Police at it again

It will detract from this thread which is what I was actually talking about.

Feel free to do your own research. You can start here and make your own decision.

https://www.ipca.govt.nz/Site/about-us/What-we-do.aspx

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Originally Posted by Proudkiwi

In situations like this that impact all f/a licence holders, emotive rubbish has no place. Save it for the retarded rugby or dog threads.

A 5 second search like ‘IPCA finds against police’ will show you are completely wrong.

Some of you guys need to get your emotions under control. You embarrass yourselves and other licence holders by extension by some of the content you post.

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If the police stuck to their fucking jobs and stopped making shit up then we wouldn't be posting anything now would we?

"How we act on complaints
When we receive a complaint, we may carry out our own investigation, refer the complaint to the Police for investigation or coordinate resolution of the complaint."

Quoted from: (copied and pasted)
https://www.ipca.govt.nz/Site/about-us/What-we-do.aspx

It looks like Proudkiwi is a poster boy for the significant numbers of cops who somehow get promoted above their level of competence (and often seem to go on up from there). Trying to get an answer from a person like that is a waste of time as they usually mistake their opinions for facts - tin badge syndrome.

Do you think the police ever wonder why people say things like "fuck the police" or "you just cant trust those cops" or "fucking lying bastards"

It is a shame that these sentiments exist. But not surprising, as the police is a govt organisation and it must surely be run with all the efficiency of one.

(no offence to the front line police who actually do good work. but fuck you to those of you who lie and act like fuck heads, especially the fat ones high up the food chain)

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Originally Posted by 40mm

Do you think the police ever wonder why people say things like "fuck the police" or "you just cant trust those cops" or "fucking lying bastards"

It is a shame that these sentiments exist. But not surprising, as the police is a govt organisation and it must surely be run with all the efficiency of one.

(no offence to the front line police who actually do good work. but fuck you to those of you who lie and act like fuck heads, especially the fat ones high up the food chain)

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There even going after bowling clubs now.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-pos...-bowling-clubs

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Originally Posted by Steve123

There even going after bowling clubs now.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-pos...-bowling-clubs

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Stasi.......

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Originally Posted by 40mm

Stasi.......

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Law abiding people are easier to push around than hardened crims, bonus is they get their stats up so they don't look like UC's to the higher ups

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Originally Posted by Tentman

It looks like Proudkiwi is a poster boy for the significant numbers of cops who somehow get promoted above their level of competence (and often seem to go on up from there). Trying to get an answer from a person like that is a waste of time as they usually mistake their opinions for facts - tin badge syndrome.

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Equal parts hilarious and hypocritical.

I post a link to the very Organisation in question rather than giving my opinion so that others may come to their own informed decision yet Invercargills biggest retard comes back with ‘they usually mistake their opinions for fact’

Reading comprehension really isn't your strong point is it princess.

And here’s the idiots dragging me down to their level then beating me with experience.

This thread is yours to take wherever you choose.

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Originally Posted by Proudkiwi

And here’s the idiots dragging me down to their level then beating me with experience.

This thread is yours to take wherever you choose.

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My point still stands - police started this , not us


Now we have to pay lawyers and fund their lawyers through our taxes just to get back to where we should have been in the first place

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Originally Posted by Proudkiwi

Equal parts hilarious and hypocritical.

I post a link to the very Organisation in question rather than giving my opinion so that others may come to their own informed decision yet Invercargills biggest retard comes back with ‘they usually mistake their opinions for fact’

Reading comprehension really isn't your strong point is it princess.

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Beat on that tin badge Proudkiwi, you'll get consolation by feeling important and start to feel better soon (or you could just take your meds)

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Originally Posted by Proudkiwi

Back to my main point.
Rubbish/uninformed/emotive posts, exemplified by the ones above from JWB and Cordite embarrass us all. Please stop.

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I take it @Proudkiwi you refer to this post by yours truly:

@Proudkiwi,

Good point re being too dismissive of the powers that be.

