223 on deer

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Originally Posted by TeRei

I shot 2 stags in the strong wind on friday night. Using 53gr TSX. Nailed 1 stag in the lungs. The projectile blew a hole just bigger than forefinger on your thumb on far side of the ribs and dragged a huge chunk of lung thru the hole. The other got poleaxed in the neck. I had recrowned the barrel. Dont know if it made any difference but the damage was impressive. 26gr BM2.

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How far, or probably more importantly, what impact velocity to you go out to with the barnes bullets?

Took 223 out yesterday avo to shoot fellow with mate and his 3006 didn’t feel under gunned at all and all the deer I shot died better than the 3006 shots all around 200 yards


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Fallow not fellow. :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

Fallow not fellow. :thumbsup:

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I hope so ... :D

Poor bullet selection for the 30.06 is my guess.

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Originally Posted by Oldbloke

Poor bullet selection for the 30.06 is my guess.

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Poor shooting I’d say


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Turns out the previous 190 pages were correct, and 223's do indeed kill deer. First blood on my first 223 from a wander in the Ruahines on the weekend. 73 ELDM did the business.
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^^^ Did those 73 ELDMs exit? In yours or anyone else's experience? I have some to load up. I don't know if they are more likely to grenade or pencil.

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Originally Posted by Tahr

If you are using 73-80 grn ELDM type bullets the limiting factor is enough velocity to make the bullet expand on the target. This is usually regarded to be 1,800 fps.
With my 80grn starting off at 2850 fps Im good to 550 yards.
Oomph, punch and whack-o don't come into it. It's organ damage that kills with the .223.

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I’m not convinced with always going by accepted/printed required velocity for reliable expansion. I’ve dropped deer with 73ELDM’s and 55 V max’s at ranges where velocity would be below ‘accepted equirements’. Admittedly in a vineyard situation at night with no detectable breeze and foliage on vines, shooting along 310 & 370m rows from headland to headland. Optimum conditions really. The animals dropped so didn’t do detailed autopsy. Didn’t even bother gutting some of them, left that for vineyard workers to do. I know I’ll get a runner or two one day but hey there’s plenty of guy’s on here that achieve that at close range and/or using bigger canons.

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Originally Posted by SneedFeed

^^^ Did those 73 ELDMs exit? In yours or anyone else's experience? I have some to load up. I don't know if they are more likely to grenade or pencil.

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Even on Fallow the the 73ELDM's very rarely exit. They just get into the chest cavity and fragment. I have sometimes found the remaining bullet jacket base under the skin on the offside. The internal damage is huge, this is what makes them so effective.

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Originally Posted by zeropak

Even on Fallow the the 73ELDM's very rarely exit. They just get into the chest cavity and fragment. I have sometimes found the remaining bullet jacket base under the skin on the offside. The internal damage is huge, this is what makes them so effective.

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100% energy delivery then, I hope my 16 incher can push them although the sniping spot I've scouted out is only 125m

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Originally Posted by SneedFeed

100% energy delivery then, I hope my 16 incher can push them although the sniping spot I've scouted out is only 125m

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the .223 relies on the bullet fragmentation causing massive internal damage and not on delivered energy. That is why bullet choice is so important. The .223 will kill very effectively out to 400m and beyond. At 400m the 73gn ELDM has a retained energy of around 630ft Lbs. If energy was the important factor here then you would have to dismiss the .223 as ineffective on Deer sized game.

I've only observed exits on goats with 73's. All the deer I've shot with 73's, I get a pin hole entry, trashed chest cavity full of copper fragments.

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Originally Posted by zeropak

the .223 relies on the bullet fragmentation causing massive internal damage and not on delivered energy. That is why bullet choice is so important. The .223 will kill very effectively out to 400m and beyond. At 400m the 73gn ELDM has a retained energy of around 630ft Lbs. If energy was the important factor here then you would have to dismiss the .223 as ineffective on Deer sized game.

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It’s incredibly difficult to explain this to some guys, especially North Americans who have been conditioned since birth to view the use of “match” bullets as the eighth deadly sin. The last time I went there were several conversations/ arguments about it with the cuzzies and their mates, and we used to argue about it in the mess on site in Aus too, with the American expats.

Match bullets, a very small match bullet, 400m, deer, no exit, fragmentation…. A recipe for derision and disdain! Guys can get really steamed up over it and I can say from bitter experience some will judge you very harshly and not get over it.

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Originally Posted by Flyblown

It’s incredibly difficult to explain this to some guys, especially North Americans who have been conditioned since birth to view the use of “match” bullets as the eighth deadly sin. The last time I went there were several conversations/ arguments about it with the cuzzies and their mates, and we used to argue about it in the mess on site in Aus too, with the American expats.

Match bullets, a very small match bullet, 400m, deer, no exit, fragmentation…. A recipe for derision and disdain! Guys can get really steamed up over it and I can say from bitter experience some will judge you very harshly and not get over it.

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The other issue is if the match bullet is not going to do its job at say a longer distance there is the question of ethical hunting.Why use it in the first place. Leaving a wounded deer deserves a good kicking.