Thread: .223 Rem vs. .308 Win

Originally Posted by Phil_H

You are absolutely right @Shadowsol, and I have considered this even to the point of purchasing some 58 gr V-Max that I intend loading up over the next week.

We only have one .243 - Baikal MP-18 - and to date have not had a lot of success in getting it to shoot well. I have only been using factory loads thus far and in 80 to 100 grain. But that is a whole new thread in itself.
I will see how the 58gr V-Max go and if it does come right I will start to use for the cats, hares and possums that are running across the fields and start playing with getting a heavier deer load to shoot more accurately.

However I have always thought the .243 a little over-gunned for varmints, the .223 probably a perfect match but not so good if a large Red deer saunters out of the forest and the 6.5 Grendel sitting somewhere in between.

Cheers
Phil

I had a Baikal in 243 for a while. I used Federal Powershok 80grain, I used to get < .75" groups @ 100m - and I'm sure the rifle could've done better with a better shooter behind it. I did notice if I started to warm it up to much I got some vertical stringing.

OK, if nothing else this thread has been informative and made me think.

Whilst the thread started out as .233 Rem vs .308 Win it has evolved a bit to how the two calibres compliment each other rather than compete.

It has come at the right time for me as I am a true blue .308 owner/user only because I like the round and am probably at a stage in my hunting career and life where I can't be bothered to change it.
It does everything that I want it to do for the big stuff so why would I want to.

The issue comes with the smaller predators. I need something a little bigger than .22 WMR

.233 Rem screamed out as the right fit......But Wait.....what if something bigger comes onto the field when I only have the .233 ? Do I feel confident enough to tackle a deer with a .233 ?
The short answer for me is no. Others with years more experience and better expertise than me don't find it a problem, and more kudos to them. It just isn't me.

So then the thoughts ...... how about a 6.5 Grendel ....... its like having a foot in both camps.....not to big for the small stuff and still can take the a deer with some authority.

Anyway, I have recently purchased a .223 to explore it capabilities and then the thought struck me. I have taken small varmints as in hares and cats with the .308 and it is just so easy.....just not a lot of the animal left after the act.

But then the first 'light bulb' moment. I am not shooting the hares and cats for the meat so what does it matter.

Out with the reloading book, reference to Gunworks for average prices, some hasty calculations...... and bear with me as these are very rough estimations ...... and this is what I came up with.

Reloading a .233 with 35gr V-max in front of 27gr of powder 3800 fps and cost of 81.25 cents per round
Reloading a .308 with 110gr SSP Varmint in front of 48gr of powder 3400 fps and cost of 108.25 cents per round

If you could get the .308 to shoot the Hornady 100gr Semi Jacket accurately there is a saving of 10 cents a round.

Now none of this is taking into account the cost of brass that would have to add up over time.....but as I said, rough calculations.

Anyway for me I think it has been a real 'light bulb' moment.....the second one.

Why am I wondering what rifle I should be carrying, and going to the expense of owning 2 rifles and 2 sets of loading gear when the venerable old .308 will do it all at a cost gap that isn't exorbitant? Well for what I need and can afford anyway.
Time to start loading and playing with some varmint loads in .308

I shall keep playing with the .223 as I am enjoying it at this time but I can see it and the .243 up for sale in the not to distant future.

Thanks for bearing with me....

Cheers
Phil

Originally Posted by Phil_H

OK, if nothing else this thread has been informative and made me think.

Whilst the thread started out as .233 Rem vs .308 Win it has evolved a bit to how the two calibres compliment each other rather than compete.

It has come at the right time for me as I am a true blue .308 owner/user only because I like the round and am probably at a stage in my hunting career and life where I can't be bothered to change it.
It does everything that I want it to do for the big stuff so why would I want to.

The issue comes with the smaller predators. I need something a little bigger than .22 WMR

.233 Rem screamed out as the right fit......But Wait.....what if something bigger comes onto the field when I only have the .233 ? Do I feel confident enough to tackle a deer with a .233 ?
The short answer for me is no. Others with years more experience and better expertise than me don't find it a problem, and more kudos to them. It just isn't me.

So then the thoughts ...... how about a 6.5 Grendel ....... its like having a foot in both camps.....not to big for the small stuff and still can take the a deer with some authority.

Anyway, I have recently purchased a .223 to explore it capabilities and then the thought struck me. I have taken small varmints as in hares and cats with the .308 and it is just so easy.....just not a lot of the animal left after the act.

But then the first 'light bulb' moment. I am not shooting the hares and cats for the meat so what does it matter.

Out with the reloading book, reference to Gunworks for average prices, some hasty calculations...... and bear with me as these are very rough estimations ...... and this is what I came up with.

Reloading a .233 with 35gr V-max in front of 27gr of powder 3800 fps and cost of 81.25 cents per round
Reloading a .308 with 110gr SSP Varmint in front of 48gr of powder 3400 fps and cost of 108.25 cents per round

If you could get the .308 to shoot the Hornady 100gr Semi Jacket accurately there is a saving of 10 cents a round.

Now none of this is taking into account the cost of brass that would have to add up over time.....but as I said, rough calculations.

Anyway for me I think it has been a real 'light bulb' moment.....the second one.

Why am I wondering what rifle I should be carrying, and going to the expense of owning 2 rifles and 2 sets of loading gear when the venerable old .308 will do it all at a cost gap that isn't exorbitant? Well for what I need and can afford anyway.
Time to start loading and playing with some varmint loads in .308

I shall keep playing with the .223 as I am enjoying it at this time but I can see it and the .243 up for sale in the not to distant future.

Thanks for bearing with me....

Cheers
Phil

Greetings Phil,
Congratulations, you are starting out on your quest for a .308 varmint load about 40 years after me. I wrote up the results in a couple of articles in NZ Guns recently but the basic results are that the further apart the projectile weights are the further apart on the target the point of impact will be. This is not such a problem these days with reliable adjustments on scopes. I shot some strings recently with 125 grain Speer TNT, 150 grain Hornady Interlock and 165 grain Hornady Interlock. The first two shot pretty close to the same POI with the 125 grains slightly to the right but the 165 grains were lower and well to the right. My M700 .308 has a long throat, about 3mm longer than my single shot Bergara so your results will almost certainly differ. It sounds as though you have got a decent deer load sorted out so it is just a matter of sorting out a load that matches or what adjustments are needed. From memory you have a single shot Bergara like mine so switching loads in not the drama that it can be with a mag.
I have a few Speer 100 grain plinker and 110 grain Varminter hollow points plus some of the 125 grain TNT projectiles left and am happy to try a few loads in my Bergara if you like. It would narrow the search a little. You are also welcome to any of my load data, just PM me with what you want.
Regards Grandpamac.