Thread: Yet another shooting incident in the states

I'm thankful that no one was injured. Still, it is alarming. I hope it will serve as a kick with a spur in tightening up the gun laws over there.

Originally Posted by phillipgr

injured

You mean killed? ha

Originally Posted by Bavarian_Hunter

You mean killed? ha

Hah whoops. The forum muppet strikes yet again!

What new law would have stopped this shooting?

There are multi millions of guns in the US currently and many of those millions are in the hands of criminals. Criminals are criminals for the simple reason that they ignore and break current laws. I doubt that adding a few more laws will stop criminals from committing crime.

Why do some people want to harm or kill others? That's what the powers at be need to focus on.

The issue with the last laws were they restricted the law abiding without disarming the criminal. For a law to work then it must target those causing the crime and not the law abiding. Enforcing current laws may be a good starting point.

Cheers.

Originally Posted by Littledog

What new law would have stopped this shooting?

There are multi millions of guns in the US currently and many of those millions are in the hands of criminals. Criminals are criminals for the simple reason that they ignore and break current laws. I doubt that adding a few more laws will stop criminals from committing crime.

Why do some people want to harm or kill others? That's what the powers at be need to focus on.

The issue with the last laws were they restricted the law abiding without disarming the criminal. For a law to work then it must target those causing the crime and not the law abiding. Enforcing current laws may be a good starting point.

Cheers.

All they basically wanted to do was introduce background checks on people before they were just allowed to buy any gun they wanted to. Granted it wouldnt stop everyone, but if those laws stopped one person from getting one gun and in turn saved one life arent they justified and fully worth it?

And how would you work that out? Seems like the "policy" of increasing firearm ownership is rather effective at reducing gun crime... Why don't you just carry on just beating the same drum as the rest of the uninformed opinion out there.....

May 9th, 2013
Major Drop in Gun Crime Not Understood by American Public
A recently-released study by the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) establishes, without a doubt, that serious gun crime has dropped dramatically in the last twenty years. The BJS Report showed a 39% decline in gun murders from 1993 to 2011 plus a 69% drop in non-fatal gun crimes.

In fact, according to the L.A. Times: “In less than two decades, the gun murder rate has been nearly cut in half. Other gun crimes fell even more sharply, paralleling a broader drop in violent crimes committed with or without guns. Violent crime dropped steeply during the 1990s and has fallen less dramatically since the turn of the millennium.”

A separate independent study by the Pew Research Center, affirms that “National rates of gun homicide and other violent gun crimes are strikingly lower now than during their peak in the mid-1990s, paralleling a general decline in violent crime[.] Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm — assaults, robberies and sex crimes — was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993.” The PRS findings were based on CDC data (for gun homicides) and on U.S. Justice Department data for “non-fatal victimizations”.

Ignorant Americans Believe Gun Crime is Rising
Ironically, though it is absolutely clear that serious gun crime has dropped while gun ownership has increased, the majority of Americans believe that gun crime is on the rise. According to a survey by the Pew Research Center, the majority of Americans believe that serious gun crime is on the rise.
A recent Pew Research Center survey asked the question: “Compared with 20 years ago, has the number of gun crimes in America gone up, gone down, or stayed the same?” Among those surveyed, 56% said gun crime had gone up, 26% said it had stayed the same, and 12% said it had gone done. 65% of women said gun crime has gone up compared to 46% of men.
As to why most Americans don’t understand that gun crime has gone down, one can only speculate. Certainly, the way firearms-related subjects are reported by the mass media may play a role in confusing the general public.
We recommend that you read the Overview of the Pew Research Center Study, which presents many interesting (and thought-provoking) points. After “crunching the numbers”, the Pew researchers analyzed why gun crime rates have declined so dramatically over the last two decades. A variety of factors are discussed, including demographic changes, increased policing, and tougher laws.

Originally Posted by Sidney

And how would you work that out? Seems like the "policy" of increasing firearm ownership is rather effective at reducing gun crime... Why don't you just carry on just beating the same drum as the rest of the uninformed opinion out there.....

