Thread: High end scope comparison

NO one is unbaised , me I tend to FFP , mrad scopes in the 3-27x range , and donot place a weight constraint on them as for hunting etc , as such I like S&B PMIIs at the moment , BUT I am not shuttered , as I donot like all PMIIs , and alot of the new ones are getting bad press for being un- reliable , in the main , I thnk they are the MTC & LT versions , but S&B need to sort it out before people stop buying them due to being a crap product , otherwise they will destory their highly reguarded name .
The MTC is more tactile clicks , and is a hard click every ten clicks ie on every full 1.0 mils , sounds good in theory , BUT in practice this heavy click masks the click either side , ie 0.9 & 1.1 etc , the other is LT , locking turrets , sounds again good in theory , but in practice , and this again is not that well sorted in the S&B PMII rendition of IT .

Greg tends to favour SFP , moa scopes and as such likes NF scopes .

RE the S&B PMII 5-25x56mm having little adjustment range , maybe NOT so bad , they make both mrad & moa knobs for this power scope , the moa version has less range than the mrad version , maybe greg was looking at the moa version ?

S&B PMII specs in moa total travel .

MOA version 65moa +/- 16moa
MRAD version 93moa +/- 21.5moa

In short the PMII moa version has less adjustment range in comparsion to the MRAD one .

Some thing people maybe un aware of is that patented features not owned by the company making the product can seriously JACK up the price , so me I would avoid paying for a option like MTC from S&B , MTC is licensed from USO .

Rumour has it Zeiss is paying a lot for using MTC on their new Cassidian Tactical 3.5-26x56mm scope , ME , I would like it without that feature , as it would to me , be a much better real scope & at cheaper price point , win/win as far as I am concerned .

Cheers Chris

Originally Posted by ChrisF

NO one is unbaised , me I tend to FFP , mrad scopes in the 3-27x range , and donot place a weight constraint on them as for hunting etc , as such I like S&B PMIIs at the moment , BUT I am not shuttered , as I donot like all PMIIs , and alot of the new ones are getting bad press for being un- reliable , in the main , I thnk they are the MTC & LT versions , but S&B need to sort it out before people stop buying them due to being a crap product , otherwise they will destory their highly reguarded name .
The MTC is more tactile clicks , and is a hard click every ten clicks ie on every full 1.0 mils , sounds good in theory , BUT in practice this heavy click masks the click either side , ie 0.9 & 1.1 etc , the other is LT , locking turrets , sounds again good in theory , but in practice , and this again is not that well sorted in the S&B PMII rendition of IT .

Greg tends to favour SFP , moa scopes and as such likes NF scopes .

RE the S&B PMII 5-25x56mm having little adjustment range , maybe NOT so bad , they make both mrad & moa knobs for this power scope , the moa version has less range than the mrad version , maybe greg was looking at the moa version ?

S&B PMII specs in moa total travel .

MOA version 65moa +/- 16moa
MRAD version 93moa +/- 21.5moa

In short the PMII moa version has less adjustment range in comparsion to the MRAD one .

Some thing people maybe un aware of is that patented features not owned by the company making the product can seriously JACK up the price , so me I would avoid paying for a option like MTC from S&B , MTC is licensed from USO .

Rumour has it Zeiss is paying a lot for using MTC on their new Cassidian Tactical 3.5-26x56mm scope , ME , I would like it without that feature , as it would to me , be a much better real scope & at cheaper price point , win/win as far as I am concerned .

Cheers Chris

Hi Chris.
Yep I'm a dinosaur moa man & will never deny it

My requirements are generally SFP, but the FFP MOA-ER reticle in the Premier is quite nice, pretty fine on 5 power though with over 120 moa on it.

The MTC is on every 2 moa & I don't like it or the turrets generally compared to the NF, they do get better with use apparently.

Yes the PMII was an older MOA one but 65 moa isn't very helpful for ELR shooting, the glass is very nice with very little in it between the IOR, Premier, Atacr, S&B, USO.

If you are going to spend the $$$ to get a scope like these you are generally going to do a bit of research, but it is hard to find a line up of scopes to compare like that.

Some times price isnt everything but when it starts getting up beyond $1000 difference between products it does become a consideration.

Recently I shimmed the rail on the 375DCM, now I have 2.5 moa down & 130moa up, so I can dial out past 3000 yards

That causes a very unexpected problem, my PLRF10 can't range far enough for me now.....

Range a mid point,drive or walk there range again?

This is a prick of a problem you have Greg

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

Recently I shimmed the rail on the 375DCM, now I have 2.5 moa down & 130moa up, so I can dial out past 3000 yards

That causes a very unexpected problem, my PLRF10 can't range far enough for me now.....

I have a yard rule you can borrow KG if you want to run the kids out to measure it for you

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

Recently I shimmed the rail on the 375DCM, now I have 2.5 moa down & 130moa up, so I can dial out past 3000 yards

That causes a very unexpected problem, my PLRF10 can't range far enough for me now.....

Did brads sell his tarrapin?

Originally Posted by Neckshot

Did brads sell his tarrapin?

Yep he sold his PLRF05, I might have to borrow it from it's new owner

you would need a tripod aswell wouldnt ya .,........shree k isa looooong way to hold a rangey on!!!!

Originally Posted by Neckshot

you would need a tripod aswell wouldnt ya .,........shree k isa looooong way to hold a rangey on!!!!

Generally I can get good consistant readings out to 25-2800 without a tripod depending on target size

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

Generally I can get good consistant readings out to 25-2800 without a tripod depending on target size

a boulder is easy to range i would think seriously though 3000yards long.what sort of velocity are these pills doing at 3k, lets say you muzzle was pointing dead level how far would it drop at three k?

Must be like 100 meters of drop. Man that is far....

Originally Posted by Neckshot

a boulder is easy to range i would think seriously though 3000yards long.what sort of velocity are these pills doing at 3k, lets say you muzzle was pointing dead level how far would it drop at three k?

Less than 130 MOA

hence the shimmmy, man impressive when do we get a shree k vid KG?

Originally Posted by Neckshot

a boulder is easy to range i would think seriously though 3000yards long.what sort of velocity are these pills doing at 3k, lets say you muzzle was pointing dead level how far would it drop at three k?

I tend to use rocks/stones less than a moa for a target where ever I can, the smaller the better, not the 4-10 moa boulders/mountains you see in the usual ERL videos, even by the "big names"

Well done you just hit the side of a Barn.....

At 3k they are approx 1100fps with around 1000-1100 ft-lbs depending on projectile weight.

Originally Posted by Neckshot

hence the shimmmy, man impressive when do we get a shree k vid KG?

I have a 3+k yard vid but it isn't good enough to put up for a couple of reasons, first you can only see 3 strikes because of the target surrounding, I was shooting across a valley, over a ridge, across another valley & into a gully, across the wind....not very helpful, but mainly because I forgot to pan back out with the camera....Bugger.