Forum Spot Burning

[Stocky]

So I've been thinking and figured I would raise my thoughts here as I know a few others share similar sentiments.

Hunting's getting more and more mainstream and thats a good thing the more people invested the better representation we have to keep it going. Also with the high numbers of animals around the place its never been easier to find animals and some more targeted female harvest needs to happen.

But I do always cringe when I see a TV show or Youtuber post up videos (usually edited to make the trip seem more exciting than it was) with an obvious reference to where it is. Its hard to avoid this when doing video and in some areas such as Fiordland where access is limited by the fact everyone knows the core blocks and its hard to draw, wilderness zones that aren't supposed to have Heli access, or some of the the West Coast areas that terrain limits those brave enough to slog it in, It honestly doesn't make much difference. In the easily accessible or areas that Heli's can fly too or areas with niche populations such as Fallow, Sheep, ETC it can really make a difference. After seeing about 30 plus trucks heading up the Wilberforce a few years after it showed on a TV show and often seeing screenshots posted on FB asking if anyone "knows this hut" Im accutely aware that social media and forums have on spot burning.

Well over the last few years I have really started to see a lot more spot specific posts on this forum that point people to exact areas (specific limited entry blocks, exact locations, etc). I appreciate the goodwill but cant help but remember "The internet is forever" and that a seemingly meaningless post/thread can lead to years of internet search's leading everyone to a certain spot that might not be your local but its likely someone elses.

Its all public land and we can do what we like but its so easy to find deer and other game with the simple advise of climb a hill and look. Or mentioning an area I often talk about "the molesworth", or "north Canterbury" or anywhere in the Sumner RHA but I really try not to say go to this basin as if your asking for spots it really doesn't matter currently and that might be someones go to spot they use. I've had a few areas I leave animals in start getting fly in pressure after appearing on youtube (its like 3.5 hours from the road end). I've found age class dropping back drastically in the last 2 years since as well as the pleasantries of used toilet paper on every ridge post the roar. Or i might PM someone some specific help to keep it from being public knowledge.

I think typically its a disservice to new hunters as learning where deer aren't or that you need to slow down, and finally where deer are is a huge part of why i love hunting. It wouldn't have the same reward if someone did it all for me. Hunting is usually somewhat of a challenge and we have so many advantages nowadays I personally dont really see it needing to be reduced to level of being told exactly where to go.

Anyway I know some American forums have banned mentioning specific units in the open boards and keeping area discussions at a higher level. Id be interested in peoples views on spot burning. I see its well meaning and im sure some people will get upset I even suggested its not the best thing ever but I'm genuinely interested in peoples veiws for or against it and their logic.

I basically see the only pros being that it might help control numbers by targetting areas but in practice I see Rec hunters take very few females and mostly effect male age class. And it helps make hunting easier which i personally think its pretty easy anyway.

The negatives I see are it condenses hunting which in turn exaggerated pressure in specific locations, if the spots hold small populations it can reduce numbers significantly, targetted pressure usually first leads to destruction of age class of males. It discourages figuring things out oneself which helps make translatable skills. It increases pressure on limit entry areas ie specific Ballot blocks which often go unused by those that dont know the block they drew.

[Barry the hunter]

I bet this will vary a lot amongst hunters - I have no hesitation giving info to new hunters on areas to hunt down to detail if they want - why because its not likely I will get back to them I have my areas accessible by side by side and thats me -areas I hunted a few years back when a lot younger and fitter I have no problem passing those areas along - they will be known more than likely

[Mararoa]

Very interesting thoughts, and pertinent also. I personally wouldn’t offer any specific advice on areas to go and where to look to anyone I didn’t know well because all the personal knowledge I have gained has been earned with sweat. More importantly I value solitude and don’t want to bump into anyone else when I’m out and about. You’re right in saying getting onto an animal is not that hard, there’s plenty out there it just requires effort. As far as offering advice on how to hunt to get a novice going, I’m all for it. I think too many people expect success to be a right, and not just in hunting. We are becoming an instant gratification generation. My view is a bit of hard work and suffering makes success all the sweeter, and the person doing the hard work all the more robust.

[csmiffy]

This is easy. People can ask. People don't have to tell. Should it be in a PM? Mayne. But if the spot in particular is public land the it doesn't really matter does it?
If it's a secret spot them I doubt anyone would be telling a noob on a public forum.
Let the public decide

[Stocky]

I bet this will vary a lot amongst hunters - I have no hesitation giving info to new hunters on areas to hunt down to detail if they want - why because its not likely I will get back to them I have my areas accessible by side by side and thats me -areas I hunted a few years back when a lot younger and fitter I have no problem passing those areas along - they will be known more than likely

I'm definitely pro helping new hunters. I've taken out half a dozen in the last year some that will try on there own and some that will only ever tag along. I will usually put them right but a conversation with one individual or multiple individuals in private is definitely different to posting on the forum. Plus i could give and do give the advise "climb to the tops get away from tracks and glass the bush edge at first and last light anywhere in the lake Sumner RHA and you will see deer if not dozens". I can out walk hunters but also there is a limited amount of country accessible for a weekend trip (which is what most have free so i for sure have areas that access is not hard that i have learnt are somewhat overlooked for whatever reason) if I dont want to spend the entire weekend accessing country. Im definitely not the only hunter but id prefer run into someone that if they aren't a great hunter dont return or if they found it on there own good for them.

