Thread: Could be bad news

Yes

Hope this helps

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So having had a look at the maps put up by Tahr and Reindeer the proposal to shift the access and close a section of the road looks sensible to me. I am sure that many submissions will support 'shifting' / adjusting the boundary of one section of the road if a new sensible section of road replaces it and not just an easement

Here is a cut & paste from Google Earth that gives a better idea of where the existing road cuts up to attain the ridgeline.
An alternative to reach the upper paddock and rejoin the remaining road and current walking route (purple) could perhaps - judging from the apparent gradient looking from the other direction - follow the line of one of the existing farm tracks that have their point of access from further up Opawe road?

I live in Ashhurst (15 minutes from Opawe Road) so I've been following this with interest.

I ended up contacting the council because I had some questions after reading the Stuff article and the Manawatu Council website. The council were good to deal with.

The important thing is that the proposed easement will mean access will continue. I think the current landowner's motives seem pretty genuine in wanting to make the route clear and avoid people wandering over his property.

My only concern is whether an "easement in gross" has the same protections from being closed by subsequent landowners as a "paper road". I've googled it but can't get my head around it. Does anyone actually know how these things work? I'd like to know before I make a submission.

I have to say I've always found landowners around here pretty approachable. In the last month I've asked two farmers for permission to go across their land for fishing and they were both really friendly and had no problems with it. I've had a few refusals when it came to shooting/hunting but usually for a good reason but a lot of the time the farmers were pretty keen hunters themselves and were OK with it or suggested who else to ask.

Originally Posted by cbfb

I live in Ashhurst (15 minutes from Opawe Road) so I've been following this with interest.

I ended up contacting the council because I had some questions after reading the Stuff article and the Manawatu Council website. The council were good to deal with.

The important thing is that the proposed easement will mean access will continue. I think the current landowner's motives seem pretty genuine in wanting to make the route clear and avoid people wandering over his property.

My only concern is whether an "easement in gross" has the same protections from being closed by subsequent landowners as a "paper road". I've googled it but can't get my head around it. Does anyone actually know how these things work? I'd like to know before I make a submission.

I have to say I've always found landowners around here pretty approachable. In the last month I've asked two farmers for permission to go across their land for fishing and they were both really friendly and had no problems with it. I've had a few refusals when it came to shooting/hunting but usually for a good reason but a lot of the time the farmers were pretty keen hunters themselves and were OK with it or suggested who else to ask.

I havent submitted yet either but have a draft sketched out. Without knowing the exact terms of the proposed easement / right of way I am uncomfortable with the unformed road being stopped. I do however support the Council and landowner desire to 'tidy up' the current impractical legal road access. Two links that might help:https://www.linz.govt.nz/kb/520 https://www.gallawaycookallan.co.nz/...r-right-of-way
From the second link I can see that if a future landowner causes grief for hunters using the fenced easement by for example pugging it up with cattle or blocking it, the matter would end up in court - if the Council would pay, whereas a legal road has much greater protection and remedy

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

I havent submitted yet either but have a draft sketched out. Without knowing the exact terms of the proposed easement / right of way I am uncomfortable with the unformed road being stopped. I do however support the Council and landowner desire to 'tidy up' the current impractical legal road access. Two links that might help:https://www.linz.govt.nz/kb/520 https://www.gallawaycookallan.co.nz/...r-right-of-way
From the second link I can see that if a future landowner causes grief for hunters using the fenced easement by for example pugging it up with cattle or blocking it, the matter would end up in court - if the Council would pay, whereas a legal road has much greater protection and remedy

The thing that worries me is with the closure of the paper road, council are going through a consultation process which gives us some opportunity to object.

I'm not sure if a consultation would happen if a landowner wanted to close an easement.

It's the potential of the landowner and council being able to close it without public input that I'm not happy about.

I might give the guy I've been talking to at the council a call on Tuesday and see if he can answer that.

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

I havent submitted yet either but have a draft sketched out. Without knowing the exact terms of the proposed easement / right of way I am uncomfortable with the unformed road being stopped. I do however support the Council and landowner desire to 'tidy up' the current impractical legal road access. Two links that might help:https://www.linz.govt.nz/kb/520 https://www.gallawaycookallan.co.nz/...r-right-of-way
From the second link I can see that if a future landowner causes grief for hunters using the fenced easement by for example pugging it up with cattle or blocking it, the matter would end up in court - if the Council would pay, whereas a legal road has much greater protection and remedy

By the way, if you (or anyone else) want a copy of the emails flick me your email address via PM and I'll forward them on. Am just sending a reply asking a few more questions.

People have only a few more hours to submit an objection to this potential removal of the current legal status for access to this part of the Ruahine Forest Park. Get writing.

If people need a few more ideas, feel free to look over my submission:

Road Stopping Proposal: Part of Opawe Road


I strongly object to the District Council proposal to Stop part of Opawe road.

