Thread: Thermal knowledge?

It's not advertising, but a response to a comment which is rather biased, especially when given by someone who claims to be an expert.

Although the 30% smaller pixel may be an advantage for resolution under the right circumstances, those being an increase in overall format size, it is also a disadvantage.

Firstly, it is true that when the pixel size is reduced, so is the amount of light, (light, heat, electromagnetic radiation, call it what you like) that falls upon each pixel is reduced by the same ratio. Therefore, though a 30% gain in resolution is achieved, so is a 30% reduction in sensitivity, and therefore for any given lens aperture, the NETD will be increased accordingly. The NETD by the way is one of the critical benchmarks for any thermal IR system. Higher the NETD, the less capable is the unit for detecting the slight differences between objects of similar heat.

Secondly, because the pixels are so much smaller, the overall size of the sensor is also smaller. This means that the magnification increases at the expense of filed-of-view. A small sensor means that a smaller proportion of the lens is used to form the image, and therefore, clarity (resolving power) is compromised. Further more, smaller sensors require shorter focal length lenses to form a usable image.

I remember when I first used large format cameras, the older ones actually had bubbles in the lenses, and yet, the image quality was breathtaking. A 640x480 sensor will piss all over a smaller sensor, regardless of pixel pitch. I know this, because I've seen for myself.

I think it would be really helpful, if we didn't confuse our potential customers with halve-truths, but let them get unbiased opinions. I therefore think it would be really good if Owl Optics and ourselves lend some equipment to forum members so that they can see, try, and form opinions based upon experience.

How about it?

Originally Posted by Sarvo

XD75
Eats all the latest XP Trials – had an XD50 before and amazing how much superior the XD75 is !!
Aperture – I presume

I'm not sure if I agree or disagree with this statement. I have used both against wallabies in pretty much similar conditions, in the same location, same range etc, so I will be able to review the video that I took.

I remember that the XD75 was difficult to pick up animals quickly, which was made worse because I forgot to pack my hand-held Quantum thermal for spotting, but with the XP50, I didn't need a spotter, I just picked them up and smack them. The XD has 25µ pixels and a beautiful lens, so I would't be surprised if absolute distance performance was better. The XP50 killed it for ease of use though. I dropped those hoppers like stones, once I had tightened up my suppressor, but that's another story.

All our pro pest controllers seem to be doing well with the XP.

I think it would be really helpful, if we didn't confuse our potential customers with halve-truths, but let them get unbiased opinions. I therefore think it would be really good if Owl Optics and ourselves lend some equipment to forum members so that they can see, try, and form opinions based upon experience.

How about it?[/QUOTE]
That’s a big call to make, considering the issues your having with some of your products at the moment Yukon

Originally Posted by Yukon

It's not advertising, but a response to a comment which is rather biased, especially when given by someone who claims to be an expert.

I think it would be really helpful, if we didn't confuse our potential customers with halve-truths, but let them get unbiased opinions. I therefore think it would be really good if Owl Optics and ourselves lend some equipment to forum members so that they can see, try, and form opinions based upon experience.

How about it?

Excellent suggestion, if it goes ahead Can you put me on the list!!!

Originally Posted by tiroatedson

Agree with you faregame....sounded like he was trying to turn into some sort of pissing contest...����


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Pretty much sums it up ...

Anyway - NETD for a FLIR Boson (.12u core) 40-60mk depending on the model, but typically its 50mk - NETD on a Tau2 (.17 core) 50mk - so oddly enough as technology improves you can have more resolution and retain the same sensitivity levels
Actually if anything reduces it the f1.2 lens will reduce the sensitivity a lot vs a f1

Lenses are normally matched vs the camera to the distance/FOV you want to see 320 or 640 models are available as well - so designers can select to what objectives they are looking for

In the past 320's used to mean .25 pixel pitch and 640 used be .17 - so larger imagers and more resolution, these days there are more options
Leaving the lenses aside the raw resolution of the pixels is better - so overall you will see more pixels per square inch which translates into better resolution apples for apples

Originally Posted by Fat ninja

I think it would be really helpful, if we didn't confuse our potential customers with halve-truths, but let them get unbiased opinions. I therefore think it would be really good if Owl Optics and ourselves lend some equipment to forum members so that they can see, try, and form opinions based upon experience.

How about it?

That’s a big call to make, considering the issues your having with some of your products at the moment Yukon[/QUOTE]

And what issues are you talking about?

Originally Posted by Marty Henry

Excellent suggestion, if it goes ahead Can you put me on the list!!!

PM me

The issues with the fn 135’s

So, we have demonstration models of all our systems because we believe that people need to be sure that they are buying wisely, and I back up my gear with confidence. Come on Faregame, let's see you back up your gear by submitting systems to test by independent forum members.

Originally Posted by Yukon

So, we have demonstration models of all our systems because we believe that people need to be sure that they are buying wisely, and I back up my gear with confidence. Come on Faregame, let's see you back up your gear by submitting systems to test by independent forum members.

Once again wanting a pissing contest. Perhaps you should concentrate more on your business and care less about someone else's. It really isn't a good look.

Originally Posted by Fat ninja

The issues with the fn 135’s

Oh Fat Ninja, you are kidding me surely? I made the call to halt sales due to a minor issue with menu until a software update is released. This issue doesn't even affect performance, but I had the scruples to halt sales anyway. FN135 sales make up around 2% of our sales. So, I do stand by our products, or I wouldn't be selling them. Were you after a FN135? If so, sorry, but I would rather make you wait than sell you a substandard product. PM me if you need more info.

Originally Posted by Shearer

Once again wanting a pissing contest. Perhaps you should concentrate more on your business and care less about someone else's. It really isn't a good look.

Maybe you are right, or maybe you are not.

Members, would you be interested in comparisons between different brands of thermals. Please answer constructively.

A comparison like the rod and rifle suppressor test?

Sent from my TA-1024 using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by Yukon

Maybe you are right, or maybe you are not.

Members, would you be interested in comparisons between different brands of thermals. Please answer constructively.

True, I am sure a lot would be.
But maybe it's just me, I find the goading of a business competitor on a public forum a bit distasteful.
I hope that was constructive.

Originally Posted by Shearer

True, I am sure a lot would be.
But maybe it's just me, I find the goading of a business competitor on a public forum a bit distasteful.
I hope that was constructive.

That was constructive, and point taken. However, it's not the first time that Faregame has extolled the virtues of his 12 micron system on this forum, all I'm saying is prove it. It's a bit like Ford challenging Holden to a race.