Thread: Whataroa kea

IMHO I think one thing it to forget about the whole "1080" label. I's helicopter doped poison of any type will always have some by-kill weather it was brodifacoum, cyanide, phosphorus or any number of nasty things. The Kia is one of my favorites and don't doubt that some are collateral. And yes eradication is likely a fantasy, the possums will be back. Even some of the pencil pusher that I have met will privately admit this.
Maybe we should start looking at sponsoring our own alternatives? Auto traps serviced by hunters? Crazy idea but I just a thought.

They have had people up there for a while running traps, now they are going to 1080, why not keep them up there running the traps

Originally Posted by gimp

Again, I'm not going engage with the mindless hateful posts, but there are a couple of things worth noting:

1: If this operation is successful, possums will be eradicated from that block. ZIP have successfully eradicated possums entirely from a smaller area last year down near Haast, there is a good chance that they will succeed here. The Whataroa/Perth only receives 1080 for possum control (every so often when monitoring shows high numbers). If possums are eradicated, it will never be 1080'd again. That's a win for everyone, surely.

2: Kea already eat dead tahr, and there is no shortage of dead tahr in the Whataroa/Perth tops. A few more carcasses dropped up there will not train them to do anything new.

2 exactly so why the fuck bother suggesting it? It’s PR for brain dead Chardonnay conservationists so they know 1080 isn’t killing any kea, everything is fine.

Originally Posted by 300CALMAN

Auto traps serviced by hunters? Crazy idea but I just a thought.

ZIP have done quite a lot of research in this direction as well. They have determined, as best as they can tell, the trap density required to detect/eventually catch low numbers of possums remaining in or re-invading an eradicated area based on possum home range size and behaviour. They have developed leghold traps that have a daytime lockout (to avoid by-catch of kea - a lot of traps kill kea, which everyone seems to be concerned about. 1 dead kea to 3000 trap nights with regular leg hold traps is a back-of-the-envelope number I've heard) and use a low-frequency radio system to alert when they've been sprung, so that they don't have to be checked daily. It's all good stuff that is promising for poison-free maintenance of an area once initial reduction in numbers is achieved.

Originally Posted by ethos

2 exactly so why the fuck bother suggesting it? It’s PR for brain dead Chardonnay conservationists so they know 1080 isn’t killing any kea, everything is fine.

It depends on what bias you bring and project onto their decision making. It could be what you say, or it could be that they legitimately don't want to kill kea, and are trying to mitigate the risk.

Either way they're monitoring kea with radio collars through the operation, and have publicly reported the bykill from their last operation (a handful of birds and something like 3 deer I think) so there's no indication that they won't report it this time: If they find that these baiting methods kill too many kea then they don't want to use them. No-one in conservation wants to kill native birds.

Originally Posted by gimp

It depends on what bias you bring and project onto their decision making. It could be what you say, or it could be that they legitimately don't want to kill kea, and are trying to mitigate the risk.

Either way they're monitoring kea with radio collars through the operation, and have publicly reported the bykill from their last operation (a handful of birds and something like 3 deer I think) so there's no indication that they won't report it this time: If they find that these baiting methods kill too many kea then they don't want to use them. No-one in conservation wants to kill native birds.

We had best park it there gimp, there are realities of DOC management and there are good ground staff working hard for not much.
Fingers crossed for the local kea that this isn’t one of the high mortality drops.

Originally Posted by gimp

ZIP have done quite a lot of research in this direction as well. They have determined, as best as they can tell, the trap density required to detect/eventually catch low numbers of possums remaining in or re-invading an eradicated area based on possum home range size and behaviour. They have developed leghold traps that have a daytime lockout (to avoid by-catch of kea - a lot of traps kill kea, which everyone seems to be concerned about. 1 dead kea to 3000 trap nights with regular leg hold traps is a back-of-the-envelope number I've heard) and use a low-frequency radio system to alert when they've been sprung, so that they don't have to be checked daily. It's all good stuff that is promising for poison-free maintenance of an area once initial reduction in numbers is achieved.

