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I'm looking at upgrading from 270 to a larger magnum calibre and getting my Burris Signature working to its capabilities. Mainly tops hunting and want to be able to shoot to 400 maybe 500. Any input on calibre choice would be appreciated from the more experienced? If I had to choose today I would go with 300 WSM as I have shot my mates one and handled fine on a suppressed tikka t3.
Also, thoughts on suppressor vs brake for the larger calibre? Brake likely the way to go I imagine
Cheers
When I was looking to go to a long range tops gun I was leaning toward 7mm RM, then ended up with 300 WM. A light rifle with
26 in barrel so went muzzle break which works incredibly well on recoil management but f##k it’s loud. overall there wasn’t much difference in the overall numbers between the two calibres that I researched and a good range of factory ammo available. For hand load it’s about availability of primers you can get brass powder and projectiles at a price. There was some suggestion that development on the 300 was done but with 7mm some further potential.
I’m not familiar with the Burris signature but definitely need good glass
Whichever way you go invest in a rear bag as well makes a huge difference to accuracy
I’ve got a wsm and wm, only fired a mates rm. I’d go with the wsm personally and suppressed over braked although I think it’s the ATec you can put a brake on the end of the suppressor. Wsm recoil is more manageable and realistically any of these three will easily do what you want. Not sure if you reload but that would be the last consideration, cost and availability of ammo. If you reload wsm trades a negligible amount of performance compared to wm so cheaper to feed.
I went .308 to 7rm just because I got a great deal on a great rifle it served me well I feed it 2225 215feds and 162 amax and eldx. Either will serve you well recoil will be less with a brake but they suck on the ears plenty of components around for both at the moment
7mm is the ballistic sweet spot. A 280 Winchester, 7rem mag, 7saum, 7 prc would serve you well. Out to 600 yards most of those rifles can get away with a short barrel. I have a 20” 7prc pushing a 175 berger elite hunter at 2830 and it still has 1562 fps at 1000 yards which is just below what it takes ti make an eld -x projectile work(an arguably harder bullet)
I steered away from the 30 cal as they tend to need a lot more powder (extra recoil) to achieve the ballistics as the 7mm magnums due to the fatter pill. Definitely suppress, pain in the arse with hearing protection, and a short barrel lends itself to adding a can, equally, just this last weekend we were on the tops and had a yearling spike come cruising at us into 80 yards, old mate has a brake and was faffing around trying to get ear protection while I just stood up and bowled it for easy meat. Normally a brake is fine however when I had a braked 26” barrel, 25% of the time I wanted to jump shoot through bushy guts or river beds etc and it’s a pain, plus if you go bush bashing with a long ass barrel…
the mighty 7RM
7mm rem mag or 300win mag if shooting factory ammo, otherwise I'd say 300wsm the big issue with hand loads will be primers, large rifle magnum primers are the latest unicorn turds.
My old Sako 300wsm super pig (19" barrel, stug stock) is up for sale by it's current owner and is listed in the buy sell section.
Absolute beast of a rifle and ticks all the boxes.
7rum
But 270 should easily do 600m
7is ballistically supposed to have more scope , they are load with a fair bit of recoil on a light frame , check your eye relief. ;)
I would look into 300prc or 7mm prc.
Only drawback is they are new thus not as abundant.
All good info, I hadn't considered the PRC. Had the guy at Rivers to Ranges the other day tryin to sell me on a 6.5 PRC.
I would be using factory ammo. Preference would be for a suppressor too
Do you hand load ? If you roll your own then the options are much greater/better.
In 7mm you should consider 280ai, 284 and 7SAUM, and the new kid on the block, 7PRC. You can get factory ammo for 280ai and 7PRC, so check out these even if you don’t hand load. Running the right powders you can get very close to 7RM performance with 280ai, 284 & 7SAUM. Ie 3000fps with 162gn pills. The 284 & SAUM will work very well with shorter bbl, eg 20in or shorter if you wanted.
In 30cal, also look at 3006 or better still 3006ai, it’s nipping at the heels of the 300wm in a lighter platform running less powder. Same comparison as 7RM to 280ai. 300wsm is a good option and will tolerate a shorter bbl. Or 300SAUM.
My personal “must haves” in tops rifle are light weight, portability (shortish bbl) and accurate (rifle & shooter). Dragging a big, long bbl heavy rifle thru scrub or extended trips is a pain in arse. Why do it if you don’t have to ?? To get the best out of big magnums you really need 24 or 26in bbl.
