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Thread: J M Wilkinson Shoots

  1. #16
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    Greetings All,
    Thanks for your replies, likes and mentions. I think my first target shoot was in 1981 using my standard Remington 700 ADL with a 2.5 power Tasco scope and a hard plastic butt plate. Loads were full power either 180 or 150 grain. 20 to 30 shooters turned up to most shoots on the now lost Roy's Hill range. Reading through the replies sees the same story repeated with loss of interest and loss of ranges. Most of my shooting is on a local range that has shotgun, pistol and rifle clubs using it. It is not open to the public, only the clubs and there is no target shooting program. The Wilkinson was last shot by the two Hawkes Bay NZDA branches in May 2019 and only the Taruarau shoot still uses the deer target to my knowledge. I would love to know if there are any others.
    Regards Grandpamac.

  2. #17
    Rabbit Herder StrikerNZ's Avatar
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    South Canty and North Otago branches have held a combined Wilkinson shoot the last few years.

    Sth Canty at least was also taking part in it on their own prior to that.

    Also using the deer targets still I believe.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by StrikerNZ View Post
    South Canty and North Otago branches have held a combined Wilkinson shoot the last few years.

    Sth Canty at least was also taking part in it on their own prior to that.

    Also using the deer targets still I believe.
    Greetings StrikerNZ,
    I had a vague memory of South Canterbury and Nelson had shot it previously and am glad that at least one of them still does. Thanks for that, I will look them up.
    Regards Grandpamac.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by small_caliber View Post
    There are still a few branches shooting the Wilkinson & Hawkes Bay Challenge, I had 4 branches shoot it on the North Otago range last year and I'm trying to get another branch to host it this year and get several branches involved.

    I've had a few other branches show interest but they haven't held one yet.

    One observation I made was that those that don't shoot much their scores improve with each position and I've seen many shoot better scores standing than any of the other positions.

    I think a lot of peoples ego stops them participating in shooting competitions/events, they don't want others to think they can't shoot.
    The thing is that the more you shoot the better you get but a lot of people don't want to put in the effort to be better shots.

    One of the things that I try to encourage is you aren't shooting against the others you are competing against yourself and trying to better your previous result.
    Greetings Small_calibre,
    Thanks for that. Glad to hear that there are at least some branches still shooting the Wilkinson. Last year was difficult due to covid and some branches missed it completely. I also wonder if some branches have shot it and not sent their scores to National thinking them not good enough to compete. Hastings did this for many years but have sent them recently with some success. I see from the Nelson Newsletters that they use the Deer targets in other shoots as we used to some time back. Others may as well.
    Regards Grandpamac.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    @shooternz I shot 22rf silhouette at the Ararimu range for several years with the Small Game Shooters Club. Around 1988.

    Nothing like silhouettes to deflate people. As you're well aware, either you get a "hit" or a big fat zero/miss. No 10, 9, 8 etc stuff.
    We had visitors turn up with super flash gear, struggled to hit a silhouette, and never came back, which was a shame really, as that's inline with my performance when I started.

    We alternated, which was good, silhouettes one shoot, paper (NZDA targets?) the next shoot. Paper was standing, kneeling, sitting, and prone, out to 100yds.
    Couldn't do all positions and ranges in one day so cycled thru over several shoots to complete sequence.

    Wish I could shoot as well now as I did then. Shot hunter class, 4x scope limit, Anschutz sporter.
    Started with NZSGSA in Hamilton, used to travel around bit, shot Tokoroa before it is what it is now. Ended up shooting at Ararimu once I started work at Ardmore. I shot with a 541S Remington and a fixed 8x Leupold. The writing was on the wall when people with deeper pockets turned up with heavy barrelled Kimbers and 6.5 x 20 Leupolds.
    I won the Small Game Nationals by 1 point with my Rem. Cant remember what range it was at.
    I couldn't afford a spotter, .22 holes are fkn hard to see with fixed 8 power......
    I remember leading the National after the first day in Napier, and hearing conversations about me , "who is this prick" etc.
    First detail on Sunday morning was 75 yd prone., I had 10 shots in the 8,9, and bull. What I couldn't see was 3 shots into the black portion of the target into 2 and 3 ring. We all had bullet holders that had to be visible, with 10 rounds to be checked by the R.O.
    The scorers accused me of every foul practise under the sun.....and took 3 bulls off me and counted the 2's and 3's. The target backing card showed to the bullets had come through on a slight angle, not from my position, but my left. They didn't want to hear about it. The Napier President was on my left.....
    That left a bad taste, I was pretty young and wasn't up for a row.
    Upside was Dad told Mum to Give me some birthday $ for a spotting scope.....

