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  • 1 Post By gundoc
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Thread: Old pistol, ornament or ?

  1. #1
    GWH
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    Old pistol, ornament or ?

    Hey guys, helping out a friend who's father has passed with the disposal of the old boys firearms.

    Found this ancient pistol in pieces. It's brass and doesn't appear to have a chamber at all, and has a large diameter un-rifled barrel.

    It does have various ports in the action.

    Thinking it's more than an ornament, maybe an antique starting pistol?

    Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

  2. #2
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    Are there any proof marks stamped on it? It appears to be a typical example of a flintlock pocket pistol with spring bayonet that were popular in England in the late 1700's to early 1800's, but it could also be a relatively modern replica. Proof marks will determine if it is an original. Originals may be owned without any licence, but replicas require a C endorsement.
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  3. #3
    GWH
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundoc View Post
    Are there any proof marks stamped on it? It appears to be a typical example of a flintlock pocket pistol with spring bayonet that were popular in England in the late 1700's to early 1800's, but it could also be a relatively modern replica. Proof marks will determine if it is an original. Originals may be owned without any licence, but replicas require a C endorsement.
    Great info, thank you.

    Yes I did see something stamped on it, will confirm and report back.

    Cheers

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  4. #4
    GWH
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    Quote Originally Posted by gundoc View Post
    Are there any proof marks stamped on it? It appears to be a typical example of a flintlock pocket pistol with spring bayonet that were popular in England in the late 1700's to early 1800's, but it could also be a relatively modern replica. Proof marks will determine if it is an original. Originals may be owned without any licence, but replicas require a C endorsement.
    Do these marks mean anything?

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  5. #5
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    Those marks imply that the intended use for this pistol is Elephants, Large Game.
    GWH, FRST and akaroa1 like this.
    More meplat, more better.

  6. #6
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    As others have said it is a pocket pistol . It is an octagonal brass barrel/action boxlock muzzle loading black powder flintlock pocket pistol with a bayonet fitted . It was probably made in Liege in Belgium when belgium was part of France , but the ELG proof mark should be in an oval ( the ELG in an oval came in 1810 and was strictly enforced ) so it was probably made before then, when gunmakers proved their own barrels , I doubt it is a modern copy They would have makers name proof marks etc . The pistol was fitted with a safety catch which locked into the frizzen ,( the metal part on top of the barrel that hinges forward ) .
    these pistols were made for very close range self defence , hence the lack of sights, the big bore and no rifling. It was made of brass because it resisted corrosion/rust of both sweat in the owners pocket and the black powder load .It would be carried loaded and was seldom fired or cleaned . Most came in pairs .
    Most of this sort of pistol has screw barrels , that is they screwed off and the powder charge was loaded into the breach and an oversize ball was placed on top then the barrel screwed back on . This gave a very tight fit to the ball and increased velocity considerably . this one doesn't appear to be a screw barrel.
    It is an antique under the arms act and does not need a licence to own , unless it is loaded and fired , something I would not recommend .
    Do not dry fire it without something like a piece of wood in the jaws of the hammer and the frizzen down as this can damage the mechanism . You can find pictures of this sort of pistol on the net .If you ever rebuild it pm me and I'll send you a flint for it .
    GWH, Tommy, akaroa1 and 4 others like this.
    Get as close as you can then six feet closer

  7. #7
    GWH
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    Quote Originally Posted by tanqueray View Post
    Those marks imply that the intended use for this pistol is Elephants, Large Game.
    Gold

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  8. #8
    GWH
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    Quote Originally Posted by Druid View Post
    As others have said it is a pocket pistol . It is an octagonal brass barrel/action boxlock muzzle loading black powder flintlock pocket pistol with a bayonet fitted . It was probably made in Liege in Belgium when belgium was part of France , but the ELG proof mark should be in an oval ( the ELG in an oval came in 1810 and was strictly enforced ) so it was probably made before then, when gunmakers proved their own barrels , I doubt it is a modern copy They would have makers name proof marks etc . The pistol was fitted with a safety catch which locked into the frizzen ,( the metal part on top of the barrel that hinges forward ) .
    these pistols were made for very close range self defence , hence the lack of sights, the big bore and no rifling. It was made of brass because it resisted corrosion/rust of both sweat in the owners pocket and the black powder load .It would be carried loaded and was seldom fired or cleaned . Most came in pairs .
    Most of this sort of pistol has screw barrels , that is they screwed off and the powder charge was loaded into the breach and an oversize ball was placed on top then the barrel screwed back on . This gave a very tight fit to the ball and increased velocity considerably . this one doesn't appear to be a screw barrel.
    It is an antique under the arms act and does not need a licence to own , unless it is loaded and fired , something I would not recommend .
    Do not dry fire it without something like a piece of wood in the jaws of the hammer and the frizzen down as this can damage the mechanism . You can find pictures of this sort of pistol on the net .If you ever rebuild it pm me and I'll send you a flint for it .
    Wow awesome info. You know your stuff.

    Thank you!

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  9. #9
    GWH
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    @Druid @gundoc

    The owner would like to know if this has any monetary value at all (other than scrap or sentimental)

    Any info i can pass on to her would be most welcome.

  10. #10
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    Yes, it is worth a maximum of about $200-250 in its present condition. There are a few things counting against it; spurious manufacture, ostensibly Belgian but the proof mark is not correct (should be in an oval); possibly made for ornamental purposes post the flintlock period (1890-1920); could be of eastern origin; woodwork does not look correct; some key parts missing. By way of comparison, a period correct English example in average but complete condition would be worth $1500-2000, maybe more if by a well-known quality maker.
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  11. #11
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    I would give your local antique arms association a call. Someone may buy it to restore it

 

 

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