Brakes are significantly better in reducing recoil than suppressor & good for portability but as you know farkin loud. Good hearing protection is essential, and 4 legged companions not an option.
Using factory ammo...... Hornady superpreformance load with the 145 eld slippery job in what you have got. The leap to a "magnum" cartridge from what you have already isn't huge,more like a hop than leap. What you have is more than capable of those ranges. Do the maths n look at the ballistic numbers.a slow barreled 7mm rem mag isn't a huge .bit faster..for sure can chuck heavier but last time I checked we short on rhinos in NZ.
Factory 280 will be worse as harder to get and pressure kept low for rem pumps etc.
708 will be good in the 400 to 500 range
280ai for a bit more legs
Mate, id just get a decent scope and load sorted for the 270 if not already and use the rest for ammo. i comfortably push my 270 to 800 yards on deer using 150 Berger's but the ranges you mention you can easily do that even with a 130gr sst, the 150sst not far behind the Berger's BC. i run a hot load though, 150gr going 2900fps but even with a mild load the 270 can do the range you are after.
if you chuck a 3-16x scope onto the 270 its sorted for an all-round for bush and long range.
If you just want a new rifle, my pick in 30 cal is 300wsm or even PRC and 7mm is 7PRC, BTW if you dont reload most factory 7 rem mag ammo doesn't give much over the 270 anyway.
Just read your first post properly haha
270 will do everything you need.
Good accurate ammo, practice and a reliable scope is all you need.
Back in the day a couple of mates I hunt with use to shoot out to 500 with ease with a basic leupold vx2 4 -12 and range find binos. They would know how many inches the pill would drop and just use the hold over method.
Old school aye but they didn't often miss
just saw you using factory ammo only, in that case id go one of the PRC's if you want to step up. not much ammo available for them but at least what you do find is usually set up for long range
But honestly, if you want to move away form the 270 and you don't reload and don't want a 308 that btw can do the ranges you anyway then the most sensible pic for the range you want to shoot id say actually a 6.5 creedmoor.
Or just buy the sst superformance, hornady precision hunter for your 270 and go hunting.
Yea the reason for parting with the 270 is that its an older rifle that isn't quite as accurate as I want. I figure if I am buying a new rifle then it's a good time to change calibre and future proof myself as I get more into longer range shooting
If I was you and only because you are running factory ammo stay with the .270 or Creedmoor or 7-08 the 300 mag and PRC are a massive jump in horse power.Quote:
Originally Posted by jpurdon
I've just sold my 7prc and are sticking with my 6.5 Creedmoor which will handle everything I hunt out to 600M.
Sent from my CPH2145 using Tapatalk
The 280ai is a absolute ripper, sold my Rem mag after getting it. Pushes the 162's just as fast as the 7mmRM did with less powder and recoil. Definitely a calibre to look at if you're looking at a new rifle. If you have alot of 270win brass you can fire form those to 280ai.
I went down this path years ago. Started with a 308 went to 300wsm. Had a WSM for close to 20yrs. Shot deer from 20m to 750m. A great caliber to own, my favorite was 200g eld x. I have now gone back to a 308 as I wanted a change again. I can still shoot to 500m comfortably.
wonder how the factory hotter ammunition would go in longer faster twist barrel..... would sure be interesting to know..Im picking it would be nipping on heels of other cartridges more usually used longish range.
Wait for tikka to release the 7prc.
If I was doing it again I’d get 300wsm and have the throat modified for heavy bergers.
If you're not reloading I'd go one of the PRC cartridges. These are optimized for modern heavy for calibre ELD type projectiles and will have a better selection of factory offerings going forward. Not to say the older cartridges won't do the same job but it's often a case of reloading to get the results you need.
Jeez this could go on forever!
But hey
I'm here now so.......
7mm PRC.
Less recoil than the 30 cal variants, accurate, with good factory ammo available.
The 6.5's will get you where you want now, but if you want to reach out further later with any breeze, the 7mm will help.
All 3 cartridges you've described will be more than adequate along with several others. Pick the cartridge you like the look of, you don't tip ugly strippers.
6.5PRC is more than capable at the distances you mention but with a lot less recoil
With the development of modern slippery bullets and faster twist barrels on factory rifles I can see the writing on the wall for the big magnums in all but specialised use.
There's a general trend of people trading down from raw oomph rather than up and going to faster twist .243's and the likes and sticking decent glass on them.
