Meindl Boot Failure !

Thought I would see how many folks have had they Meindl Boots sole fail/disintegrate, I love my Meindl Boots & have 5 pairs, some 10yrs old & just had a sole disintegrate on a 4-5yr old pair, that were in 85+ percent condition, very little wear on the sole, lucky it was a 3hr walk, talked to the agent & they said tough get them resoled at my expense, this happens to a lot of them if you don't wear them regularly (one lady said ever day/week) !!!

Well a lot of people may only wear them once or twice a year & expect (when you paid out over $600) them to be Ok cleaned, oiled & put away till next hunt, you don't wear the same boots for all types of hunt, what if I had been half way home near dark on a Thar hunt, you could die up there in your socks !

It would also be good if we knew what type of sole was most at risk, I hear it is the "Vibram"in the yellow emblem, same as my 7yr old Burma's which are Ok for now, I have a 12-14yr old pair with the "Meindl Shoes For Active" in the Blue emblem that are still in great condition ?

Yes - its a lot more common than we all think/know
As you know I have been bringing in exc quality "used" Boots from East Europe - Lowa - Meindl - Hanwag - Scarpa etc

One lot we got from same person - all failed in the Sole
The material between the Vibram & inner sole turns to mush - like a crumbly cottage cheese texture
Then the Vibram sole peels off and all this crumbly stuff literally fall out

Anyway - its to do with storage and age
One of the pair I sold to a FM - sent them to Meindl here in NZ and they said this

"boots need to be worn also need to be kept in cool dry place away from humidity"
He also said (for memory) that the soles are designed to pump - so when in use they circulate air - when not in use and stored damp/humid place they will deteriorate in the area between tread sole and inner sole


So - yes - paying 5-600 notes then have them fail is not good, why I never buy New
Make sure they are fully dry and do not use excessive heat to dry them and then keep them in a dry cool cupboard when not used

So use as much a possible - wear to town or work occasionally - about all you can do

Good to have you back@sarvo good info there

Sent from my HP 8 using Tapatalk

I’d be really pissed off. Meindl used to have a great reputation for quality and reliability- would not touch them now ! Heard too many stories like this.

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Originally Posted by chainsaw

I’d be really pissed off. Meindl used to have a great reputation for quality and reliability- would not touch them now ! Heard too many stories like this.

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As I said above the 3 pairs I had fail were - Lowa - Meindl and a a pair of Hanwag
I don't actually think its unique to one Brand in particular

Meindl - maybe because 70% out there last 20 years were Meindl - so you hear more about them, remember bad news travel wider and faster than good :-)

Yeah this happens too our meindls at work, at approximatly 5yrs old the soles peel off regardless of how little use they've had. I spoke to a cobbler and he said that the polyurethane(?)
impact cushion breaks down over time and has nothing to do with the glue and there is nothing that you can do about it, the boots are made to be worn daily until they're stuffed, not one every three months over 20 years.

Yip had my sole fall off when I was working in Canada. Half way through a 12hr hike was not ideal

4-5 yr old boots and you are having a go at the supplier really?

Common problem. I found the sole off a Meindl boot a long way into the Kawakas once. I bet the owner was pretty pissed off.
I have heard this BS about "they will fail if you don't use them". If you pay $600 for a pair of boots you expect them to last more than 5 years regardless of how often you wear them. I have a pair of Scarpa's going on 25 years old and they are just starting fall apart now but I now hear Scarpa are advertising their mid soles as "environmentally friendly" because they break down in landfills (and probably prior to that too).

Yup happened to mine the newer ones not the really old ones go figure. Cost me a fortune to have Stager resole them. Left a really sour taste in the wallet.

5 years is a pretty good lifespan on a pair of boots really.

it could be worse, a quick google of the problem and i found this on the lowa site, seems its not uncommon as mentioned above

Boot Sole Separation (Hydrolysis)
Sole Units will degrade when your footwear is used only occasionally and is stored for long periods of time. Sole units degrade faster than if the footwear is worn regularly. Hydrolysis is a normal material aging process that occurs in all footwear with a cushioned PU midsole independent of the manufacturer. The process also occurs in automobile, tires, ski boots or helmets and does not represent lower quality or even a quality issue in materials or workmanship.