May 9th, 2013
Major Drop in Gun Crime Not Understood by American Public
A recently-released study by the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) establishes, without a doubt, that serious gun crime has dropped dramatically in the last twenty years. The BJS Report showed a 39% decline in gun murders from 1993 to 2011 plus a 69% drop in non-fatal gun crimes.

In fact, according to the L.A. Times: “In less than two decades, the gun murder rate has been nearly cut in half. Other gun crimes fell even more sharply, paralleling a broader drop in violent crimes committed with or without guns. Violent crime dropped steeply during the 1990s and has fallen less dramatically since the turn of the millennium.”

A separate independent study by the Pew Research Center, affirms that “National rates of gun homicide and other violent gun crimes are strikingly lower now than during their peak in the mid-1990s, paralleling a general decline in violent crime[.] Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm — assaults, robberies and sex crimes — was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993.” The PRS findings were based on CDC data (for gun homicides) and on U.S. Justice Department data for “non-fatal victimizations”.

Ignorant Americans Believe Gun Crime is Rising
Ironically, though it is absolutely clear that serious gun crime has dropped while gun ownership has increased, the majority of Americans believe that gun crime is on the rise. According to a survey by the Pew Research Center, the majority of Americans believe that serious gun crime is on the rise.
A recent Pew Research Center survey asked the question: “Compared with 20 years ago, has the number of gun crimes in America gone up, gone down, or stayed the same?” Among those surveyed, 56% said gun crime had gone up, 26% said it had stayed the same, and 12% said it had gone done. 65% of women said gun crime has gone up compared to 46% of men.
As to why most Americans don’t understand that gun crime has gone down, one can only speculate. Certainly, the way firearms-related subjects are reported by the mass media may play a role in confusing the general public.
We recommend that you read the Overview of the Pew Research Center Study, which presents many interesting (and thought-provoking) points. After “crunching the numbers”, the Pew researchers analyzed why gun crime rates have declined so dramatically over the last two decades. A variety of factors are discussed, including demographic changes, increased policing, and tougher laws.

I am very dubious of statistics as they can be manipulated very easily into saying exactly what someone wants. For example lets take your fine country, are you aware that statistically the average New Zealander has one tit and one testicle?

I still believe having mandatory background checks on people will in no way hinder legitimate gun owners and users. We have a fairly rigourous system here in Aus and it works well, I still have guns, so does my brother and all my mates but a lot of drugged out deros who would be dangerous do not. Granted its impossible to completely eradicate gun crime but common sense should take a seat in gun politics in my mind.

Originally Posted by Bavarian_Hunter

All they basically wanted to do was introduce background checks on people before they were just allowed to buy any gun they wanted to. Granted it wouldnt stop everyone, but if those laws stopped one person from getting one gun and in turn saved one life arent they justified and fully worth it?

The law got shot down because they tried to tack the assault weapons ban and a magazine ban onto it.

Originally Posted by Bavarian_Hunter

All they basically wanted to do was introduce background checks on people before they were just allowed to buy any gun they wanted to. Granted it wouldnt stop everyone, but if those laws stopped one person from getting one gun and in turn saved one life arent they justified and fully worth it?

JUST ONE LIFE

Ban swimming pools, they kill way more people than guns. It's worth it if it saves JUST ONE LIFE


There are background checks already for all transfers through FFLs, making them mandatory for private transfers

-is unenforceable
-allows FFLs to price-rape the only people who would bother complying, lawful gun owners


Murders in the US are at something like 1/2 the rate of the 1990s and not that much higher than NZ, largely the difference is violence between gangs, mass shootings are statistically insignificant

Originally Posted by gimp

JUST ONE LIFE

Ban swimming pools, they kill way more people than guns. It's worth it if it saves JUST ONE LIFE

Touche' Gimp, I've used that line before (although my weapon was bunk beds not swimming pools haha), very well played