loopy Americans, who have exclusively used such weapons, to shoot up large numbers of innocents.
We fortunately live in a democracy, and we as a community of firearm users, need to present well, and fit in the the voting public. If we’re lucky Act will have their hands on the strings of power by the end of the year. They will possibly have the power to minimise further damage. Perhaps undo some of the more onerous rule changes. But life is a compromise from start to finish. This is a compromise we will have to accept. I didn’t say I liked it, I simply accept it.

“A more pertinent topic” What I said was; “What do we/you want from any govt” so yes that means you Danger Mouse. Rather than dismiss others, why don’t you just add your point. It’s a valid one.

You mean like nz polices own media statements? Or the OIA requests?

And in the US the majority of furearrelated deaths is with handguns. Besides which, what happens in the US has little bearing on NZ. Jackie used the pokices negligence in giving Tarrant a license, as a platform to promote her self image if Saint cindy. She didn't achieve anything other than being seen to be doing something. A recurring theme which is why the wheels finally fell off.

You still missing the point, you want to throw other disciplines of hunting and shooting under the bus? It comes back on you. NZDA got a rude lesson on that.

The main problem is sentences for selling to unlicenced people are too light. Home or community detention and PD for fucks sake. Make it hurt. Starting point of five years. No discounts for what ever bullshit the defence lawyer dreams up. No early parole. No easy jail's either.

Originally Posted by Steve123

The main problem is sentences for selling to unlicenced people are too light. Home or community detention and PD for fucks sake. Make it hurt. Starting point of five years. No discounts for what ever bullshit the defence lawyer dreams up. No early parole. No easy jail's either.

Pointless if the courts don't apply the penalties

Originally Posted by Steve123

The main problem is sentences for selling to unlicenced people are too light. Home or community detention and PD for fucks sake. Make it hurt. Starting point of five years. No discounts for what ever bullshit the defence lawyer dreams up. No early parole. No easy jail's either.

I think your still a bit light Steve sorry.

I think 8 years minimum sentence. Lifetime prohibited person status (means you can't even touch a firearm) This gets around them using one under supervision from a FAL holder.

Not allowed to live in a building where firearms are stored. (ie no access to firearms).

Must register their home address with the Police and actually live there. (I.e their home address is not the local gang pad)

Not allowed to associate with gang members.

Generally, I think that we need to make the penalty outweigh the rewards from this dangerous illegal activity. There will still be some who will do it. (and squeal when they go to jail)

So be it. Do the crime, do the time. Stop fucking up our sport with your selfishness!

Originally Posted by Danger Mouse

You mean like nz polices own media statements? Or the OIA requests?

And in the US the majority of furearrelated deaths is with handguns. Besides which, what happens in the US has little bearing on NZ. Jackie used the pokices negligence in giving Tarrant a license, as a platform to promote her self image if Saint cindy. She didn't achieve anything other than being seen to be doing something. A recurring theme which is why the wheels finally fell off.

You still missing the point, you want to throw other disciplines of hunting and shooting under the bus? It comes back on you. NZDA got a rude lesson on that.

Yes if you have statements from the police, put them up. Likewise OIA requests with info supporting your claims, put them up.

And as for missing the point. I’ll try and be a little clearer.
I’m not throwing any discipline under the bus. The bus has already run over your beloved military style semi auto.
I’m simply stating what I see as the obvious.
They’re gone. There’s as much chance of Act or National rescinding the MSSA law there is of slavery returning.
The general public find them abhorrent, the Nats and Act will pick their battles, and MSSA will not be one of them.

As I said in the beginning, we as a hunting-shooting community need to decide what’s important to us, what’s realistically achievable.
As you said: onerous and unworkable rules around ranges are a perfect example.
Now Todd and his role is in play we must begin the process of putting rational and reasoned arguments on the table.

Originally Posted by Lauries Hut

Yes if you have statements from the police, put them up. Likewise OIA requests with info supporting your claims, put them up.

And as for missing the point. I’ll try and be a little clearer.
I’m not throwing any discipline under the bus. The bus has already run over your beloved military style semi auto.
I’m simply stating what I see as the obvious.
They’re gone. There’s as much chance of Act or National rescinding the MSSA law there is of slavery returning.
The general public find them abhorrent, the Nats and Act will pick their battles, and MSSA will not be one of them.

As I said in the beginning, we as a hunting-shooting community need to decide what’s important to us, what’s realistically achievable.
As you said: onerous and unworkable rules around ranges are a perfect example.
Now Todd and his role is in play we must begin the process of putting rational and reasoned arguments on the table.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.scoop...al-weapons.htm

That wasn't so hard to find now was it?

Originally Posted by Lauries Hut

“Police figures and statements don’t support” I find that fairly had to believe. If you want to make such claims, stump up your evidence for all to see.

All we have seen from Police so far is reference to couple of examples of people onselling firearms illegally and historic firearm burglary rates. But in the great scheme of thing they have not produced any specific statistics on recovered firearms vs sources. And if you ask them they say they don't have those numbers.

So police figures and statements don't support any specific source of firearms for criminals. At the moment you can tell them that the tooth fairy (I mean the real one... not the ex-pm) pulls them out of her arse and leaves them under a Mongrel Mobs patch when he loses a tooth and the police would struggle to contest that.

It is highly likely that the registry will actually prove or disprove the theories on the source of firearms. It's even more likely that it will disprove it's own value if it is revealed that recovered firearms used by criminals have had their serials or identifying marks removed (wouldn't that be a surprise!).

Originally Posted by Danger Mouse

Police figures and statements don't support the idea that criminals are obtaining firearms from license holders selling them in large numbers.


You still don't get it. Just because you don't want a semi auto is no reason to not support their legal use. Your firearm of choice will be on the chopping block soon enough.

A more pertinent topic isn't access to public land, it's the new costs, and regulations for ranges and events.

Hell where do I start?

“Police figures and statements don’t support”
I find that fairly had to believe. If you want to make such claims, stump up your evidence for all to see.

“You still don’t get it”
Quite an assumption from a short post. I lost a semi. I’d still like to use one.
The problem is not their legal use.
The problem is F-wits like Tarrant and god knows how many loopy Americans, who have exclusively used such weapons, to shoot up large numbers of innocents.
We fortunately live in a democracy, and we as a community of firearm users, need to present well, and fit in the the voting public. If we’re lucky Act will have their hands on the strings of power by the end of the year. They will possibly have the power to minimise further damage. Perhaps undo some of the more onerous rule changes. But life is a compromise from start to finish. This is a compromise we will have to accept. I didn’t say I liked it, I simply accept it.

“A more pertinent topic”
What I said was; “What do we/you want from any govt” so yes that means you Danger Mouse. Rather than dismiss others, why don’t you just add your point. It’s a valid one.