There are two types of sole injection technology popular with outdoor boots: EVA and PU. LOWA uses PU Injected Technology, to extend the life of their boots.

PU vs. EVA
We use PU on our midsoles. It's a terrific shock absorber, rebounds well, will last longer on the trail and offers better comfort. You will get two to five times the performance life compared to molded EVA midsoles.

When a PU midsole begins to deteriorate, you'll see small cracks along the injection area, above the sole unit. This is an indication that your boots are wearing out.

* If you are experiencing sole unit separation, or degradation, please send us an email. Our customer service team will contact you regarding the age of the boots and what steps can be taken regarding the sole separation.

https://www.lowaboots.com/about-lowa...nty-and-repair

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Originally Posted by scoped

5 years is a pretty good lifespan on a pair of boots really.

it could be worse, a quick google of the problem and i found this on the lowa site, seems its not uncommon as mentioned above

Boot Sole Separation (Hydrolysis)
Sole Units will degrade when your footwear is used only occasionally and is stored for long periods of time. Sole units degrade faster than if the footwear is worn regularly. Hydrolysis is a normal material aging process that occurs in all footwear with a cushioned PU midsole independent of the manufacturer. The process also occurs in automobile, tires, ski boots or helmets and does not represent lower quality or even a quality issue in materials or workmans
There are two types of sole injection technology popular with outdoor boots: EVA and PU. LOWA uses PU Injected Technology, to extend the life of their boots.

PU vs. EVA
We use PU on our midsoles. It's a terrific shock absorber, rebounds well, will last longer on the trail and offers better comfort. You will get two to five times the performance life compared to molded EVA midsoles.

When a PU midsole begins to deteriorate, you'll see small cracks along the injection area, above the sole unit. This is an indication that your boots are wearing out.

* If you are experiencing sole unit separation, or degradation, please send us an email. Our customer service team will contact you regarding the age of the boots and what steps can be taken regarding the sole separation.

https://www.lowaboots.com/about-lowa...nty-and-repair

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If the said boots are only being worn for the occasional hunt/tramp, then NO , 5 years is not good enough

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Originally Posted by Sarvo

Yes - its a lot more common than we all think/know
As you know I have been bringing in exc quality "used" Boots from East Europe - Lowa - Meindl - Hanwag - Scarpa etc

One lot we got from same person - all failed in the Sole
The material between the Vibram & inner sole turns to mush - like a crumbly cottage cheese texture
Then the Vibram sole peels off and all this crumbly stuff literally fall out

Anyway - its to do with storage and age
One of the pair I sold to a FM - sent them to Meindl here in NZ and they said this

"boots need to be worn also need to be kept in cool dry place away from humidity"
He also said (for memory) that the soles are designed to pump - so when in use they circulate air - when not in use and stored damp/humid place they will deteriorate in the area between tread sole and inner sole


So - yes - paying 5-600 notes then have them fail is not good, why I never buy New
Make sure they are fully dry and do not use excessive heat to dry them and then keep them in a dry cool cupboard when not used

So use as much a possible - wear to town or work occasionally - about all you can do

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It cant be to do with storage and age can it? Must be the products they use? Glue etc?

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Originally Posted by Gibo

It cant be to do with storage and age can it? Must be the products they use? Glue etc?

