Auto vs Manaul utes

Real men drive with three pedals

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Originally Posted by 35desoto

Real men drive with three pedals

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Maybe.
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Originally Posted by jakewire

Maybe.
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if this is the 3 pedal option I'll just stick with my auto.

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Originally Posted by imaca

How do you do that?

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If you watch your revs as you accelerate you will notice the revs drop as the vehicle changes down gear (just as you'd expect) but continue watching it and it'll drop again just a little.
You can also notice it when you put your foot down a bit to get up a hill, the vehicle will appear to drop down a gear but wont be as big a drop as if you manually changed down.

Older vehicles will only lockup in 3rd or 4th gear but most newer gearboxes will lock up in all gears.
This is why newer autos have better fuel consumption as you aren't loosing power in the torque converter.

Anyway, as vietnamcam said just manually shift down before you really need too or before the vehicle does it itself, much the same as you would do in a manual.
You can basically avoid all the downsides of an auto by manually shifting and driving like you would in a manual, made much easier if you have a tiptronic auto.

I have one of each current hilux 4wd both have muds and bull bars only diff is one has canopy and one dogbox weights are generally the same this is my thoughts for what it’s worth .The manual we chose as our private/family/trip car and auto for work.

The manual 6speed gear box is really Smooth and just feels so much freer and powerful when driving sit the revs where ever you like actually they have 30nm less torque than the auto just the feeling it just spins along nicely when crawling through really rough sections big boulders washouts at fans etc the auto is nicer to squease over these other than that I prefer the manual to drive

The auto for work work is great for heading in out of town in traffic lights etc
And towing it’s a no brainer it’s just better things I hate about the auto and it could just be a hilux thing the drone of an auto on the open rd and in general as your are up down in the revs it sits in the revs higher when cruising does weird shit with shifts not as refined as some others I’d say off road it’s just as good I’d say really good when slow is needed creeping technical etc maybe a little feeling is lost not much.

The auto does use more fuel but it’s marginal

The service from Toyota is the main sticking point for me that they are not the company they used to be will be looking at others next time and I’ve had the last four models 😐

@Johnny Utah When you say the service. Do you mean the sales service or the workshop side of things?
I know friends of mine if they buy another toyota it want be local

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Originally Posted by Mauser308

With big boat trailers (wind resistance) and heavy TB-class trailers (3500Kg) I'd never have an auto again. Also, I'd never have anything other than a Ranger or BT50 with the 3.2L engine - and to be honest they are borderline too small for the job as well. The auto's are bloody dangerous due to complete lack of anything resembling engine braking on big hills, there's a reason the new Toyota auto's got a rep for burning up front brake discs.

Driving around town light vehicle, doesn't matter what gearbox and auto is convenient there - but when you can't reverse your boat trailer up a hill and round a corner because the ute keeps stalling and you don't have a clutch pedal to feather you have a rather serious and fundamental problem. Know several people who have had that very issue, all are now either running Rangers or light trucks for the work.

Engine size is another issue going hand in hand with stupid high gearing, the bonus with the Ranger transmission is that 6th is not a lot higher than old school 5th but 2nd is slightly higher than old school 1st. But - you have another lower gear in 1st which fixes nearly all sins combined with a halfway acceptable engine size in the 3.2L engine. It doesn't matter how much power the engine makes at full noise, it's the torque just above idle that stops you stalling and most of the new mini-diesels have no torque and are trying to make up for it with multiple hair driers and huge volumes of diesel going through the injectors at high revs and to try to prevent you from chucking too much diesel in, they made the gearing stupid high so it's a lose-lose for functionality.

Also as someone said the majority of utes these days have a stupidly high first cog, and reverse is often higher again. WTF for you might ask? I have no idea either...

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Not sure how you manage to stall an auto? I would have fried a clutch or 3 at least if I had a manual by now,my old non turbo hilux was doable backing my boats up my steep drive but still hard on the clutch, no modern ute has a low enough reverse that I know of. The auto handles it a piece of piss and holds back on hills fine if put in manual mode.
None of the modern utes hold back as well (auto or manual) as older high compression engines, compression is lower to handle higher boost pressures but mainly to reduce NOx emissions at idle and low load.

The new Ranger is a 2l twin turbo.....mated to the 10speed auto it should be a good thing....in a manual maybe not so much.

A bit of both it’s funny how yes sir no sir nothings a problem sir untill the money has changed hands and your down the road. unfortunately for my dealer I have two hiluxs one under a business name they have not made the connection between probably because partner drops of picks up etc our family one and we receive very different levels of service.

Workshop wise
Look the way I see it cars have problems they all do they break things time to time have certain faults that’s motoring. All you can ask for is to be straight up and down about it .But what I have Had is a few problems arise And been told it’s fine it’s normal or it’s us general ducking
In regards to the dpf burn off excessive smoking
And when they fix your work truck no questions asked for the same problem but give ya the cold shoulder run around privately it can/will leave a sour taste in your mouth.