Here you go for anyone thats interested

http://zip.org.nz/findings/2018/5/go...a2de-502895529

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Originally Posted by gimp

ZIP have done quite a lot of research in this direction as well. They have determined, as best as they can tell, the trap density required to detect/eventually catch low numbers of possums remaining in or re-invading an eradicated area based on possum home range size and behaviour. They have developed leghold traps that have a daytime lockout (to avoid by-catch of kea - a lot of traps kill kea, which everyone seems to be concerned about. 1 dead kea to 3000 trap nights with regular leg hold traps is a back-of-the-envelope number I've heard) and use a low-frequency radio system to alert when they've been sprung, so that they don't have to be checked daily. It's all good stuff that is promising for poison-free maintenance of an area once initial reduction in numbers is achieved.

Some of the selective poisoning systems I understand are in development sound impressive. They can tell the difference between "Visitors" and as you say, radio for more supplies when empty. The concept is to build a defensive ring around cleared areas to slow down re-infestation. Let's hope.

Hmm
ZIP culling tahr? Drop might be off?
Plot thickens

“The Department of Conservation says it is reconsidering its permission for a test-case 1080 drop near Whataroa, after kea were seen eating non-toxic baits laid before the aerial poison drop.
Zero Invasive Predators (Zip) is trying to rid the Perth River catchment of possums.

It has already done the prefeed, which was to be followed by a 1080 drop with double the usual dose of poison.

However, the Greymouth Star reported last Thursday that kea had been seen eating the baits.

Doc Western South Island operations director Mark Davies, of Hokitika, said today Zip had now completed tahr culling in the area, which had been authorised as part of Doc's work in managing the tahr population under the Wild Animal Control Act.

Zip had hoped the kea would then eat the tahr carcases rather than the poisoned baits.

"As per a clause in the permission given to Zip to undertake the operation, Doc is reconsidering the permission for Zip to apply aerial 1080 because of the recent evidence of kea interaction with the prefeed bait," Mr Davies said.

"This decision will be made in the coming weeks."

It would need to balance whether the risks to kea were outweighed by the potential long-term benefits for the birds in the research area, and the potential to remove all pests from an area, Mr Davies.

That would mean less aerial 1080 would be required in the future.

A kea repellent could be sown prior to dropping the toxic baits, as another mitigation method, he said.

"Tahr carcases have already been collected and distributed in order to be prepared if a decision is made to continue with the operation. There may be further mitigation measures required." “
https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/west-c...hink-1080-drop

The good thing with ZIP is they don’t seem to have an agenda apart from wiping out pests, in that they are up front about the good & bad of it all. I’m guessing they are the ones who observed the bait eating & reported it?

So Looks like DOC are finally having to acknowledge that 1080 does kill kea, now that there is hard evidence they are eating the pre-feed. In the past they have just ignored it, turned a blind eye, etc Puts them in a bit of a spot, if they let it go ahead & it wipes them out it could open a big can of worms!

...and it’s on again: https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/west-c...ite-threat-kea

What a joke after 70 years of using 1080 is this the first trail to see if kea will eat the bait or perhaps its the first "public trial "vs some random dead tahr scattered above the bush line , let alone the fact they have now totally lost any prefeed benefits they did weeks ago utter shambles & yet a total insight to what is actually going on behind the scenes , how about all the robins & other native birds will they head above the bush line to eat the tahr as well or just be the norm bykill that no one really understands

Its got to be a real gamble to continue with the drop given the knowledge they have regarding the prefeed results.
Lets hope the by kill is minimal, but i still think its an unacceptable risk and other options would should have been explored.

considering the way health and safety runs things now I cant see how this works.
Bear with me here-in this day in age of risk assessments, before you do anything at most workplaces you potentially have to do one before you carry out the task to identify hazards and mitigate them.
Obviously the risk of a potential massive by-kill no matter the species is not to bad.
This has always been the issue-they want them gone and manage/talk themselves into believing its all for the greater good no matter the result.
Remember years ago when they said it would kill big animals, then it wouldn't kill other animals, then it wouldn't kill birds?

Nature should not be controlled with poisons.