    B

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift14 View Post
    Started with NZSGSA in Hamilton, used to travel around bit, shot Tokoroa before it is what it is now. Ended up shooting at Ararimu once I started work at Ardmore. I shot with a 541S Remington and a fixed 8x Leupold. The writing was on the wall when people with deeper pockets turned up with heavy barrelled Kimbers and 6.5 x 20 Leupolds.
    I won the Small Game Nationals by 1 point with my Rem. Cant remember what range it was at.
    I couldn't afford a spotter, .22 holes are fkn hard to see with fixed 8 power......
    I remember leading the National after the first day in Napier, and hearing conversations about me , "who is this prick" etc.
    First detail on Sunday morning was 75 yd prone., I had 10 shots in the 8,9, and bull. What I couldn't see was 3 shots into the black portion of the target into 2 and 3 ring. We all had bullet holders that had to be visible, with 10 rounds to be checked by the R.O.
    The scorers accused me of every foul practise under the sun.....and took 3 bulls off me and counted the 2's and 3's. The target backing card showed to the bullets had come through on a slight angle, not from my position, but my left. They didn't want to hear about it. The Napier President was on my left.....
    That left a bad taste, I was pretty young and wasn't up for a row.
    Upside was Dad told Mum to Give me some birthday $ for a spotting scope.....

    B
    Greetings Shift14,
    Sorry to hear of your bad experience. Regrettably there are still shooting groups like that but there are more that are most welcoming, especially these days with declining numbers. I have only struck one bad one. In Hawkes Bay we are short of rifle ranges, especially longer range ones. Our local NRA club shoots out to 1,000 yards but this is all prone shooting including FTR and FO. Long term arthritis has made prone shooting out of the question for me. There are no 4P matches shot locally to my knowledge in which I can participate (note the careful choice of word here). I think I will take out some NZDA 100 metre targets to our next range day to see if I can kindle some interest. Currently only prone with a rest is shot and no scores are taken.
    Regards Grandpamac.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gillie View Post
    I have competed the JM Wilkinson postal shoot a few times - though years ago now. Was a good format as it was just hunter class - no slings, no jackets, no heavy rifles, etc. Just you and your rifle.
    I shot NZDA rimfire silhouette as well as part of the NZDA branch at the time. You get really good and your standing shooting, trigger control, and patience.

    NZDA matches are, for the most part, fairly static and are based around the standard 4 unsupported shooting positions (prone, sitting, kneeling, and standing). These events are excellent at teaching and demonstrating shooting fundamentals - natural point of aim, trigger control, position fundamentals, patience, etc.

    But I also agree for the most part national level NZDA shooting matches seem to be dying out. This is pretty sad really as NZDA is one of the few organisations in NZ able to take on widespread shooting training. I have not been significantly involved for a few years now so my comments are likely out of date. But i feel the NZDA matches have not "aged well" - basically they haven't moved with the shooting community. For example, most hunters will get a rest if shooting prone these days (day pack, bipod, anything really).

    Look at the duckshooters clay target events, IPSC pistol shooting, Service Rifle (before the semi ban), and now the practical rifle events coming up. I think NZDA would be well served to take on a rimfire NRL22 match as a start.
    Simon, part of the problem in NZDA is that a number of members don't support "range/competition shooting" and therefore it hasn't been advocated for and promoted at National level or even branch level. Another problem is the male "ego" that can't seem to get over itself when their shooting is found to be not as good as others.
    What is the solution?

    NZDA National Executive should be encouraging the new NZDA CEO to advocate and promote these events to the branches and encourage the branches to organise and run these events, after all isn't this why the NZDA employed a CEO to get branches and members participating in the association, which would enable the organisation to grow through the positive atmosphere.

    Things need to change in the foundation of NZDA, at branch level, If new members are taught at branch level that you don't need to practice your shooting skills on the range to make them better then the new members look at their peers and think they know best and will perpetuate this into the future, and this has happened, we need to lead by example.

    There needs to be a number of NZDA members step up and start running these shooting events, one or two people can't do it for the whole organisation.
    Also needed is a program to encourage and empower others to step up and run the competitions, ie succession planning.
    All to often some step up to do things and then end up with burnout because no one is there to take over doing it when they need to take a step back, this is part of the reason shooting has stagnated.

    I see nothing wrong with the competitions that are happening currently in NZDA, some of these competitions, as you say are good for demonstrating and teaching fundamentals, and these need to be taught before they move onto something else.

    Who is doing the "teaching" I have only heard of one person at present that is willing to run "coaching" sessions, but can think of a number of branches with ranges that don't do this, they don't even run shooting competitions for their members, why not?

    How the fundamentals are taught is the burning question, NZDA runs "Hunts" courses to give people the skills to go hunting, yet branches don't do the same to teach people how to shoot, there is more to shooting than pointing the firearm and pulling the trigger. NZDA needs more trained shooting coaches....most are too scared to take on this role due to doubt in their ability, also not everyone can teach/coach.
    The competitions are how you judge yourself as you are learning these fundamental shooting skills, you shouldn't judge yourself by others, but on your own progress and your current results from your previous results.