The product to this point I like but i have not struck this sort of deniably with Toyota before and I will be honest and say I haven’t bought from the same dealer as the previous models living in different places at the time but it’s a gobal brand and the same product so should to a degree expect consistent service

Yes I know a dealer change could be the answer but as there is have a class action against Toyota in Australia for fobbing people off for this exact problem maybe they are doing as told just

As George w bush said once bitten hummm twice bitten shy or some shit 👍🏻

@Jonny Utah must say your dealer must have his head in the clouds if he can’t connect your number plate to who he’s sold his utes too:shave:
Thanks for the feed back on post#47:thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Johnny Utah

A bit of both it’s funny how yes sir no sir nothings a problem sir untill the money has changed hands and your down the road. unfortunately for my dealer I have two hiluxs one under a business name they have not made the connection between probably because partner drops of picks up etc our family one and we receive very different levels of service.

Workshop wise
Look the way I see it cars have problems they all do they break things time to time have certain faults that’s motoring. All you can ask for is to be straight up and down about it .But what I have Had is a few problems arise And been told it’s fine it’s normal or it’s us general ducking
In regards to the dpf burn off excessive smoking
And when they fix your work truck no questions asked for the same problem but give ya the cold shoulder run around privately it can/will leave a sour taste in your mouth.

The product to this point I like but i have not struck this sort of deniably with Toyota before and I will be honest and say I haven’t bought from the same dealer as the previous models living in different places at the time but it’s a gobal brand and the same product so should to a degree expect consistent service

Yes I know a dealer change could be the answer but as there is have a class action against Toyota in Australia for fobbing people off for this exact problem maybe they are doing as told just

As George w bush said once bitten hummm twice bitten shy or some shit 👍🏻

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This issue seems to be common to most manufacturers, through friends and family I've heard similar issues of denial and ineptitude from Mazda, Land Rover, Suzuki (twice) and multiple general mechanics.

I'm just glad I work on my own vehicles as I don't trust anyone else to have the same amount of care or intrest as I do.

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Originally Posted by Mauser308

You stall an auto Hilux or Amarok by trying to back a heavy trailer up up hill and around a corner. You are correct - theoretically it should not be possible, but it appears that without RPM on and turbo(s) spooled up, there isn't enough power in the tiny little sewing machine that they are passing off as an engine to shift the weight without stalling the engine. As I said, going forwards at RPM fine, going real slow but requiring high torque out of the engine at lower than the RPM required to develop turbo power means they cannot handle it.

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They should have got a Mitsubishi then[emoji16] only problem I have backing a trailer uphill is tiresmoke.

Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

They should have got a Mitsubishi then[emoji16] only problem I have backing a trailer uphill is tiresmoke.

Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk

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Thats cause you went for the 2wd! Have stalled my 80series auto landcruiser backing a full tandem trailer of gravel up a hill round a corner, Surprised me some what never had it happen again though

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Originally Posted by Mauser308

You stall an auto Hilux or Amarok by trying to back a heavy trailer up up hill and around a corner. You are correct - theoretically it should not be possible, but it appears that without RPM on and turbo(s) spooled up, there isn't enough power in the tiny little sewing machine that they are passing off as an engine to shift the weight without stalling the engine. As I said, going forwards at RPM fine, going real slow but requiring high torque out of the engine at lower than the RPM required to develop turbo power means they cannot handle it.

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Anytime I've had to back a heavy load in a difficult situation I always stick it in low range, auto or manual, makes for a much more relaxing experience.
A ute/SUV/4wd that doesn't have low range is a townie car.

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Originally Posted by Beetroot

Anytime I've had to back a heavy load in a difficult situation I always stick it in low range, auto or manual, makes for a much more relaxing experience.
A ute/SUV/4wd that doesn't have low range is a townie car.

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I have a townie car/ no low range as 2wd.
Definitely should not engage 4wd for backing on a hard surface(tarseal/concrete)

Yet another reason I didnt get a manual.

Only the top spec utes run a awd system capable of being used on a high traction surface....Mitsi Benz Vw etc:thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

I have a townie car/ no low range as 2wd.
Definitely should not engage 4wd for backing on a hard surface(tarseal/concrete)

Yet another reason I didnt get a manual.

Only the top spec utes run a awd system capable of being used on a high traction surface....Mitsi Benz Vw etc:thumbsup:

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Sorry, as a Land Rover owner I forget peasants dont get 2wd low or non locked 4wd.:D

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Originally Posted by Beetroot

Sorry, as a Land Rover owner I forget peasants dont get 2wd low or non locked 4wd.:D

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as a land rover owner you also appreciate the value of sawdust on the garage floor

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Originally Posted by gonetropo

as a land rover owner you also appreciate the value of sawdust on the garage floor

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I certainly don't get much rust in the engine bay.....

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Originally Posted by Mauser308

Not much chop engaging low range on blacktop, instant bind up and crab. And reverse gear ratio is the issue, not all wheel drive or whatever VW/Benz/Whatever brand you favour. Too higher reverse means too much power required and no go going backwards... The torque converter locks up when the load comes on, but the engine isn't developing the required power and can't hit the required RPM even though you are demanding high fuel/power generation from the donkey - big throttle pedal input.