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Yea - @scoped above covered it correct

I got a pair of Mindls from @Sarvo and they shit themselves.
I went through Stagers to get some resolution as the boots I brought were MINT. They re-glued soles twice.
I got ahold of Sarvo and kept him in the loop about what was going on. Because hes such a good bastard he replaced them with a pair of Han Wags. Thats customer service right there.:thumbsup:

Sorry Paul, its really out of our hands, Most high end boots have Vibram soles and if they are not worn often the PU material of the sole unit created by Vibram does show a slow degradation over time when left in storage with no use. The boot is designed to be worn often. The walking motion pushes air through the structure and materials of the boot and sole. This fresh air movement dries the materials and staves off the degradation. Life spans of more than 10yrs are normal when the boots are worn regularly.
The number one worst thing to do with boots with PU and EVA sole units is to not wear them and leave them stored for ages after a couple of field uses. Water and humidity will be sitting inside the boot materials and structure for years slowly degrading the materials. The boots should be worn for minimum a few days per month and ideally once a week. These will need to be resoled as no point in gluing them again. This would have to be at your cost however. We can send them to the repairer should take about two weeks. Cost is $180.

Attachment 86982Attachment 86983

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Originally Posted by Reindeer

I got a pair of Mindls from @Sarvo and they shit themselves.
I went through Stagers to get some resolution as the boots I brought were MINT. They re-glued soles twice.
I got ahold of Sarvo and kept him in the loop about what was going on. Because hes such a good bastard he replaced them with a pair of Han Wags. Thats customer service right there.:thumbsup:

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There are an awful lot of other sellers/retailers that could learn from examples like that

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Originally Posted by Reindeer

I got a pair of Mindls from @Sarvo and they shit themselves.
I went through Stagers to get some resolution as the boots I brought were MINT. They re-glued soles twice.
I got ahold of Sarvo and kept him in the loop about what was going on. Because hes such a good bastard he replaced them with a pair of Han Wags. Thats customer service right there.:thumbsup:

Sorry Paul, its really out of our hands, Most high end boots have Vibram soles and if they are not worn often the PU material of the sole unit created by Vibram does show a slow degradation over time when left in storage with no use. The boot is designed to be worn often. The walking motion pushes air through the structure and materials of the boot and sole. This fresh air movement dries the materials and staves off the degradation. Life spans of more than 10yrs are normal when the boots are worn regularly.
The number one worst thing to do with boots with PU and EVA sole units is to not wear them and leave them stored for ages after a couple of field uses. Water and humidity will be sitting inside the boot materials and structure for years slowly degrading the materials. The boots should be worn for minimum a few days per month and ideally once a week. These will need to be resoled as no point in gluing them again. This would have to be at your cost however. We can send them to the repairer should take about two weeks. Cost is $180.

Attachment 86982Attachment 86983

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@Reindeer
Good one Paul - was hopping you still had that info and would put on here
He is right ah ?

I replaced another pair that sold on Trade Me - the boys father who bought them was shocked with the offer of replace or refund - he was extremely happy with deal and took the replace option.

I was hoping we might get more info on soles that lasted as I need new boots I can trust, the soles on my old pair which are well over 10yrs old & sat in a cupboard for years because I had 2 pair of them are still mint (the back seam burst open) but have the Meindl sole have folks found these better ?

Well done to Sarvo I would say, very cool of you to make people happy like that & those sole don't look too bad, you would think they could be glued back up, not the ones on these buggers !

http://i.imgur.com/B19SKW5h.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/8hfWy0Mh.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/T3750ZVh.jpg?1

http://i.imgur.com/69lhNbwh.jpg?1
http://i.imgur.com/hgBOji8h.jpg?1

@Scout the "grey bit of the sole on my Meindls was knackered. If you scratched ya finger down it it would come away like say polystyrene.
Thats why the glue kept coming away. It would bond to the sole but the sole was knackered.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by scoped

5 years is a pretty good lifespan on a pair of boots really.

it could be worse, a quick google of the problem and i found this on the lowa site, seems its not uncommon as mentioned above

Boot Sole Separation (Hydrolysis)
Sole Units will degrade when your footwear is used only occasionally and is stored for long periods of time. Sole units degrade faster than if the footwear is worn regularly. Hydrolysis is a normal material aging process that occurs in all footwear with a cushioned PU midsole independent of the manufacturer. The process also occurs in automobile, tires, ski boots or helmets and does not represent lower quality or even a quality issue in materials or workmanship.

There are two types of sole injection technology popular with outdoor boots: EVA and PU. LOWA uses PU Injected Technology, to extend the life of their boots.

