Thread: Warning Distressing and Disturbing Photographs- 1080 Poison

Originally Posted by Tahr

I just can't take this seriously. 89 dead Kiwi in Tongariro attributed to 1080 - what a crock. I challenge you or anyone Woody to put up any proof what so ever a a single one of them were killed by 1080.
Almost every time you guys put something up like this it discredits you.

Same as when I here DOC have never killed a kiwi with 1080?

Originally Posted by Maca49

Same as when I here DOC have never killed a kiwi with 1080?

Same challenge to you then Maca, put up s single shred of evidence of Tongariro Kiwi being killed by 1080. I have never personally seen a single scientifically validated death of a Kiwi by 1080 - anywhere - ever. Have you?

The problem Tahr, is its not our problem, DOC should have unequivocal evidence there is no harm to our native birds, they don't seem interested, or they cannot supply it

Originally Posted by Maca49

The problem Tahr, is its not our problem, DOC should have unequivocal evidence there is no harm to our native birds, they don't seem interested, or they cannot supply it

They have never claimed that there is no harm or no by kill of native birds though. Just that in most cases the increased recruitment numbers mean the population as a whole benifits.

There are however times when this by kill is very bad, such as drops in kea habitat. You will find that the numbers of dead birds in these drops are closely monitored and freely reported.

Kiwi are unique as their specialist diet insulates them somewhat from the inherent risks of a 1080 drop. With critically endangered species like the kiwi by kill is closely monitored and recorded. Any dead birds undergo a necropsy to determine cod and the results are published.

I would be willing to bet real money that more kiwi are killed by hunting dogs than have ever been killed by 1080

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This is the information that was miss-represented in the above video.

https://www.doc.govt.nz/globalassets...clyde-graf.pdf

https://www.doc.govt.nz/globalassets...-1080-kiwi.pdf

@Tahr. Hey. I only put up the link. I did not make the video . However, I think it is quite interesting. Their comment about kiwi was about doubting DoC's claims of predator kills going on what they could see in a picture. (that personally I have not seen or commented on ever. However, I am very aware of kiwi deaths where DoC applied brodifacoum poison. Little Barrier island was one such instance.

My main interest is in getting the trapping alternative some traction.

I firmly believe the best way to preserve a species is to farm it. I'd be keen as on a pet Kakapo

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater

https://www.doc.govt.nz/news/media-r...ly-misleading/

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Originally Posted by Gibo

I firmly believe the best way to preserve a species is to farm it. I'd be keen as on a pet Kakapo

Gibo having pets is not farming.

There was a chap down Lyttleton way couple of years back trying to farm wekas. DoC didn't go for the idea much. He told them he thought it was the best way to protect endangered spp-- farm them. I reckon DoC thought the idea was a threat to be stopped at all costs.

Originally Posted by Tahr

Same challenge to you then Maca, put up s single shred of evidence of Tongariro Kiwi being killed by 1080. I have never personally seen a single scientifically validated death of a Kiwi by 1080 - anywhere - ever. Have you?

Could you put up any validated truth that none have been killed by 1080?

The problem with large scale trapping or similar labour intensive operations will be the quality of those tasked with doing the actual work.

There is enough of an issue getting modern day physically active young people to turn up to a regular well paid job in town.
Put them in a hut / camp far from home in a largely unsupervised role, i dont know what they will be doing most of the time but it wont be setting traps.

Sure there may be a small core of enthusiasts but typically this role is left to some start up or feel good "get the unemployed working" idealism

Add to that the figure fudging that would be done by their supervisory teams ( that are financially linked to it looking successfull )

You think DOC look bad / corrupt ........

All control methods have their place and should be treated as such. But i just cant see how conventional traplines or even ressetting stations can achieve the effectiveness that aerial poison over rugged terrain can. Dont forget that one of the main arguments against poison ( any poison not just 1080 ) is bycatch. I have no figures but i would be pretty sure more Kiwi have been caught in a trap than killed by poison.

But you don’t know @johnd and there the problem?

Well @Maca49, even if John had those figures, I'm pretty sure you guys would claim they were false propaganda by the evil DOC/AHB/OSPRI conspiracy... And lord knows the likes of the anti-1080 brigade (who seem to be the only people you think are speaking the "truth") would not publish something like that

So it is a bit of a pointless argument, no ?