The ECU won't inject the fuel as the motor isn't developing RPM, no power with locked up torque converter = stall. And you look like a dick holding up traffic... At least a clutch pedal allows you to feather until you have some RPM up and the engine can produce some power. Other dodge is rev the engine in neutral to try and spool the turbo up so that when you go into gear you can get enough power to start reversing, but that is hard on the box and sometimes results in wheel spin.

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In this case, yes you are scewed if you can't use low range.
Even off road, the newest Amaroks don't have a transfer box so whilst 1st gear might be extra low, reverse will still be an issue.

In light of this and thinking about the stupid places I've towed stuff, I don't think I'll ditch the green oval anytime soon!

Mauser 308, to tow 3.5 tonnes behind the ranger here in Oz you have to have it and the boat trailer fitted with electronic brakes. I assume the same in NZ. Properly adjusted on a tandem trailer they should take a lot of the breaking load off the ute in my experience.

got an auto ranger and a manual amarok........ prefer the vw for some reason

Are manual locking front hubs available for modern utes such as the Ranger?

Ok so I’ve read most of this thread.
Most not all so apologise if it’s been covered but how’s the brakes auto vs manual? As in auto you use the brakes more...so they must wear out sooner.
So if your not towing a lot, which of the two is it.
I like driving manuals so my prejudice is for them. But I can see the pros for auto. Question is don’t tow, have traffic but concerned about fuel consumption and changing break discs pads every five minutes. On road off road 80/20.
Which would you chose.

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Originally Posted by Sideshow

Ok so I’ve read most of this thread.
Most not all so apologise if it’s been covered but how’s the brakes auto vs manual? As in auto you use the brakes more...so they must wear out sooner.
So if your not towing a lot, which of the two is it.
I like driving manuals so my prejudice is for them. But I can see the pros for auto. Question is don’t tow, have traffic but concerned about fuel consumption and changing break discs pads every five minutes. On road off road 80/20.
Which would you chose.

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If you do traffic fuel consumption will be similar and any minor increase in brake pad wear will be offset by not wearing out a costly to replace clutch.
My Father has had a auto Colorado from new and reguarly tows 2.5-3 tonne of boat over takaka hill ( one of nzs steeper tight turns hills) and fuel tankers.
He had the front pads and disks replaced at the 100,000km service not because they were out of spec but because that is what the book service states and he is a stickler for serviceing.

Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by Sideshow

Ok so I’ve read most of this thread.
Most not all so apologise if it’s been covered but how’s the brakes auto vs manual? As in auto you use the brakes more...so they must wear out sooner.
So if your not towing a lot, which of the two is it.
I like driving manuals so my prejudice is for them. But I can see the pros for auto. Question is don’t tow, have traffic but concerned about fuel consumption and changing break discs pads every five minutes. On road off road 80/20.
Which would you chose.

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I wouldn't loose any sleep over brake wear, I've never noticed byself braking more between one or the other.
If it's something you are worried about then adjust your driving style to suit or just drive in tiptronic.

Life’s to bloody short to be driving land rovers and spend all the time repairing them.....I’ll stick with my L200:thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by berg243

as a land rover owner you wont wear out the brakes as the vehicle will be in the workshop being repaired for 80% of its life.:P:XD:

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Saves on fuel costs too.

As an aside my 80 series cruiser after having rebuilt all the calipers and replaced all the disks front and rear at great expense I would still smoke a set of front pads every warrent and rears every second.....admittedly it was on 33" tires and they work the brakes a bit harder but my driving style is no differnt to say the hilux I had on 33"s or any of the other old school trucks/utes I have had.....they just had shit brakes and a heavy vehicle with a shit automatic box.
Thankfully things have moved on.

Ok so all good just my 04 L200 which I brought SH with 75000 miles on the clock has never had its brakes done while I’ve owned it and I’ve added another 75000 miles.
Also I’d rather change a manual clutch than an auto. Plus if for some god awful reason you do brake down at lest you can tow it. Or push start a manual. Unless things have moved on there too?

I have a auto 06 hilux , The wife wanted an auto so she could drive it and that was my compromise for getting the ute. Have not had many problems , owned for 6 years and done 258km now.

Just changed the auto trans oil the other day and it made the trans a lot smoother as she was becoming a bit clunky.
Id recommend a auto , one less thing to worry about and the trans is pretty bullet proof in a hilux.
just my 2c

Manual vs Auto

Went way up a river bed hunting many years ago got to the hut strange the auto box land cruiser was sitting no one about.

Turns out one of the batteries went duff he was stuck until an other battery arrived. and they had to walk to and from their chosen hunting spot.

My old manual Triton 2.8td was parked next to it and for fun I let it roll a couple of vehicle lengths down the hill we were parked on and it started easily.

Ive also put petrol in it more times than I should admit its still going strong just had the injectors checked, shimmed the camshaft valve clearances fitted a new timing chain and tensioner hopefully it will still go to the moon and back again!

I have a BMW X5 40d M Sport 8 speed auto I am going to sell but I am keeping the old Triton.