    What is needed to keep people interested after they have learnt the fundamentals?

    A new challenge is needed to teach advanced skills, practical field shooting positions, varied ranges, long range etc, this is where some of the competitions being run outside NZDA could be bought into NZDA.

    But NZDA still lacks the people willing to organise and run these things at branch level, it seems there is a mentality of "I've joined, now I don't need to do anything" inside NZDA.
    Once someone has joined NZDA there should be an atmosphere of "How can we contribute to make NZDA even better, How can we make NZDA a better place and more inclusive place for all members"

    I'll get off my soapbox and done the fire suit.
    grandpamac likes this.

  8. #23
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    Your not wrong though.......

    The world has changed and so has the shooting scene, shooters are not interested in doing the same dicciplanes over and over anymore. They want change - and on a regular basis. Proof of this can be seen in the huge growth in PRS compared to any other shooting disiplane.

    I'm of the opinion that NZDA should focus more on getting members involved in range activities. Developing new and updated disiplanes that will capture members interest and draw them back to the range(s) on a regular basis.

    In a recent poll, by a shooting enthusiast in our area, 75% of respondents indicated that they would rather want to see more practiacal/field/PRS type shooting compititions to be hosted by their local branch.

    Keep the 4P disiplane for it does have a place, but evolve and refresh to stay in touch with the shooting scene today..
    Last edited by Jaco Goosen; 26-04-2021 at 03:29 PM.
    grandpamac likes this.

  9. #24
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    Greetings Small-calibre and Jaco Goosen,
    Pretty much agree with you both. Our problem in Hawkes Bay is that there is little of any type of competitive shooting to my knowledge. The NRA boys do their FTR an FO shooting at 300, 600 and 1,000 yards but none of their kit looks like anything I would want to climb a hill with, or wander too far from the truck with for that matter. I am no longer physically able to shoot prone anyway. I don't know anything on what PRS shooting entails but will look it up on the interweb.
    Regards Grandpamac.
    Jaco Goosen and janleroux like this.

  10. #25
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    We put some up at different distances to see how far we could realistically kill a deer (in ideal conditions).
    This is a couple of different shooters at 350m using a bipod or improvised rests (stacked up bumbags).
    The shots have each been patched out with white dots.

    Name:  350m deer at the end of the day 800.jpeg
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    shooternz and grandpamac like this.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bagheera View Post
    We put some up at different distances to see how far we could realistically kill a deer (in ideal conditions).
    This is a couple of different shooters at 350m using a bipod or improvised rests (stacked up bumbags).
    The shots have each been patched out with white dots.

    Attachment 166568
    Greetings Bagheera,
    We ran a shoot years back, before the days when anyone dialed up. This was on the old Roy's Hill range. Using the deer target we started at 300 yards with 4 shots prone with a day pack rest, walked up to 200 yards for 4 shots sitting and then to 100 yards for 4 shots standing. Roy's hill had rising target frames and a proper markers gallery so the marking was done while the shooters were walking to the next position. It was a pretty steep learning curve for some. The 5 scoring ring was 183mm for yard ranges and the Wilkinson was shot at 100 and 200 metres (or yards with reduced rings) in those days.
    Regards Grandpamac.

  12. #27
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    We run the shoot every year and quite like it, numbers at the northland nzda has dropped off over the years we get about 12 shooters to each event even tho the club has many more members than 12

  13. #28
    Lovin Facebook for hunters kiwijames's Avatar
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    @grandpamac. Tom and I will look to getting this back and running again. The new laws and the Covid problem put the Wilkinson shoot on the back burner at least for the Hastings NZDA branch.
    I will look to see who we can have available as a range officer and give you a shout with arrangements for shillouettes and scoring.
    It's always been a good exercise in my opinion. If you can't shoot a stationary cardboard cutout you're already putting yourself on the back foot when in the field.
    grandpamac likes this.
    The range of what we think and do is limited by what we fail to notice. And because we fail to notice that we fail to notice, there is little we can do to change; until we notice how failing to notice shapes our thoughts and deeds

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiwijames View Post
    @grandpamac. Tom and I will look to getting this back and running again. The new laws and the Covid problem put the Wilkinson shoot on the back burner at least for the Hastings NZDA branch.
    I will look to see who we can have available as a range officer and give you a shout with arrangements for shillouettes and scoring.
    It's always been a good exercise in my opinion. If you can't shoot a stationary cardboard cutout you're already putting yourself on the back foot when in the field.
    Greetings Kiwi James,
    Thanks for that, will look forward to it. I thought something might be in the wind when I spotted your WTB for a target rifle.
    Regards Grandpamac.
    kiwijames likes this.

 

 

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