This ^^
The likes of 300WM/300WSM/7RM can be made to work incredibly well if your handloading / doing a custom rifle, but in factory form using factory ammo, with the larger cals your dealing with considerably more recoil for not a huge amount of gain. Not that im a huge fan of the 6.5PRC but its really not far behind a 7RM @ 500yd, with a lighter bullet and noticeably less recoil.
6.5 PRC Hornady Precision Hunter 143gr ELDX - 2248fps 1604ftlb @ 500yd
7 Rem Mag Hornady Precision Hunter 162gr ELDX - 2220fps 1772ftlb @ 500yd
300 WM Hornady Precision Hunter 200gr ELDX - 2157fps 2066ftlb @ 500yd
300 WSM Hornady Precision Hunter 200gr ELDX - 2106fps 1969ftlb @ 500yd
If I do it again I would stay either 300wsm or 300wm. I'm a suckered for 30 cals. Below is what the 200g ELD x was doing out of my rifle.
Attachment 241739
6.5PRC or 7mmRM
Nobody has mentioned the mighty 7mmWSM, I’m feeling left out :( But yeah, not the best option if you don’t reload. Even if you do it’s a pain to get brass.
I agree with @Jus re. 7mm being ideal ballistically, that’s the conclusion I came to as well making the same change from .270 to magnum. As you don’t reload, I’d make the choice based on availability of high performance ammo so you can find one your new rifle likes and keep getting it.
Bro, by your own admission (over and over and over again) this thread is really not in your wheel house, so maybe park your opinion for a change. Might be nice for one to run for a bit without your input.Quote:
Originally Posted by Micky Duck
Not saying you are not entitled to an opinion, or that it’s wrong. More, maybe read the room a bit and pass on this one. You know, for a change.
Also - 7prc for the win.
I think tahr is on the money. Horsepower was used to overcome poor BC for a long time. You don’t need to do that anymore with current projectiles.
Also also, rimmed cases look terrible.
I’d look at a 7RM or 300WSM, particularly if not reloading. If you are reloading then it opens up a lot more options as mentioned. 300WM is just a lot of gun. 7 PRC will be cracker if they come out in a Tikka from factory. Personally i’d go a suppressor as brakes can be a prick in a lot of hunting situations. I’m biased towards 7mm so I would say go that way as it’s the perfect balance of ballistics, recoil and terminal performance in my opinion. 30cal gets greater terminal performance but you get increased recoil by needing to push bigger pills with more powder in order to get good ballistics. If you want a genuine magnum then stay 7mm or 30cal, not a 6.5. Again, just my opinion (I own a 6.5 cal and do love it for what I use it for - meat gathering).
4 - 500 also isn’t hugely far. I read that you do want a more accurate rifle which makes a lot of sense. A 270 will do what you are wanting and so would a 7mm08 and 308 etc. The magnums will just do it better and with more confidence and authority so long as you are doing your part right though so again you are on the right track. Goodluck
I went with a 7mmRM as a second rifle. At the time my main gun was a 7mm08 and i wanted more hitting power for open country. The rem mag has been excellent but you also need good optics to go with it as well.
My son when he was 11 could shoot with it with a suppressor so not a lot of recoil.
Also have a look at your local where you buy your ammo from and see what stock is like and price. Then jump on line and have a look reloaders, gun city, broncos and see whats in stock and prices. may help you decide
Like any factory ammo now once you decide what your gun likes you need to work out how many rounds a year you will go though and have your own stock.(yes i know a lot of hunters cant go buy $600 or $800 worth of ammo at once)
I use 162sst its gone from $90 a box to $130 in 18 months.
Couldn’t help myself, if we’re doing ballistics.. this is the 7prc with a 20” barrel, 175 berger elete hunter starting out at 2800, and a 180 eld-m starting out at 2750. Moderate speed, I could get a bit more out of each. I don’t mean to knock on the 30 cal enthusiasts, but the 7mm just eats them up, especially since there is no dangerous game in nz..
Attachment 241778
Attachment 241779
+1 for 300WSM, very managable recoil for mine with a maniatis suppressor/brake combo. The biggest downside is factory ammo availability, there was only 1 shop in the region that had any, which sold out within a few days of the shipment arriving. Christchurch might hold the goods, there was plenty of selection in the Kaikoura H&F when I passed through a few weeks ago
I love my short barrelled 300wsm.
I’m of the thought that short and thick does the trick… long and thin goes too far in!
100% for 300wsm. I've been using one for out to 500 max- for 3 years and assuming I do my part- there are kāore walk aways using 178g eldx.
@Monk has been doing same for far longer and would ha e shot probably 2 to 300 deer with it I'm guessing.
Nothing walks away.