It is however difficult to confidently assert that IPCA is independent of Police based on it making findings against Police. Besides NZ being a small place, the IPCA itself does not investigate complaints but delegates investigations to serving cops, cop investigating cop.

Notwithstanding this, IPCA's lack of independence while unhelpful clearly does not necessarily impact on IPCA's sincerity."



I trust, @Proudkiwi, you will note that I respond politely. Where I am on hols it's mid-day so I'm not as grumpy as I'd be at midnight (-:

Anyway... what precisely is so "[r]ubbish/uninformed/emotive" about my posting? It was as polite a tick-off as you'll get, and it duly included an acknowledgement of where you did have it right. If we get into a habit of attacking people who politely disagree with us instead of correcting their supposed mistakes, how does that sit with us being fit and proper?? Does it come to punches face to face? When we make a criticism we need to be aware it always applies to ourselves too, I'm sure you will agree.

But I'll not disagree with you that I'm not worth arguing with. Really.

Good night.

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Originally Posted by Proudkiwi

It will detract from this thread which is what I was actually talking about.

Feel free to do your own research. You can start here and make your own decision.

https://www.ipca.govt.nz/Site/about-us/What-we-do.aspx

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Not surprisingly yah just put me into something I could Google.

There's always PM.....

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Originally Posted by GDMP

I would still be interested to know how many here,or elsewhere,are having their 'A' cat imports held by customs ......

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Love repeating myself, but here we go again:

My case was the first I know of: https://www.facebook.com/firearmowne...65547177117866

Then from there, the police have been forcing dealers to apply for import permits for A category AR's with the special reason, they're to be sold as A category firearms.
Police, for the last few weeks have no been denying those import permit applications with the reason that the special reason given is not considered a special reason.
Personal imports won't be effected much until the police meet with customs and tell them to start enforcing this new policy.
But every import is a risk, I know I've not bothered since as I lost $200 worth of stuff which quite a bit for me as a student.

@Jexla @GDMP

Was there not a supposed solution in sight from Police meeting with Firearms Advisory Group just this past Thursday?

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Originally Posted by GDMP

Wrong.Its already effecting small private imports....I have less than $100 of 'A' parts sitting in customs,not even action components,small private import.Was told I needed a permit,when I never have before.Some arms officers are releasing them,and some are not....which is why I am trying to find out how many other PRIVATE importers have experienced this.

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That's what I said, I even showed you the same happened to me last year....

"Personal imports won't be effected much until the police meet with customs and tell them to start enforcing this new policy.
But every import is a risk..."

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Originally Posted by Cordite

@Jexla @GDMP

Was there not a supposed solution in sight from Police meeting with Firearms Advisory Group just this past Thursday?

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:ORLY:

Ask COLFO lol

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Originally Posted by Jexla

That's what I said, I even showed you the same happened to me last year....

"Personal imports won't be effected much until the police meet with customs and tell them to start enforcing this new policy.
But every import is a risk..."



:ORLY:

Ask COLFO lol

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Yay everyone loves a comedian. No time for them after the advice they gave us just to comply with AR15 polocy changes with thumbhole stocks and not rock the boat. They are more useless than a bag of hammers

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Originally Posted by mikee

Yay everyone loves a comedian. No time for them after the advice they gave us just to comply with AR15 polocy changes with thumbhole stocks and not rock the boat. They are more useless than a bag of hammers

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But that law made guns wayyyyy safer. Everyone knows that pistol grips are evil

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Originally Posted by Nick-D

But that law made guns wayyyyy safer. Everyone knows that pistol grips are evil

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It was never about safety, it was about splitting a few off of the herd/divide and conquer.

So I rang my AO today to see what the go was importing parts and no worries at all, he just confirmed the parts weren't for and e-cat, went through the list of prohibited parts then told me to go ahead and order it, said customs would hold it and just ring him when they have it to sort it out.

Maybe I have one of the good ones.