[Micky Duck]

Not from the couch....hmmmm might be too specific. I've been publically slammed on here both for telling folks good area and for saying piss off and look for yourself.ive also sent pm to newbie warning about big wide scenic photos as it took five minutes to work out where he had been. We all big boys n girls here. Running crying to moderators won't protect you favourite spots if you tell anyone...no matter how you do it. They can in turn blab to the world.

[Stocky]

This is easy. People can ask. People don't have to tell. Should it be in a PM? Mayne. But if the spot in particular is public land the it doesn't really matter does it?
If it's a secret spot them I doubt anyone would be telling a noob on a public forum.
Let the public decide

I guess if you tell you remove someone elses ability to not do so. That's not the public deciding but one individual.

[Stocky]

I bet this will vary a lot amongst hunters - I have no hesitation giving info to new hunters on areas to hunt down to detail if they want - why because its not likely I will get back to them I have my areas accessible by side by side and thats me -areas I hunted a few years back when a lot younger and fitter I have no problem passing those areas along - they will be known more than likely

Definitely i think spot advise should be replaced by how to advise. Its way more useful. I can leave here fly to the states and hunt Colorado for mule deer with mostly learnt in NZ advise and experience. But knowing XYZ spot on public land has deer in NZ doesn't help me much.

[Friwi]

I Can relate a bit to your feeling, hence why I try to not reveal the public spots where I hunt. That pisses off some of my hunters mates with my small success ( 3 or 4 animal taken every year). On a few of the “ secretive spots” I hunt I can now see more and more traffic. So they are not that secretive anymore anyway, but I still dread that if I reveal them to more people, more people will come and make it harder to get something.

The only exception I make to that rule, are the spots in the kaimais . The forest is so dense and hard to hunt that it puts everyone on à levelling field. And there are no helicopters landing pads.

[Stocky]

I Can relate a bit to your feeling, hence why I try to not reveal the public spots where I hunt. That pisses off some of my hunters mates with my small success ( 3 or 4 animal taken every year). On a few of the “ secretive spots” I hunt I can now see more and more traffic. So they are not that secretive anymore anyway, but I still dread that if I reveal them to more people, more people will come and make it harder to get something.

The only exception I make to that rule, are the spots in the kaimais . The forest is so dense and hard to hunt that it puts everyone on à levelling field. And there are no helicopters landing pads.

I think this is why NZ hunter now try to only show there topo lines when they are doing the big big missions that are through wilderness as the terrain dictates access will be limited. I hate hunting around others it feels dirty.

[Tentman]

I dislike this whole "guard it" sentiment with a passion. It's public land. It's public wild game. It belongs to us all. The more we endorse this sort of approach the more we sell out to forms of "exclusive access" . ... . "I have a guides permit" "I have waro access" etc etc, take your pick, with your approach it will come. Even blocks allocated solely to the likes of NZDA fuck me off (and I'm a member).

No-one possesses our public lands, not with knowledge or any other device.

[Builder]

Can you recommend somewhere to shoot a trophy stag with the minimal effort on my part required?

[Mararoa]

I dislike this whole "guard it" sentiment with a passion. It's public land. It's public wild game. It belongs to us all. The more we endorse this sort of approach the more we sell out to forms of "exclusive access" . ... . "I have a guides permit" "I have waro access" etc etc, take your pick, with your approach it will come. Even blocks allocated solely to the likes of NZDA fuck me off (and I'm a member).

No-one possesses our public lands, not with knowledge or any other device.

No one is suggesting anything other than public land is for everyone to enjoy, and all wild animals on public land are for anyone to take.

[will.i.em]

I dislike this whole "guard it" sentiment with a passion. It's public land. It's public wild game. It belongs to us all. The more we endorse this sort of approach the more we sell out to forms of "exclusive access" . ... . "I have a guides permit" "I have waro access" etc etc, take your pick, with your approach it will come. Even blocks allocated solely to the likes of NZDA fuck me off (and I'm a member).

No-one possesses our public lands, not with knowledge or any other device.

Hear hear!

Hunting should be an inclusive sport with the aim to get people into it. No one has to offer their spot, but help a newbie out with some ideas of productive areas. Everyone says we should get the numbers down anyhow.

[gimp]

Can you recommend somewhere to shoot a trophy stag with the minimal effort on my part required?

Guts