I strongly object on the following grounds:

• In the council’s documentation on your web page headed up “ Road Stopping Proposal: Part of Opawe Road”, under the heading “ Background to road stopping” the sole reason given for this proposed action is that the adjoining land owner occupies this unformed legal road. This is the weakest excuse available for a District Council to undertake any legal action that reduces or restricts the public’s access to public land, that being the Unformed Legal Road itself and the Ruahine Forest park beyond.
• The District Councils’ own “Rural Area Vision Statement” identifies a Vision that “ offers outstanding recreational opportunities…” Any action that the district council takes to reduce, restrict or impede the publics access to recreational opportunities, by changing the legal status of the unformed legal road in question is in direct contradiction to your Rural Area Vision statement.
• The Unformed Legal Road in question: 1.2998ha adjoining or passing through Part Sections 9 and 10 Block XI Pohangina Survey District (RT WNB2/1185) shown as Section 1 on SO Plan 557632 (Part Opawe Road) has been in existence for at least one hundred years, if not longer. This legally defined public road has therefore been in existence, along its current alignment, and evidenced via cadastral information on any subsequent titles deposited with LINZ and its predecessors for any and all purchasers of any parcels of land that adjoin said boundaries of this unformed legal road and surrounding farmland.
It is therefore disingenuous of any previous or current land owner to proffer disruption to their farming practices as a reason to have this long standing unformed legal road Stopped. Previous and current land owners will have constructed rural dwellings and other farming infrastructure in close proximity to this unformed legal road in full awareness that this has always been a public piece of land with the legal standing of any formed legal roads, anywhere in NZ.
• As Public Servants, it is the responsibility of all District Council members to act in good faith, and to always act in the Publics’ best interests. Their (your) role is NOT to favour a small number of land owners at the expense of the Public’s RIGHT to access public land.

The only possible resolution

The only possible resolution that ensure the Publics’ rights of access to public land (this unformed legal road and the Ruahine Forest Park) is for the unformed legal road to be realigned to better suit both farming practices and the publics access to the unformed legal road. Fencing of the unformed legal road alignment would also be of benefit. However, the legal status of the unformed legal road MUST NOT BE DIMINISHED.
Changing the status of the unformed legal road to a Right of Way or some other such arrangement is tantamount to placing the land owner’s desires in front of the Public’s RIGHTS. Both current and the generations of walkers/trampers/hunters to come.


Long term user of the Ruahine Forest park
Beef Farmer
TAUPO

I plagiarised the shit out of XR500s "template" with a few additions.

and the sign off... "Another long-term user of the Ruahine Forest park and New Zealand, tax paying, Citizen. "

I was feeling all typy so i too plagiarized the shit out or mr XR500s template. Having had a horrible run in with a farmer i gotta say i don't give a shit about their want to keep the deer to themselves which is all this is really about (my 2c).

Flicked it to a few mates who seem to be online atm with a more brief abjection. hopefully a couple will type a few lines

My good mates response was so good i had to share:
(He got it in before 5pm too)

Dear Wendy Thompson,

I have read the proposal in detail and understand that an unformed legal section of Opawe Rd is proposed to be stopped and ownership transferred to the adjacent landowner, and that a nearby pedestrian-only easement be established as a foot-traffic route.

I emphatically object to the proposal on the grounds that:

1. A ULR provides much stronger legal protection of public rights of access to public property. Swapping a ULR for an easement is a very poor deal for the public.

2. It’s claimed that "The unformed road is not used as a vehicular road by the general public, but it is used for pedestrian access to the Ruahine Forest Park by hunters and walkers.”, which one can only assume is because the ULR is made inaccessed to vehicles by the adjoining property owner’s fencing and farming operations. The ULR could be developed in future to provide vehicular access.

3. A reason given for stopping the road is that "The unformed road is also occupied by the owner immediately adjoining the unformed road.” I would like to know when occupation has ever been a good reason to take property from the public and ut it into private ownership of the occupier. This is not how this country’s democracy works. Our public institutions do not exist to steal public property.

4. It is not stated why the proposal is being made; what the problems are for the public at present, and how it would benefit the public.

Overall this proposal is clearly not in the interest of the public. That it would be proposed at all strikes me as a gross miscarriage of the protection of public property.

I would appreciate your response to the above points and would suggest that a potential solution is to simply move the ULR to make it more accessible to the public and perhaps further away from the adjacent landowner’s dwelling, if those are issues.

Sincerely,
Member of the Public

I rang the district council this afternoon, to speak with Wendy.

The operator replied " Oh no, shes not been in her office, she's been in meetings all day over THAT road"

Certainly hope that indicates its no shoe-in

I've only just stumbled across this discussion, clearly too late to make a submission. I wasn't even aware the place existed and I lived in Ashhurst for 6 years.. some hunter I am!
I must go there and have a look on my next free weekend.

Update: The road stopping of Opawe road has failed

Guess they'll try again in another 10 years, thinking we may have forgotten.

We won't.