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Originally Posted by Gloves

So I rang my AO today to see what the go was importing parts and no worries at all, he just confirmed the parts weren't for and e-cat, went through the list of prohibited parts then told me to go ahead and order it, said customs would hold it and just ring him when they have it to sort it out.

Maybe I have one of the good ones.

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What are the prohibited parts?

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Originally Posted by Russian 22.

What are the prohibited parts?

Sent from my TA-1024 using Tapatalk

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Just the usual for an a-cat semi, no freestanding pistol grips, no collapsible stocks, no mags over 7rds, no flash hider... no different from before except might take longer to get with customs clearance...

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Originally Posted by GDMP

Exactly.....you got a completely different answer to me.In my case it was any part requires permit,regard of whether its for A or E end use.......

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Checked out the permit, filled it out and printed it so it's there if I need it, attached photos of the rifle they're going on with a brief description for evidence theyre not going on an mssa. Doesn't really seem too hard to me..

Police approach to MSSA* classification remains unchanged
[17 July 2018] In order to provide clarity for recent enquires we are reissuing the following information from mid-2017.

In response to recent information being circulated within the firearms community regarding the classification of A-category firearms – and in particular AR15 type semi-automatic firearms – Police confirms that the classification and rules regarding the importation of these weapons has not changed. (*MSSA, Military Style Semi-Automatic)

Specifically:

People can still continue to apply to import A-category firearms as they always have – no special reasons are required. This classification and its interpretation by Police has not changed, despite what has been circulated through social media.
28,000 A-category firearms were imported into New Zealand in 2016 and these will continue to be imported in 2017 under the same classification rules.
There has been no re-classification of AR15 type semi-automatic weapons nor has Police made any proposal – an individual or a dealer can still continue to apply to import these weapons. These continue to be treated as an either an A-category or an E-category firearm depending on the individual specifications of the firearm.
The Arms Act has always required importer to obtain a permit to bring in “parts” of firearms to New Zealand and a special reason is required to import MSSA parts. To deliver on the intent of the Act Police needs to consider whether the application relates to a part of a MSSA or part of an A category firearm. Where it is possible that the part could be either for an A category or an E category firearm Police is required to seek further clarification about the intended use of the part.
Police cannot change the classification of firearms by making an Order-in-Council. Any such proposal would need to be approved by Cabinet and be signed by the Governor-General
Police continues to administer the Arms Act and remains committed to working with the firearms community to promote the safe use and management of firearms. Anyone with questions regarding Police’s approach to firearms licensing or management is encouraged to contact us directly or through the Firearms Community Advisory Forum.
Police’s first priority remains the safe, secure and lawful use of firearms and effective administration of the Arms Act as part of our commitment to safer communities together.



Not sure if that's here somewhere or not but it clears up a few things.

I had the complete opposite today when I rang my AO - Turns out I need an import permit for a buffer spring, detents and magazine springs. What a joke.

Apparently this has been in the works for some months and is referred from "case law" and to stop "grey guns" being created out of MSSA parts.

Have they started implementing this policy on other semi autos now or are they solely targeting ARs?

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Originally Posted by Chilli_Dog

Have they started implementing this policy on other semi autos now or are they solely targeting ARs?

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Just AR's as far as I am aware

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Originally Posted by GDMP

.I was required to give a special reason for importing some A cat AR parts when I applied several weeks ago.People are reading that statement and then thinking nothing has changed....but I can assure you that is not the case....

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We need this in writing. Then we have two conflicting statements in writing to make complaints with

A special reason is required for my detents, buffer spring and magazine springs.

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Originally Posted by Sasquatch

A special reason is required for my detents, buffer spring and magazine springs.

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Your reason should be...I am a law abiding firearms owner, I am legally allowed to own this rifle, and I need these parts to repair it. Can't get much straighter than that?

And that's what it'll be ^^^

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Originally Posted by GDMP

.I was required to give a special reason for importing some A cat AR parts when I applied several weeks ago.People are reading that statement and then thinking nothing has changed....but I can assure you that is not the case....