PU vs. EVA
We use PU on our midsoles. It's a terrific shock absorber, rebounds well, will last longer on the trail and offers better comfort. You will get two to five times the performance life compared to molded EVA midsoles.

When a PU midsole begins to deteriorate, you'll see small cracks along the injection area, above the sole unit. This is an indication that your boots are wearing out.

* If you are experiencing sole unit separation, or degradation, please send us an email. Our customer service team will contact you regarding the age of the boots and what steps can be taken regarding the sole separation.

https://www.lowaboots.com/about-lowa...nty-and-repair

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I only wear my ski boots once or twice a year and they haven't fallen apart yet???

Is it possible to get the boots repaired that have shit themselves like the examples in others pictures? I’ve got a pair exactly the same with minimal use and wouldn’t mind getting them fixed rather than fork out for brand new.

I believe so by Alan Perrett of Perrett Shoe Repair Ashburton 027 437 5840, I'm told from $180 to $200 ?

Hang on a minute....so this is a known fault and their answer to it is to wear them more often to stop it.....How about you use some of the $600-700 per pair and get your R&D department to engineer the problem out?????

I have found expensive boots have an expensive upkeep, all the required maintenance need to keep them good is just not worth it.

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Originally Posted by Scout

I believe so by Alan Perrett of Perrett Shoe Repair Ashburton 027 437 5840, I'm told from $180 to $200 ?

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Thank you

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Originally Posted by wsm junkie

Hang on a minute....so this is a known fault and their answer to it is to wear them more often to stop it.....How about you use some of the $600-700 per pair and get your R&D department to engineer the problem out?????

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Maybe they poached the guy that designed the useless lens caps on the swaro binos that constantly fail (on me at least)

If I got two years out of a pair of boots I wear regularly I'd be happy! Haha. But wear them almost daily and normally the soles wear out or the internals wear out.

If you guys have a pair of boots to resole, have a look at Bennett Shoe Repair in Invercargill. Hamish is a top fella and did my last pair (Bestards that are coming up 3 years old - very happy with them). He only charged $100 - cost of the new sole and his time! Bloody cheap compared to everyone else I contacted, and his work quality is impeccable.

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Originally Posted by JoshC

If I got two years out of a pair of boots I wear regularly I'd be happy! Haha. But wear them almost daily and normally the soles wear out or the internals wear out.

If you guys have a pair of boots to resole, have a look at Bennett Shoe Repair in Invercargill. Hamish is a top fella and did my last pair (Bestards that are coming up 3 years old - very happy with them). He only charged $100 - cost of the new sole and his time! Bloody cheap compared to everyone else I contacted, and his work quality is impeccable.

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That is a good price $100
A guy on Trade Me sold a resoled pair of Meindl and I asked how much and he paid $180 I think from Meindl importer - but not sure
When your Bennett Shoe repair did the resole - is it stitched on or again glued on - prob the later I imagine

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wsm junkie

Hang on a minute....so this is a known fault and their answer to it is to wear them more often to stop it.....How about you use some of the $600-700 per pair and get your R&D department to engineer the problem out?????

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See there’s the problem, they’re not 6-700 $ boots. They’re everyday footwear in the country of origin, just touted here as some sort of specialty gear.
Most of the Meindls we know of are $250 boots in Germany, a country with a high standard of living, and are therefore seen as disposable.

Easily landed here off the inter web for $350.

Be prepared for re-soled Meindls to go down at least 1/2 a size, especially if the rand is replaced, that really pinches in the toe box. Repairers, even the ones mentioned and used by Stager do not have access to factory production lasts, so the boot comes down in size.

Been through this with 2 pairs of Makalu Pro’s, a mate with Island Pro’s and Makalus.....all went to TM.

Just my real world experience.

B

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Originally Posted by Sarvo

That is a good price $100
A guy on Trade Me sold a resoled pair of Meindl and I asked how much and he paid $180 I think from Meindl importer - but not sure
When your Bennett Shoe repair did the resole - is it stitched on or again glued on - prob the later I imagine

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He ground/cut the old one off and glued the new one on. Only option for those boots. Look as if it was done in the factory. And better than new, the soles that were on them lacked traction at best of times, changed the sole pattern and they're like new boots.