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I thought you didn't need an import permit for a cat parts. Only for actions.

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Originally Posted by GDMP

If you have an import permit issued in advance by the Police for your parts then you are Good to go.Otherwise you are taking a risk importing any AR parts now.....

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I never got an import permit for my a cat parts. They were only buffer and hand guards etc though.

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Thats crap oi......

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Originally Posted by 7mmTom

Thats crap oi......

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Me?

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Originally Posted by GDMP

One more time.....you now need a permit for ALL parts......and a 'special reason' as well.If you don't believe me,try an import,and see what happens.....

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I believe you.

It's just that when I built mine a few months ago I ordered some bits from Brownells just fine. So you shouldn't need a permit hut you do cos the cops are being knobs.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gloves

Police approach to MSSA* classification remains unchanged
[17 July 2018] In order to provide clarity for recent enquires we are reissuing the following information from mid-2017.

In response to recent information being circulated within the firearms community regarding the classification of A-category firearms – and in particular AR15 type semi-automatic firearms – Police confirms that the classification and rules regarding the importation of these weapons has not changed. (*MSSA, Military Style Semi-Automatic)

Specifically:

People can still continue to apply to import A-category firearms as they always have – no special reasons are required. This classification and its interpretation by Police has not changed, despite what has been circulated through social media.
28,000 A-category firearms were imported into New Zealand in 2016 and these will continue to be imported in 2017 under the same classification rules.
There has been no re-classification of AR15 type semi-automatic weapons nor has Police made any proposal – an individual or a dealer can still continue to apply to import these weapons. These continue to be treated as an either an A-category or an E-category firearm depending on the individual specifications of the firearm.
The Arms Act has always required importer to obtain a permit to bring in “parts” of firearms to New Zealand and a special reason is required to import MSSA parts. To deliver on the intent of the Act Police needs to consider whether the application relates to a part of a MSSA or part of an A category firearm. Where it is possible that the part could be either for an A category or an E category firearm Police is required to seek further clarification about the intended use of the part.
Police cannot change the classification of firearms by making an Order-in-Council. Any such proposal would need to be approved by Cabinet and be signed by the Governor-General
Police continues to administer the Arms Act and remains committed to working with the firearms community to promote the safe use and management of firearms. Anyone with questions regarding Police’s approach to firearms licensing or management is encouraged to contact us directly or through the Firearms Community Advisory Forum.
Police’s first priority remains the safe, secure and lawful use of firearms and effective administration of the Arms Act as part of our commitment to safer communities together.



Not sure if that's here somewhere or not but it clears up a few things.

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Clears up NOTHING.

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Originally Posted by GDMP

I ordered some stuff a couple months back,I did not need a permit (then) either....but now,unfortunately,you do.Things have changed in the past few weeks.And not for the better.

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I mean, it happened to me late last year remember....

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Originally Posted by Jexla

Clears up NOTHING.

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I disagree,
". To deliver on the intent of the Act Police needs to consider whether the application relates to a part of a MSSA or part of an A category firearm. Where it is possible that the part could be either for an A category or an E category firearm Police is required to seek further clarification about the intended use of the part." As I read that, and also confirmed by AO all they want to do is make sure that incoming parts are for acat rifles.. it's not much extra effort, yes it's a bit annoying but all the fuss is over a little bit of paper that takes 5 minutes to fill out..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gloves

I disagree,
". To deliver on the intent of the Act Police needs to consider whether the application relates to a part of a MSSA or part of an A category firearm. Where it is possible that the part could be either for an A category or an E category firearm Police is required to seek further clarification about the intended use of the part." As I read that, and also confirmed by AO all they want to do is make sure that incoming parts are for acat rifles.. it's not much extra effort, yes it's a bit annoying but all the fuss is over a little bit of paper that takes 5 minutes to fill out..

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The problem is when dealers are being told they cant stock parts and having permits not issued because the parts can fit both e cat and a cat rifles there is problem.

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