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Originally Posted by JoshC

He ground/cut the old one off and glued the new one on. Only option for those boots. Look as if it was done in the factory. And better than new, the soles that were on them lacked traction at best of times, changed the sole pattern and they're like new boots.

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Can you post Bennett's delivery address Josh please - when you can

Bennett's Shoe Service | Home ::

I've just sent a pair of Meindl Island Pros off to Perretts in Ashburton for a rejuvenation. Leather fine, sole fine, the foam in between went crumbly. Only use them for hunting and stored otherwise as they were "my good boots". I think that might be the problem it sounds like its better to thrash them every day, the foam has a life in years.
Thinking back I had a previous pair do the same. Not Meindls though - another brand I can't remember. I had them in the cupboard and got them out for a hunting trip. Went for a walk with the dog the day before to see if they still fitted OK and both the soles fell off after an hour. Thats when I went and bought the Island Pros in a hurry!
So my strategy of having 3 pairs of good boots (full shank for the steep stuff, half shank for general bush and soft pair for stalking means that all of them will fail from foam degradation before I wear them out. Bugger. Using cheap boots and saving your good boots for hunting may be false economy.

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Originally Posted by Low box

I've just sent a pair of Meindl Island Pros off to Perretts in Ashburton for a rejuvenation. Leather fine, sole fine, the foam in between went crumbly. Only use them for hunting and stored otherwise as they were "my good boots". I think that might be the problem it sounds like its better to thrash them every day, the foam has a life in years.
Thinking back I had a previous pair do the same. Not Meindls though - another brand I can't remember. I had them in the cupboard and got them out for a hunting trip. Went for a walk with the dog the day before to see if they still fitted OK and both the soles fell off after an hour. Thats when I went and bought the Island Pros in a hurry!
So my strategy of having 3 pairs of good boots (full shank for the steep stuff, half shank for general bush and soft pair for stalking means that all of them will fail from foam degradation before I wear them out. Bugger. Using cheap boots and saving your good boots for hunting may be false economy.

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I think so. I wear mine daily, and replace them normally when the sole is buggered. My Bestards I resoled were the first boots I've done that with, and only because they'd held up so well.

So how long are boots sitting on the shelf before they sell? Have a pair of brand new boots sitting in a cupboard to replace the ones I use now, sounds like I should be wearing both sets or my new ones will be stuffed before I even put them on

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Originally Posted by 223nut

So how long are boots sitting on the shelf before they sell? Have a pair of brand new boots sitting in a cupboard to replace the ones I use now, sounds like I should be wearing both sets or my new ones will be stuffed before I even put them on

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Yes Good Q
Just had a second pair of NEW boots do the sole peal off and black crumble inner
Both these boots were from same storage supplier and looked amazing and failed in frist few hours of use

I lost over $500 and one guy prob lost days work fencing and other had a 4 day hunt shortened :-(
Really pissing me off this modern day world of "not lasting but look and marketed as best of the best - BS


So - yes @223nut - even if Brand New but stored incorrectly in humid environment and not getting pumped with movement - crumble shit can happen

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Originally Posted by Sarvo

So - yes @223nut - even if Brand New but stored incorrectly in humid environment and not getting pumped with movement - crumble shit can happen

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Boots are stored in a nice dry cool spot out of the sun... Guess I should start rotating the pairs just in case (keeping one pair nice and clean to wear in places I need to look respectable rather than blood stained and muddy)

Surprised you can find anywhere on Stewart Is that's not "damp" @223nut ?!

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Originally Posted by chainsaw

Surprised you can find anywhere on Stewart Is that's not "damp" @223nut ?!

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They aren't down here..... Everything's damp here and salty, left my lathe chisels wrapped in an oily rag and they still have a nice layer of red on them not too mention the problems with a blued rifle sitting in the safe!